This issue's sections:

= Main Agenda items for 22nd

= Notices

= Some Events/Mtgs to Nov 28

= Nov 15th Ccl Mtg Notes (videotape in Library), see partial transcript  after Events section:

  - Streamkeepers' plea re mapping and protection of ephemeral creeks (but question re confirmation of same yet to be answered)

  - one of Cclr Durman's finest 'hours' expressing horrified reaction BPP has clearcut -- with staff permission and contrary to Ccl's intention as well as without their knowledge! -- area to be limbed and thinned BELOW school part to be made into public/green space, and wants monitoring and penalties (I completely agree with him! dreadful abuse or omission of process) and there will be a report  (see partial transcript in ccl mtg notes below)

- Yours Truly thanks him, reminds Ccl that I'd asked about a survey of trees there when they gave approval (ie before work started) but apparently that was not done; asks about calculation of 'uplift' [obviously one of many factors] as helpful in consideration of cmnty benefits (policy has still not come to Ccl) when increasing density/changing zoning for an applicant (see partial transcript in ccl mtg notes below); verifies new rules that three readings can be passed then bylaw advertised

= Abbreviated Nov 22nd Ccl mtg Agenda

= Quotation

Also understand there may be Open Houses by Millennium on Evelyn Drive devt Tues (23rd) and Thurs (25th)

=  2005 Budget Presentation (Input to Ccl Tuesday Night - see mtgs below)

===

Great to see such support of heritage and exciting for NV

Many constituents have contacted me regarding the stretch of Highway 1 just west of Capilano River since the terrible accident last week.  It would be premature to presume what actually happened.  I am asking residents, however, to provide me with their personal experiences on this section of the Upper Levels Highway, so that I may inform and advise the Minister of Transportation.

Please write to Ralph.Sultan.MLA@leg.bc.ca or #409 - 545 Clyde Avenue, West Vancouver, B.C., V7T 1C5.

Ralph Sultan, P.Eng., MLA, West Vancouver-Capilano

For sale on-line at www.eagleridgebluffs.ca

and also:

WV - Ambleside Brewery, Bean Around the World, Ferry Building Gallery, Haute Chocolate, Lens & Shutter, Pharmasave in Caulfeild, Valentine's for Hair

NV - 32 Books, Opus Framing, PK Automotive

City - Melriche's Coffeehouse (1244 Davie and 1043 Mainland)

Bowen - Phoenix Photography

For Further information, please contact:  Ernie Corlett at 604-921-5992

===

Actually she'd had her birthday August 6th during the Harmony Arts Festival so was 98 -- that means in her 99th year.  What a splendid life.  How lucky we were to have such a generous patron of the arts and of WV in particular.  The memorial will be on Sunday, Nov 28th, at the Kay Meek Centre for the Performing Arts and since seating limited to 500, please RSVP to Janik Chopin 981.1175 or 913 3634, or email janik@kaymeekcentre.com

= 8:30 - 10:30am = Arts & Culture Strategy Select Cmte, M Hall

= 7 - 10pm = Regular Ccl Mtg/2005 Department Budget Presentations (Live Broadcast), Ccl Chambers ***Budget item postponed to next week***  [See transcript of ccl mtg in section below]

= 3:30 - 5:30pm = Youth Advisory Cmte, M Hall

= 7:30pm = WRA - AGM, Gleneagles Community Centre

                Speaker:  Josie Chuback, Community Services Manager

= 5 - 7pm = WV Chamber of Commerce = Business After Business Networking Event, Sponsored by Members For Members, Chamber Boardroom

= 5:30 - 7:00pm = Finance Adv Cmte, Hall (Leases for non-profit groups on M land; Investments)

= 7 - 9pm = Public 2005 Budget Presentation by Staff, Seniors' Centre [staff there but hardly any public but about three other mtgs on at the same]

= 7 - 9pm = Board of Variance, Ccl Chambers (3390 Thompson Cr; 2115 Palmerston)

= 2 - 3:30pm = Library: "Finding Book Review For Your Book Club",  Registration Required, 925 7405

= 6 - 8pm = N.S. Family Court & Youth Justice Cmte,  CNV M Hall, Conf. Room A

= 7pm = WV 2010 Olympic/Paralympic Cmte - Community Focus Groups by invitation/RSVP

Fri/Sat: November 19-20, The City Program, SFU Vancouver (Harbourside)

Interest-Based Problem Solving for Urban Professionals: Negotiating Solutions and Relationships that Work; Fee $460; call 291 5079 for info

= 9 - 2pm = Annual Cranberry Faire at St Monica's (Nelson & Rosebery, HBay)

Christmas cafe, good-things table, Christmas baskets and decorations (921 9112)

= 3pm =  Northshore Wetland Partners at WV Youth Centre, Ambleside Park

= 10 - 4pm = Christmas Craft Fair at Cmnty Centre and Seniors' Activity Centre

= 8:30 - 10:30am = Arts & Culture Strategy Select Cmte, M Hall [CANCELLED - MOVED to Nov 29]

= 10 - 11:30am at the Library: Finding Reviews for Your Book Club (ph 925 7405)

