Calendar to Apr 22

by Carolanne Reynolds, Editor

My Dear Readers,
Well, no ccl mtg or WVM last week  so this is a two-week, ie double, issue.
Settle back in your chair with a glass of scotch/wine/beer/juice so at least you're physically relaxed as you read this snapshot of DWV's governing practices.
Pleasantly surprised to see my photo (and relieved not terrible, no reflection on the photographer rather my reluctance to admit aging) on the front of OUTLOOK, Thursday Apr 12th, a rather hectic day as you'll see.  The article was on N Shore council watchers and I'm sure you're familiar with the need for govt to be watched and who guards the guards.  The press is precious; essential for reporting so an informed vote.
For me the increased secrecy and removal of information has reached a tipping point as you see in "Citizens in the Dark" below.  The contrast with the proclamations of openness during the Apr 2nd ccl mtg was, I'm afraid to say, too much for me to bear.
Incredibly for me, as the examples mounted, two more came to mind not referred to in this newsletter: The Housing Dialogue met a couple of weeks ago and I found out by chance a few days ago (nbrhd character is always highest on resident surveys of what is important and there was no announcement they'd meet and still no indication they have!); someone referred to a WV Sports Advisory Forum mtg held end of March -- I knew nothing about it (to put in my Calendar) and a couple of cclrs I spoke with didn't know it existed.
If Ccl starts to let the public know when and where mtgs are held, as well as according them respect so that if they have relevant facts and can supplement expertise they'll be permitted to speak, you'll see ready acknowledgement and praise here.
The present state is intolerable.
With your help, it is my hope that the charade of changing names to avoid compliance with legislation will be ended.  It's an affront to our intelligence, not to mention our view of how our govt works.
We need more councillors of good will and words put into action.
Aside from that, pls avail yourself of updated budget material since we only have a couple of weeks to make our views known to Ccl so they can take them into consideration when they make their decision on raising the tax rates......

= MAIN ITEMS Cmte of Whole Agenda Apr 16: BUDGET 2007 (some info to be supplied 'on-table'!  We're still getting info!); Morven Parking (Collingwood); Correspondence List (well, what they've decided we cd see)
= Vive le Canada (Vimy); CULTUREWATCH (Theatre/Book/Webwatch of Animals); INFObits; WVPD UPDATE; Calendar to Apr 22nd;
= Ccl Mtg Apr 2nd NOTES:
Lack of Notice for WG/Cmte mtgs; Cmnty (DIS)engagement cmte; Draft Five-Year Capital Plan (from $40M set in stone for ten years, now more than twice as much for five years!); Questions re closed mtgs not complying with in camera legislation and re adoption of Ev Dr Bylaws;
followed by
examples of NONnotification of WG mtgs (Apr 6, 9, and 12), and the straw that broke the camel's back, CITIZENS in DARK -- PARADISE LOST?
= VIMY (wasn't open/democracy one of the concepts we were fighting for?);
= Apr 16th AGENDA; Quotations

ANNOUNCEMENT by PM Stephen Harper; April 3, 2007; Ottawa:
"The Battle of Vimy Ridge was a critical victory for the Allies in the First World War and it was an important milestone for Canada.  Our young country came of age as an independent nation that day and I am extremely proud to represent Canada at the 90th anniversary."
Prime Minister Harper will be accompanied by his wife, Laureen, and their two children, Rachel and Benjamin. In July of last year, the Prime Minister and Mrs. Harper visited the gravesite in northern France of her great uncle, Private James Teskey, who died during the Battle of Arras on June 11, 1917.
In addition to the main ceremony on April 9, the Prime Minister will attend the Freedom of the City parade in Arras on April 7 and an Easter Sunday Dinner with Veterans.
The Battle of Vimy Ridge marked the first time all four Divisions of the Canadian Corps had gone into battle together. Their victory, which came at a cost of more than 10,000 casualties including 3,598 dead, was a vital strategic breakthrough that had eluded their British and French allies for two years. April 9, 2007, will be the first time since 1917 that April 9 has fallen on Easter Monday.
[See VIMY in its own section below and a bit about Canada in WW1 in INFObits just below]