= 4:30 - 6:30pm = Engg AC in Ccl Chamber [CANCELLED]

= 9am =  Sports & Rec Fac Planning Cmte mtg

= 7pm = BPAHA AGM in Sentinel Secondary Cafeteria

= 7 - 8:30pm = Bridging the Narrows: The Story of the Lions' Gate, illustrated presentation by Don Luxton, author (and I'd guess he'll have copies of his book there for you to buy an autographed copy!), at Museum & Archives (Gertrude Lawson House)  [exhibit - British Properties: A Community in the Making now in place]

=  DAC mtg moved to Dec 9

= 5 - 7pm = N.S.A.C.D.I - CNV Municipal Hall, Conf. Rm A

= 7 - 9pm = Evelyn Drive Open House, Cedardale School: new info (six storeys?)

= 1 - 3pm = "Tracing Your Family Tree" at Museum (GL House), by Lorraine Irving, BC Genealogical Society

Fee: $25; Age: 16 and up

= 2pm = Memorial for Kay Meek at Performing Arts Centre, 1700 Mathers, please RSVP as indicated above in NOTICES

PLEASE NOTE:  THIS DRAFT TRANSCRIPT IS TYPED DURING MTG, always check with tape b/c impossible to catch everything.

~7pm start (times given so if you watch tape you can select portion)

Before commencement, the Mayor read a tribute to Kay Meek and recited the long list of organizations and projects (VSO, Academy of Music, seawall, Dundarave Pier, WV Fdn, and a host of others) she supported so generously.  She died the same evening as the opening performance at the  Kay Meek Centre for the Performing Arts at the age of 98.  A service will be held at the Centre on Sunday Nov 28 at 2pm.

2.         APPROVAL OF AGENDA -- changes to 5.4 (pages 137 - 140) and addition of 4.1a, Upper Levels safety; moving items of Correspondence to action items.

3.         ADOPTION OF MINUTES - Council Meeting Minutes, Oct 25 and Nov 01

4.         DELEGATIONS

4.1       J. Van Luven, St. James Community Service Society, regarding North Shore Youth Safe House

[statistical review attached to report]

2003, 73 youth, 36% boys; this year so far 68 youth so far, 50-50 M/F; av age 18 last year, 17 this year

average stay eight days, some stay a matter of hours

family conflict, youth left or got kicked out

from detox or left another shelter

2003 refused 11 youth access to the house, eight for inappropriate referrals

this year turned away 22 and 13 for safety concerns, mostly use of / addiction to crystal meth

runaway, couch-surfer -- all in statistics

longest stays more successful

[JF asked how defined and what next

MMgr said will discuss whether through grant process or budget]

VD: problem crystal meth, didn't quite understand

Ans: safety of the house = ppl with crystal meth not admitted in

danger is between ten and 14 days after stopping

VD: b/c become violent?

Ans: yes

VD: to?

Ans: violent to the other residents

G-J: asked mbr of Ccl to join and I did; learned a lot

people fanned out to help this girl right away; place to live, helped with university educ, Soroptimists help; small cmnty

know how effective it is; know some of the children here

statistics hugely helpful; if you cd supply them quarterly wd help

[motion of] thanks

7:30

5.         REPORTS

Dir/Engg: brought forward b/c of the tragic accident

looking for ways to address

VD: before we start, our condolences to the family

I was asked by a mbr of the press to comment -- clear I wasn't commenting on the crash, that's for police however I've lived on the NSh for going on 30 years and have driven that numerous times and it is dangerous.  Amazing how many cut that corner, going over the line.

secondly

Capilano intersection, ppl enter slowly; ppl who regularly use this, truckdrivers, generally pull into left lane and then cut back around the corner but if traffic on both sides of them they can't

Police today said this year there have been 34 accidents between Westview and Taylor Way

barrier to stop people going through

opinions vary: camber, hill, speeding

The Minister contacted me on Friday said it was a safe bend, no one killed there in ten years; surprised how defensive he was

just asked staff to look at: wider, better lighting, or--

work with Min of Hwys

Sop: probs like planing heading west on a rainy day

some years ago improved, bridge, put up concrete barriers

it still is a corner heading east that is very severe, comes up quickly and signage not proper

evident from many people I've talked to

it's one thing to say it's safe -- if a bit over speed will be pulled in one direction or another

the other day, sad as it is, have to work harder and harder

hope govt will come up with a solution

RD: support; think we shd include NV, some of the most dangerous spots on their side

accident took place just over the line; encourage the Minister to speak to NV and WV

drove it almost every day for 38 years; that section very poorly patrolled from Second Narrows; WV patrolled very well but RCMP doesn't -- understand they're short 14 for hwy patrol

G-J: driving the US hwys, trucks have to travel more slowly

tragedy for this family; won't let them down; make that hwy as safe as possible

Mayor: thank councillors; was in Calgary found out about it from TV

VD: I will excuse myself for a (potential) conflict of interest; I am a board mbr of a public company that is the second largest seniors' housing developer in Canada and I note one of the uses the Planning Dept is suggesting for this is srs' housing.

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

[gave background]

purchased from Endowment Fund

Staff report: looked at various uses

in staff's opinion shd be residential or mixed commercial/residential

ht restrictions, density, go out for bids

prior to Ccl consideration, put out to adv cmtes, to public for comment by mid-Dec

RD: we purchased in 2001 for $5.56m and thought might need for rec purposes but may not need it but will have to return money to the Fund

G-J: for alternative forms of single-fam housing

wd like to see a new model of resid enclave; by park, but through over to the school or swimming pool; looking for a walkable quieter --

like to see that concept

relative to that, q about Gordon Ave travel study

SJN: N D Lea, consultants, starting study; report that they've been retained and timetable will come to Ccl; anticipate that will take the next couple of months and involving residents

G-J: there are single-family residents already there

don't want to see much more than three storeys

Sop: like also to have it passed on the the Parks and Env Cmte [PEAC]

we cd do a lot without affecting that park

wd not like to make a decision until vetted by public

I don't see it as a high area devt; it has to fit the area

don't know if shd be housing or not; wait and see what [public/cmtes] comes up with

JF: seems more practical to PEAC once know what's there

Section 3 -- those principles very good; .....adjacent, pivotal.....; financial

we paid owner for "highest and best use" so hope get back what we borrowed

consider what that means

Mayor: acquired, whole purpose was to control the use of this particular piece property

hope a profit, want to realize our investment

JF: while Fulton has sing-fam homes there are condominiums across and along Ave; interesting nbrhd

G-J: wasn't on Ccl when bought and realize pay back Endowment Fund but important b/c Ccl owns the land, opp to show slightly increased density that can fit in

wd be easy to show a huge profit; but see how new form of housing can be in centre of WV

maximize that for the public good

Sop: on p 5; residential, cmnty use, civic centre use, rental, sp needs -- it's all around housing

we can also make a statement in another direction

make that money and more, doesn't necessarily have to be housing

RECOMMENDED:

THAT the November 04, 2004 report of the Director of Planning, Lands and Permits titled  "Wetmore Lands - Proposed Use and Disposition" be referred to the Planning Advisory Committee for review and advice on overall use, to the Design Advisory Committee on urban design considerations and to the public with a request for comment prior to December 15, 2004.

PASSED

7:53

5.2       Wetmore Motors 2003 Ltd. - Licence Agreement - 2203 Marine Drive

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

RECOMMENDED: be received.

SJN: for continued occupation

7:55

5.3       Information Report on Lower Mainland Treaty Advisory Committee (LMTAC) Correspondence regarding "Fiscal Interests and Treaty Negotiations" and "Agricultural Land Reserve and Additions to Treaty Settlement Lands"

Designated Presenter:  Director of Administrative Services

RECOMMENDED: received for information

RB: info on fiscal interest

No 36 provides no cost to Ms

land transferred to First Nations cd impact on revenues

ALR changes; to enable farm use; Bill 27, May 2004, outlined a new process if agreement reached in principle

no provision for First Nations to consult with parties affected [eg Ms]

re Treaty Settlement Lands No 12 - local govt no transfer of fee simple; land use zoning negative impact; does not protect BC owners; this is not a willing buyer willing seller scenario

Lobby for consistent throughout BC

concern re pace of negotiations

JF is LMTAC rep and she may wish to comment

RECEIPT PASSED

JF: very, very interesting circumstances our attention drawn to

Cmte of a colln of Ms who have banded together to discuss with negotiators (prov and fed govts) to try to understand what is going on.

First principles Mr Beauchamp mentioned have not been endorsed but are those of that cmte

Impact for example the Tsawwassen Band can ask parcels it wd like to be added so if you own land adjacent can be ceded; tantamount to expropriation but will have effect on value, some encumbrance

Considering prov govt committed to no fee simple, feel it's a contravention

will read from the press release:

not a willing buyer willing seller and not in BC property[owners'] interest

serious concerns to Minister Plant b/c of short time line

important what sort of precedence, in Delta, sets

really don't understand, want resolution

urge you to avail yourself of this information -- see website

will make a copy available to the press; perhaps have them printed in the regional newspapers

VD: ev shd also understand this item is on the agenda b/c of the concern of the chairman of LMTAC and of what might happen

Mayor Drew is not particularly excitable; press release must mean important

at the table only prov/fed/First Nations

LMTAC there only to give advice

I've sat through a GVRD bd mtg and the fed govt negotiator refused to answer any questions (since GVRD not at table)

most of these negotiations are going on behind closed doors; much info to LMTAC passed on there so not able to pass on to you

this is like a fire bell going off

anyone reading this -- it will put you to sleep very fast

basically the Tsawwassen Band is changing the deal

Prov govt has said no freehold land wd be affected but now allowing Bands to indicate what lands they wd like to buy

they have ten years and if they want your land no one else will want it so affects value

taxation lost to M and prov yet to come up with any formula to make up for loss of that revenue

eg if Sq Nation were to indicate it wd like to buy Park Royal North, adjacent so they own South, it wd be a great loss

at Remembrance Day, our MP said going through Parliament, treaty with Sq; when I said presume that part wd be taken out but it says cannot be