Currently at the Jericho Arts Centre (1675 Discovery, Th to Sun), Apr 6 to 29 (Apr 12th talkback):
United Players' production of THE IMPROMPTU OF OUTREMENT by Michel Tremblay
ONLINE RESERVATIONS or 604 224 8007, ext. 2; www.unitedplayers.com
* ENCORE: The Syringa Tree is back (Vancouver Playhouse) and well worth seeing -- stars our own Caroline Cave.
The Long Exile by MELANIE McGRATH (reviewed by Elizabeth Royte of the NYT)             
Three Inuit families were forcibly relocated to an extremely inhospitable island in Arctic Canada.             
~  Make your voice heard to save the polar bear: http://PolarBearSOS.org
~  See the adorable otters holding hands/paws: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epUk3T2Kfno

==  INFObits
> China has just bought the entire MG plant in England (~=A350M+) and moved it to China, hence 3000 jobs.  They also recently wanted a British type village, think it was in or near Shanghai so they sent workers to England to learn the trades and then there are so few with those skills, some were hired back in Britain.
> In the VSun -- 1000 ppl a month moving into Surrey
> Did the BC Ferry Corp and the BC govt read about charges being laid wrt the sinking of the Sea Diamond near Santorini within days?
Almost 10% of Canada's entire population of seven million people served in the armed forces during the First World War, and nearly 60,000 died.  The great Allied victories of 1918 were spearheaded by Canadian troops, perhaps the most capable soldiers in the entire British order of battle.
The Second World War provided a re-run.  The Canadian navy began the war with a half dozen vessels, and ended up policing nearly half of the Atlantic against U-boat attack.  More than 120 Canadian warships participated in the Normandy landings, during which 15,000 Canadian soldiers went ashore on D-Day alone.  Canada finished the war with the third-largest navy and the fourth-largest air force in the world.
 ===  UPDATE
Still no WVPD Police Chief.
As reported, $122K shortfall in WVPD budget revealed end of March; more details in next issue on the budget.

===  CALENDAR to Apr 22nd  ===  [all at M Hall unless otherwise]

BTW, we're still on the wheel of happy new years (yes, I mean plural, wait for the list) Apr 13 -15, this time the lunisolar calendar: Songkran in Thai, Songkan in Lao; also this time of year in Cambodia, Myanmar, Sri Lanka (Sinhalese and Tamil).

+++  SILK PURSE  +++ www.silkpurse.ca
April 10 - April 22, 2007 "Cosmic Storm"
With an energy output that is second only to the big bang, the event called the 'cosmic storm' gives the viewer a detailed look yet at how objects collide, merge, and form into smaller objects and then into large objects. Join us for this beautiful contemporary exhibit of abstracts and uniquely 'woven' abstracts in pastel & ink, watercolour and giclee prints by artists Greg & Eva Kawezynski and Wendy Dallian.

+++  FERRY BUILDING GALLERY +++  "Reflections Vancouver" to Apr 17 to 29
Capilano College IDEA Program -- Original paintings and 2008 Calendar launch.
Wed, Apr 17: Opening Reception 6 - 8pm  ***   Sat, Apr 21: Artists in Attendance 2pm

* Apr 13:       Please join us for an opening reception Friday from 6:30 to 8pm
* Apr 17: Reading James Joyce's Ulysses.  Join Joe Ronsley for an ongoing reading & discussion of Ulysses. Drop in to any session, 10:30am - 12:30pm in the Peter J. Peters Room. For more information call the Reference Department: 925 7405.
* Apr 20:  North Shore Writers Festival Presents: Colin Angus, Fri, 7:30pm KMC
The first person to circumnavigate the planet using human propulsion, Angus will screen his new DVD Beyond the Horizon.
* Apr 22:  Who Killed the Electric Car? A Documentary, Sun 1 - 3pm, Peter J. Peters Room
In 1966, electric cars began to appear on roads all over California. Ten years later, where have they gone?
o  An Inconvenient Truth -- Apr 22nd Sunday 3 - 5pm and 23rd Monday 1 - 3pm
Former American VP Al Gore explains the facts of global warming in this documentary film.
o  Apr 23, MONDAY:
- 10am ~ Earth Friendly Gardening - A workshop with Sheila Watkins, local gardening writer and teacher.
- 7:30pm ~ North Shore Writers Festival Presents: Girls Night Out: Susan Juby, Robyn Harding & Wendy French; Free
Come find out where such novels as Alice I Think, The Secret Desires of a Soccer Mom, and sMothering, came from!

== Thurs, Apr 12th - contradictory info on DWV website but have been told a Rodgers Crk Area WG mtg at Hall, probably 5:30 so call 925 7000 to verify. {see Special sections below on this fiasco.}

==  Fri, Apr 13th ~ 8am - 2pm ~ Southern Straits Race -- Start at Dundarave Pier

==  Sun, Apr 15th ~ 10am - 2pm ~ Hay Park Stewardship Event
Join the Environmental Protection Network students at WV Secondary School, the WV Parks Dept, and our partner, Evergreen, in a planting and mulching event at Hay Park (in an area near Inglewood Ave). Refreshments will be served. This youth-led project will enhance the area near Inglewood Ave. For more info: 925-7138.
The Parks Department has had enquiries about the status of the backwater rearing channel at Hay Park.  The entry to the channel has been cleared and some water flow restored.  Further questions about the backwater channel can be directed to Stephen Jenkins, Environmental Coordinator, at (604) 925-7192, or to environment@westvancouver.ca.
~ 3pm ~ U.B.C. Opera Ensemble
Nancy Hermiston, Director with a special guest appearance by Lloyd Burritt, composer
The Dream Healer, a new opera opening at the Chan Centre next spring
St. Francis in the Wood Anglican Church, 4773 South Piccadilly Road
$15 at the door includes refreshments; Reservations: 604 922-3531

==  Tues, Apr 17th -- 4:30pm ~  Finance and Audit Cmte, and on the DWV Calendar!

==  Wednesday, April 18th  [as requested, not reporting place, just for info b/c venue too small; this for info and example of good work they're doing]
~ 7pm ~ Special mtg: North Shore Wetland Partners 
UBC  ' Sw=E1ywey Watershed   REPORT  ~ 1 hour
By way of background the following is an introduction by the UBC students regarding the ANALYSIS AND RECOMMENDATIONS from their study and analysis of Sw=E1ywey Watershed 
Our group of five students contacted Dr. Hans Schreier at the Institute for Resources, Environment, and Sustainability (IRES) in September 2006 for a topic idea for an Environmental Science Honours Thesis.  Since he did some preliminary sediment and water quality sampling at Ambleside in the summer of 2006 and found high levels of metals, he suggested doing an analysis and characterization of several parameters that influence the health of Sw=E1ywey Creek and Ambleside Lagoon. We started our project with background research in October 2006 and started sampling in December 2006.  We specifically investigated the effect and level of urbanization in the watershed that drains into Sw=E1ywey Creek on the hydrology of the system.  Levels of impervious surfaces were estimated and analyzed in the watershed.  We took sediment samples to further our knowledge on levels of contamination in the system, and how they may differ between Sw=E1ywey Creek and the lagoon.  Surface water samples were collected in both Sw=E1ywey and the lagoon, and analyzed for nutrients to determine how eutrophic the system is.  Electrical conductivity was measured in the lagoon and in Sw=E1ywey Creek to determine the extent of the ocean's effect and stormwater runoff's effects on the system.  Finally, benthic macro-invertebrates were sampled in the lagoon and Sw=E1ywey Creek as a final evaluation of the health of the system.  In addition, this preliminary data can be useful for further sampling that can be undertaken by North Shore Wetland Partners.
        Review draft Sw=E1ywey brochure - 10 minutes
        Wetland  Reports - 20 minutes
        2007 Work Plans - monitoring, invasive species, community events - 30 minutes

~ 6pm ~ Library Board in the Peters Room at the Library
~ 7pm ~ Board of Variance at M Hall

==  Thurs, Apr 19th
~ 4:30 - 8:30pm ~ Design Review Cmte (MOVED from Apr 26)
~ 5:30 - 7:30 NSh Family & Youth Justice Cmte at CNV M Hall

==  Sun, Apr 22nd -- EARTH DAY Celebration at Gleneagles Cmnty Ctr all day
Hadden Park (behind the Maritime Museum) near Vanier Park, Vancouver (rain or shine)
Discussion by faith groups / Lost streams history / First Nations participation
To bless the salmon as they head to sea. Join people of different faiths as we offer our combined blessings to the young salmon who have travelled down the local rivers and are preparing for their epic ocean journey.
Info: www.falsecreekwatershed.org and email: salmoncelebration@hotmail.com

+++  Check out www.kaymeekcentre.ca for events at KMC!