Many don't understand what's going on

Fed govt trying to get out of Indian biz and will do whatever they can

for ex the Fisheries down on Marine Drive -- if given to Band, out of our control

out of planning

JC: native bands will be identifying land all over hell's half acre without restraint

an absolute nightmare

next 30 - 40 years, hate to think what might happen

shame

G-J: add to motion add WV's support to principles, not just receiving this

readiness to negotiate but [needs] mechanism of consultation with non-aboriginal interests

we are at table and we are interested

policy issues need resolving

JF: whatever the protocols may be, the LMTAC chair has been writing letters to the prov govt for months with no response

in that case all the protocols in the world are to no avail

VD: anyone watching TV last night wd have seen Michael Harcourt and Jack Weisgerber saying all Ms going along and all happy; wonder if any have gone out and talked to any councillors

taken a high view of success rate

one going well, and hope all will go well, who doesn't want it to go properly/happily

send this to other districts in BC b/c I think once councillors start to talk to each other -- we do and we are concerned

public not up to speed, don't understand

or nothing we can do

Mayor: make a separate motion

VD: copy of our report to ev regional district and M in BC

8:21

Designated Presenter:  Director of Administrative Services

re commercial facilities having effect on residences nearby (cleaning, restaurants, etc)

staff has attached a policy as to when applied

JC: 2.1 applies to restaurants, why not say noise/etc from businesses but what if it's a gas station

D/AS: staff considered that, consulted with solicitor, and felt regulated by other statutes, but that cd be altered

JC: p 141, second line under 2.1

just below there under C, must be recurring over ten days, that appears to be loose, doesn't refer to frequency

D/AS: discussion on that too, in ten days cd take action

JC: just one or two?

D/AS: more than one but more than one during a ten-day period

VD: does the inspector have to see, hear, smell twice in ten days?

D/AS: a resident cd, or staff cd observe

the issue of fairness, selection of ten days

Mayor: intent we're relying on nbrs re occurrence

VD: like sound/noise bylaw

nobody ever did anything b/c by the time bylaw officer/police turned out, noise had stopped

worried about that they occur after office hours, wee hours, and difficult to find a bylaw officer in wee hours standing on their balcony listening to noise/smelling

D/AS: now ability to make more inspections; and wd rely on declarations

VD: concerned about restaurant b/c bodyshops fully regulated but what about a restaurant preparing food for off-site sales -- he'd claim, I'm not a restaurant.  Preparing for fellow down the road, I'm not a restaurant, he is

will have to broaden your definition

JC: we're changing word to businesses

and will be changed in bylaw as well

following up, says written complaint wd strike that, cd be by phone

D/AS: intent is for staff to follow up; declaration, staff wd have to verify complaint

Mayor: written or verbal?

MMgr: I'd be concerned if relying only on verbal complaint

it wd be merely hearsay

although the verbal complaint can trigger, need some sort of written [for court]

JC: if waiting for written, odour, sound cd be long gone

MMgr: cd trigger it; need written [later]

Sop: haven't had this in past, now residents can complain and we can act

a lot of staff time spent

G-J: liable for a penalty of $10K so asking for it to be in writing is not too much to ask

RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first, second and third time.

RECOMMENDED: be posted and advertised in accordance with the Community Charter.

CARRIED

8:33

5.5       Open Tube Neon lighting for Handi Restaurant, 1340 Marine Drive

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

Sop: was it not our position in WV to use behind glass?  and no flashing neon tubes (though this is not flashing)

signs staring you right in the eyes as you come off the bridge at Pk Royal

not saying this isn't a nice sign

but my question is that if we didn't support this, wd it come down?

SJN: yes

VD: wd you have made this rec if it hadn't gone through?

SJN: yes

VD: you must have recommended against in past

SJN: don't know why allowed behind the window in past and not in front

maybe b/c garish but exceptions allowed if approved by DAC and Ccl

[but staff] RECOMMENDED:  be approved.

G-J: this is a tiny little sign

it's not the same as the big Future Shop sign

JF: I'm the Ccl liaison for DAC and direct you to p 145, look under 4.3 that not only did DAC support but they further moved a policy (reviewed) -- allowed in Vancouver

change in cmnty taste and attitude

will not be supporting but wd like to make a subsequent motion re reviewing the sign bylaw

Sop: for all the good work the cmtes do, they don't make policy, Ccl does

how many times are people going to break the law

ev time someone comes forth

Design Panel doesn't care if breaks the law or not; they can come back

RD: we cd turn this down and have them come back later, cost them; favour change bylaw

JC: I will be supporting this motion, I agree sign bylaw shd be reviewed and said a year ago we'd do that

some months back someone wanted a backlit sign and we turned it down

this was put up without a permit, shd take it down, review policy, and they can come back

VD: was going to support approval b/c DAC had recommended it

but will now support this motion

TIE [Sop, JC, VD voting not approved]

Mayor broke tie voting against not approving saying he'd looked at sign and not intrusive

the Hollyburn we turned down was a whole series of signs

then

can we add staff revisit?

MMgr: Ccl has already asked staff to review, just a matter of adding open neon tubing, and review

[MOTION was SPLIT]

TIE [RD, JF, G-J voting approved]

then MOTION FOR REVIEW OF SIGN BYLAW

VD can we not have a date b/c we've spoken of this for some time?

MMgr: don't want to pick one out of the air; we will report back.

8:47

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

SJN: re covered walkway; want roof wider than 6ft

retention of existing unauthorized accessory bldg not built by this owner

set back 2'6" not 4

house is on heritage inventory, support list

provision for [documentation/photographs?]

RECOMMENDED:

THAT The Municipal Clerk give notice that Development Variance Permit Application No. 04-021 (2863 Bellevue Avenue), which would provide for a new accessory building and covered walkway and retention of an existing accessory building will be considered at the meeting of Council on Monday, December 06, 2004.

CARRIED

8:49

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

SJN: for ex-service station; referred to PAC and DAC and both recommended to Ccl so now to public for consideration

Bruce McArthur, 6345 Nelson: wd like to make sure as this goes forward that the public benefit for the increase in the land value is clear to everybody

don't know what's included

there was some talk about burying, underground wiring

want to make sure what the public benefit is

SJN: devt of Horseshoe Bay not highest profit biz area

public benefit includes wider sidewalks, landscaping, guarantee no charge for parking below

have looked at electrical wiring on Royal Ave; wd result in elimination of two poles and another pole put in

advised $250K today (but report says $150K)

recommend that it be dealt with on a shared basis

rec that info be provided to public at public hearing

BA: understand those benefits re owner but this is Esso and shd somehow be involved in providing benefit

RD made motion:

RECOMMENDED: introduced and read a first time in short form.

and

said: PAC gave it high praise

on waterfront, encourage devt in a healthy way

great deal of support already, mtg at Yacht Club, about 80 people and all in favour

Sop: wd like to ask Mr Nicholls if architect or planning staff brought forth a view, uh wrt viewing

well-designed bldg

what are we going to see in HBay -- slope higher?

how do we get a vision of corridor view? shd it be part of this proposal?

SJN: both

we have requested and received from architect info re view corridors

quite level

don't expect behind, including motel, have to go over

info at public hearing

VD: building in front, once you do it once, will go all down the street

is that a good idea

BMcA re OCP

SJN: three-storey bldg in this area is not significant

precedence of this corner -- wd be a catalyst for rejuvenation (since was gas station)

VD: interesting; three or four years ago against Ferry Corp three storeys but now this height okay

SJN: don't feel fair [comparison]

great deal of discussion and wider [landscaping?] --

VD: I fully remember the fight and surprised we're now told good planning for equal height.

RD made motion

RECOMMENDED: THAT Zoning Bylaw No. 2200, 1968, Amendment Bylaw No. 4408, 2004 and

Development Permit No. 04-015, both dealing with 6390 Bay Street, be considered at a concurrent Public Hearing and Public Meeting to be held on Monday December 06, 2004 at 7:00 pm in the Municipal Hall Council Chamber.

9pm

5.8       Sewer and Drainage Utility Fee Bylaw No. 3749, 1992 Amendment Bylaw No. 4411, 2004

Designated Presenter:  Director of Finance

This is for budget

RECOMMENDED:

RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first and second time.

Sop: recommended a consistent amount in the budget b/c can't do all at once

assuming the increase you're applying here is based on the idea that we're keeping consistent with that plan -- do we find we have to go to a higher amount to meet the needs

RL: believe referring to a pay-as-you-go and included

this includes operating costs for system breaks b/c what we have been short each year over the past several years

Sop: are we not fixing some of the breaks as we go along? since 2000?

Raymond Fung of Engg Dept:  the capital program has built into it some ramping effect

for recent years 2004 - 7, the replacement program is flat at $850K before ramping up; we've been noticing recently higher than expected breaks -- we have to attend to them, can't ignore

also higher than expected lift station expenses

the increase requested is to address these repairs

Sop: then handle on it in 2007?  not handled in six years?

RF: as we go, we have been keeping up but have seen increase in some of the metals

we are barely keeping up

Sop: why are we having an increase in water

D/Engg: GVRD was 12%

5.9       Waterworks Regulation Bylaw No. 3859, 1994, Amendment Bylaw No. 4406, 2004

Designated Presenter:  Director of Finance:

this is 2% more than plan

reflects reduced expectation from Eagle Lake source

anticipates fully metered systems

to year end, shortfall of $78K, result of less water from Eagle Lake [dry weather]

Sop: so Eagle Lake didn't provide the water we expected

but why increase 2%

D/Fin: increase of 2% is entirely due to revised estimates of Eagle Lake

Sop: so are we at the mercy of the weather all the time?

D/Fin: Mr Fung can respond but some studies underway wrt capacity and ability to get through dry

MMgr: when we presented study to Ccl, was consumption and how much drawing on GVRD

this is just more conservative estimate after seeing another set of numbers...

RF: haven't quite achieved the targets we expected

long term weather change or a blip??

just decided to base our projections on our most recent experience

we are embarking on a study

climate change; hope further refinement in our answer

RECOMMENDED:  THAT water rates for the year 2005 be increased by seven [per cent] (7%) to all categories of users, applied with rounding to the net of discount amount.

RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first and second time.

9:15

Designated Presenter:  Director of Finance

RL, Dir/Fin: agreement with Neptune Technologies for $6,850K

recovered by an annual charge from homeowners; they'll benefit hopefully [sic] from lower water bills

G-J: a really big step

at the GVRD water cmte mtg last week

research showing consumers interested in water [conservation]

water will be like your heating bill -- up to you how much you use

in Seattle and Sydney they have second and third tier pricing (twice and five times as much in summer)

only way we can control use

important in shifting attitudes

VD: note the cost of borrowing money is 6.75 and note we have a letter from the board I sit on (Ontario) and borrowing at 4% so feel staff is being conservative

assumption borrowing rates going up next six or seven months

this is clearly a good idea for WV

with Eagle Lake dam/water and metering, will be less money --

JF: can't recall how many years anticipated before paid off metering?

D/Fin: 15 years

JF: a bargain

VD: MFA repays debts faster, it's not inconceivable inform us two to three years ahead

D/Fin: ev single issue we've had outstanding has been repaid two or three years earlier

MMgr: again we're being very conservative

Sop: PowerSmart, what's to educate? just bill itself?

D/Fin: starts this year

RF: when we introduced the water strategy it included a whole range of initiatives

shower heads, etc

biz case wd have to prove itself out individually

taking advantage of grants -- we do have a toilet rebate program

the subscription rate has not been as great as we had hoped

this gives more profile, looking a costs and benefits, will presenting to Ccl

Sop: someone called me having renovations and asked what was going on about the meter

RF: there'll be an extensive information program: letters, mtgs, doorknockers, suggestions on how to reduce your water bill

integral to success

VD: recall debate, huge amount of water being used by a small number of users

RF: something like the top sixth of our users consume about 30% of the water

VD: we all have gas and electricity meters so we all understand what they do

buy at cheaper rate, if excessive, at a higher rate with a penalty

Sop: we've always prided ourselves with pay-as-you-go.

haven't done this for a long time

any alternative?

D/Fin: er--

Sop: proud of paying

look at bill

going to take care of itself over time

but GVRD

D/Fin: we'll be able to answer that question in 2007

Sop: point of order

we're in discussion

Mayor: answer is we'll know in 2007?

[yes]

maybe not all of the $75 but cheaper by meter than flat rate

RF: see reduction; if they did not modify their use when metering, they'd incur a higher water bill

up to 40 - 50% will see about the same.

RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first, second and third time.

PASSED

Designated Presenter:  Director of Planning, Lands & Permits

end of Falcon; use by nbr; inaccessible to public; park was a nature preserve

Enquiries if near Butterfly Park but it isn't, it's cliff face

funds go into a park acquisition fund

RECOMMENDED:

THAT the report dated October 29, 2004 from the Municipal Clerk regarding Certification of Elector Approval re Alternative Approval Process - Park Disposal Bylaw No. 4363, 2004 be received.

This bylaw received third reading at the September 13, 2004 Council Meeting.

RECOMMENDED: THAT "Park Disposal Bylaw No. 4363, 2004" be adopted. [DONE]

6.         BYLAWS

Designated Presenter:  Fire Chief

This bylaw received third reading at the November 01, 2004 Council Meeting.

RECOMMENDED: be adopted.

9:36

7.         REPORTS FROM MAYOR AND COUNCILLORS

---

VD: you, Mr Mayor, and I went to service at Mulgrave with Japanese students

moving experience

next day at Library

went to Kay Meek for African Children's and was amazed at the performance

money they were raising  -- educating 3000 in Uganda and 3000 in Sudan; now for AIDS victims in Africa, now about 11m

went to Park Visioning at Srs' Ctr and disappointed [about?] Gleneagles Adventure

Sop: 142 parks

JC: 141 now!

VD: changing daily

obviously Amb Park falls into Parks Dept; cmnty centre another cmte; and adv another group

what are we going to do with these parks

some looked after by residents

better use of staff's and public's time asking what we shd do

amalgamate them? dispose of them in some manner?

---

JF: attended sev events

Wed morning WVCC, sweet breakfast, speaker from Purdy's

her father bought the company in 1963

to Seattle and found local chocolate companies do well locally

Sees in Seattle, Laura Secord in east

but she has been able to break into east, two or three companies elsewhere

-

room in Srs' Centre between 5 and 6:30 debating Parks and Open Spaces

several commenting on how hardworking staff were

-

attended NSh Assn for the Mentally Handicapped third annual breakfast; very touching

what it's like, a parent having three autistic children

respite from care

one having a child now an adult living independently

---

then from HAC to there to Open House; dealt not just with parks but with env, culture, etc

found it quite rewarding

Remembrance Day ceremonies, nice/rare to be in sunshine

never seen such a large crowd

---

G-J: you, Mr Mayor, and I went to Bahai Awards; congratulations also to Mr Newman

and the winner was Mr Harold Lincke who donated the Friendship Globe [at Dundarave Pier]

they spoke about the power of the individual

wd recommend anyone to go to that event -- very mixed crowd

if you live in Brit Props you shd go to that exhibit [now at Museum] -- shd have one for every nbrhd, that's how you get people out

and tomorrow night, Tuesday

---

JC: [Remembrance Day] growing event 2 - 3000 people

Legion put it on, but maybe something we cd do?

it's a cmnty event

Help them with the sound system

MMgr: will see

---

8.         OTHER ITEMS

9:50

8.1       Correspondence [full list in previous WVM issue]

...

8.1.18             O. Syberg and J. Robitaille, October 24, 2004, regarding trimming of trees by 282 Stevens Drive

                        Referred to Director of Parks and Community Services for consideration and response in consultation with the Director of Administrative Services.

...

8.1.21             Undated 19-name petition re closure of brake check on Upper Levels Hwy near Caulfeild exit

                        Referred to Director of Engineering and Transportation  for consideration and response.

..

8.2       Lower Mainland Treaty Advisory Committee (LMTAC) Concerns and Pace of Negotiations - Tsawwassen Treaty Table Correspondence from R. Drew, Mayor, Chair, Lower Mainland Treaty Advisory Committee dated November 05, 2004 regarding LMTAC Concerns and Pace of Negotiations - Tsawwassen Treaty Table.

RECOMMENDED:  THAT

Sop: re 8.1.21

resident said [staff says] it appears to meet with bylaw but a consultant said it did not

D/Eng: not on our prop, on prov

Sop:that corner v bad; much consultation about where put and how quickly it happened?

MMgr: before Mr Barth's time; parking problem; you'll recall BC Ferries made changes and one was removal of brake check, and a condition we asked was to relocate it

consider safety so this is one of the few locations possible (has to be flat, etc)

BC Ferries wasn't excited about having to pay, and Hwys has washed their hands of it -- if noise problem not needed so not going to pay

We feel we need a brake check from safety point of view; we may have to....

Sop: is Mr Barth going to go address

Garth: yes each one

MMgr: alternative to remove it, unlikely to find another place

9:54

JF: query re letter re LMTAC and motion

JC: letter 8.1.18: nbrs talking about nbrs at 282 cutting trees and dumping refuse on M property

are you familiar with that situation up there?

hedge

KP, Dir/Parks: first record in 1994 and it has been going on

will look into this; we're attending to it

JC re 8.1.26 discussing parking situation around old/new IGA store

spoke to site superintendent and he was told he was not a babysitter

workers were to park in church's lot but they're parking in street (where residents park)

MMgr: we're looking into that and what the arrangement is.

9:57

Mayor: 5.3?

JF: made motion re Tsawwassen above

support

VD: I'd like to add to Min Plant and to all other municipalities

want to make sure

Mayor: did 5.3 cover other municipalities?

SSch: read out that motion

VD: don't think that's quite what

to me, the more the merrier

Mayor: you're suggesting a third?

VD: Min Plant, Ms, and copy of letter to Ms to Plant as well

PASSED

10pm so motion to extend

9.         PUBLIC QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS

---

Helene Swann: wrt location of two signs on Mathers Ave wrt no parking on Mathers Court

Mayor: address

HS: on Chesterfield in NV

to a garage sale

first time in my life got a parking ticket

sign on corner

Police said 32 tickets that day

parallel rather than angled to driver

WV Sr School craft sale this Sat, ask signs be angled

can that be done so don't have to go to court

RD: did you win in court?

HS: pleased to say charges dropped b/c bylaw officer didn't turn up

---

Sop: prior to going away, I went up to area being developed behind Collingwood School

walked with Mr Thorneloe and McLean, pools

this is a starting process

really well done

filled in, same channel, very effective what they did

congratulate you on coming forth; will face that as we go along

VD: Cclr Sop saw some very good work done by BPP, however if you go further along where Ccl gave permission for some tree thinning (where the school was going to be and a playground), lengthy discussion

Ccl gave approval to remove some, thin some, create playfield and below parklike area

asked mbr of staff about this, why, and answer given was to clear to Ccl viewline [approved] wd hv to top trees

since we don't recommend topping trees, told developer to remove them

it's exactly opposite to what Ccl Sop saw

go up there now and it's an absolute, the ultimate green disaster area; trees all lying down, [soil] all churned up, in pouring rain water running wherever

I'm just curious as to why Ccl wasn't told why every tree was going to be removed with only four left

MMgr: I've asked for a staff report with illustrations  --

VD: I'm very concerned that Ccl didn't understand in the report given to us the destruction of the trees prior to [our] approving it

don't think any of us intended a clearcut

[thought] some limbing, some windowing

instead, got an absolute clearcut

got phone calls saying why did you allow this

drove up there and was horrified

apparently done with staff's approval

RD: where?

VD: above 1000ft road/connector

forest -- gave approval for a view corridor over or through those trees

RD: I remember that

We understood at the time they wd clear the school site but not the area below

are the trees intact there?

VD: no

MMgr: involved elevation measurement

when applied, staff thought small trees wd be left

but if you took out the trees above elevation proposed

the proposal of those up to 75ft wd remain

perhaps where erred, when devpr went in, and cleared that site, removed more than we expected

maybe good intention, hasn't worked out

MMgr: watercourse

G-J: been a while, wonder when

MMgr: believe referred to PEAC, will check when

G-J: how are riparian regulations going with prov

and MOU signed with them

Streamkeepers is making a good point

streams an organizing principle around wch

MMgr: Mr Jenkins is on holiday this week; will get back

make sure every t crossed and i dotted so get what we wanted

MMgr: as part of the devt review process identified not adequate monitoring resources

have just added a staff mbr expressly on that, looking what happening in field; shd assist us

good point and will be reporting to Ccl

---

Mayor: hindsight --

old growth; if it wd be looked at first

Mayor: had been logged

no oldgrowth

CR: [but that means no thorough study of area done prior as I'd hoped]

btw, didn't hear an answer to Mr Hamilton's question

Mayor: tonight?

MMgr: understand report --

CR hoped ephemeral creeks wd be mapped and protected, then asked:

earlier tonight a bylaw had first, second, and third readings

then ref to cmnty charter

does Cmnty Ch mean can have three readings [and then be advertised]?

wrt Wetmore going to DAC

had heard about this

what's going to DAC b/c if Ccl hasn't decided what was going to be there

if Ccl hasn't decided what there, how can comment on design?

SJN: maybe greater setbacks, from Marine Drive

DAC has requested if going out for design proposal, go to them before going out

certain design parameters

they may choose not to comment

CR design parameters, thx for clarification

wrt to [uplift for rezoning; increase in value/appraisal change]

Mayor: In H Bay

CR: know Cclr G-J and others have asked about the cmnty benefit policy

not out yet

if only $10K can't ask much

if $400, then can ask for more

the Planner has answered about some of the benefits

MMgr: it's a bit more complicated than that

may be devt costs

will be looking at cmnty benefit, will be bringing something in next couple of weeks

more complex than cost

other benefits

CR: of course; not just referring to that, people will have many ideas of benefits

am sure other

understand it's complex, Vancouver does it all the time

perhaps new, early days, perhaps processes not in place

Mayor: doesn't happen in Vancouver and don't imagine it'll happen here

just apply a percentage to value of property as benefit --

each negotiated on merit

SJN: we will be reporting to Ccl; we have done a survey of Ms in the mainland

very few have a policy for cmnty benefits

only applies downtown, not in city, so wdn't apply in an area like H Bay

but am sure all try to achieve benefit

but the uplift technique only applies to downtown where it has high density and also allows for transfer of density for heritage, ...

we'll try to achieve best cmnty benefits under circumstances

great, thx

---

Bruce McArthur: a couple of Qs

figure of 10% of electors required for disapproval

Mayor: for park?

BMcA: no for a bylaw

...

SJN: 3,216

BMcA: how determined?  change ev week?

SJN:  time of petition; move out, die; page-long formula

BMcA: thank you; curious how done

earlier you mentioned park acquisition fund, substantial?

how much is in it?  just the $22,600 now?

SJN: not sure

Mayor: Dir of Finance?  Parks?

[nope]

... we'll get back to you on that.

Adjournment at 10:28

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3.         ADOPTION OF MINUTES - No items presented.

4.1       D. Zeitler, regarding Ambleside Business Area

4.2       R. Kinar, regarding Council Support for Sport Helmet Safety Standards

5.2       2003 Drinking Water Quality Annual Report (File:  1815-09)

RECOMMENDED:

THAT the report dated November 02, 2004 from the Manager, Utilities regarding the 2003 Drinking Water Quality Annual Report be received for information.

RECOMMENDED:

THAT "Waterworks Regulation Bylaw No. 3859, 1994, Amendment Bylaw 4398, 2004" be introduced and read a first, second and third time.

This bylaw received third reading at the November 15, 2004 Council Meeting.

RECOMMENDED:  THAT "Water Meter Loan Authorization Bylaw No. 4407, 2004" be adopted.

8.1.1         Committee and Board Meeting Minutes

(a)             Arts and Culture Strategy Select Committee, September 27, 2004

(b)             Arts and Culture Strategy Select Committee, October 12, 2004

(c)             Sports and Recreation Facilities Planning Select Cmte of Council, October 13, 2004

8.1.2         L. G. Leonard, November 09, 2004, regarding closure of Shaw Studios

8.1.3         D. Marshall, Executive Director, Fraser Basin Council, regarding sponsoring a sustainability champion to the 2004 State of the Fraser Basin Conference

===  Action Required  ===

8.1.4         J. F. Philip, November 03, 2004, regarding bears being a problem in Altamont                   Referred to Director of Parks and Community Services for consideration and response.

8.1.5         E. Rapaport, November 07, 2004, regarding increased sightings of black bears in the Burhill Road area

                  Referred to Director of Parks and Community Services for consideration and response.

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Autumn is a second spring when every leaf is a flower.

                                -- Albert Camus, writer and philosopher (1913-1960)