===  COUNCIL MEETING NOTES Apr 2nd [names best guess; typed quickly during mtg]
1.  APPROVAL OF AGENDA /  some additions: 7.2 add'l mtg of Ccl; correspondence
2.  ADOPTION OF MINUTES -- No items scheduled.
Mayor: ... thank JF as acting Mayor, filling in for me; watched both ccl mtgs that I missed; good opp to observe; need a bit more rigour; important to keep public input to three minutes; helps with Council's ability to debate your business
As a result, a question that came up at a Cmte of the Whole Mtg, Ccl agrees Ccl Correspondence, Mayor and Ccl Reports, and also Public Input shd be a regular part of Cmte/Whole mtgs, as they are for reg ccl mtgs...
{Pam must have realised cancellation of public questions at a ccl gathering, whatever name change they've tried this time was political poison and wisely, thank heavens, she's restored that right at ev Ccl mtg in Chambers.}
The mayors are meeting tomorrow with the Chair of TransLink to discuss Mr Falcon's TransLink review.
3.         B. Murray, North Shore Spring Bear Festival Society, regarding North Shore Spring Bear Festival
MW: Actually it's Mick Webb....  Many months ago presented a proposal
over a week, inform and educate about the world of the bear, key to successful co-existence
thank DWV for in-kind sponsorship of this event and polite and efficient cooperation from staff
festival on track and ready to go.  Megan will show slides
[Megan reads from slides]: Celebrating our Bears Apr 23 - 29; northshorebearfest.com
in BC av 1000 nuisance bears killed a year b/c perceived as threat
in 2005, the NSh bear popn hit an all-time high of over 100 bears; by the end of 2006 drastically reduced to about 30 bears
goals: celebration; education to practise bear-smart behaviour
support from [list]; 100% volunteer-run festival
hope to be a model for other cmnties; end of April coincides with end of hibernation
Two renowned bear experts sharing stage:
o  Ben Kilham, Nat'l Geographic's Mother Bear Man, did Papa Bear documentary for Discovery Channel 2005; NBC, Dateline, NYT, etc, guest on Leno, Letterman etc; author of book, Among the Bears; olfactory-oriented; bears recognize what they smell and we recognize what we see
o  Charlie Russell, from Alberta, spent better part of 45 years studying bears in their natural habitat;  past 11 years studied bears in Russia; in 1990s spent time on Princess Royal Island writing a book on the Spirit Bear; Cdn best-selling author, Bears of Kamchatka, finishing documentary; BBC film; wants to tell true story about what bears really are (not what we've been told)
Events:  Apr 20 Wild about Bears Workshops; [listed events]
Weekend Apr 27 - 29: KMC Friday, an evening of Bear Talk; and Sat, Cap College, Bear Talk and Walk; and the big day is Sunday, Apr 29 Bear Festival Day in Ambleside Park 10am to 4pm featuring 30+ exhibits, barbecue, live music, entertainers, etc
JC: bear popn on NSh was reduced by 70%
[Ans: yes, 100 to 30]
JC: shot or relocated?
[Ans: combination of the two]
Mick Webb: depends; typical response has been to shoot; modification to encompass relocation to appease public reaction; stressful for bears to be relocated..... known to return.... the answer lies with us.  We live in bear territory; recognize our responsibilities and we're part of the problem
[Mutual thx]
4.         Community Engagement Committee - Progress Report ... to be received for information.
* Elaine Fonseca, Prez ADRA (Ambleside/Dundarave Ratepayers' Assn):
ADRA's position is that Working Groups be treated in the same way as Cmtes of Ccl mtgs, in order that they are open to the public and that advance notice of these mtgs be publicized.  The reason for ADRA's position is that it has been brought to our attention that a meeting had been held regarding the Amb Town Ctr before ADRA had had a chance to hold our Amb Town Ctr mtg on Mar 28th.  We wd like the opportunity to have our directors and mbrs attend these mtgs as this new revitalized town ctr will have an impact on our residents and our cmnty.

{More information. 
Cclr JF, Chair of the Ambleside Master Plan WG, wrote to me that actually two Amb WG mtgs had been held before the public mtg held by ADRA; ADRA's mtg is secondary to the fact that there shd be notification of WG mtgs and in this case no doubt ADRA mbrs wd hv been interested and wanting to find out as much about the proposals and process before their own public mtg!   Why is this principle of letting residents know about mtgs so hard to get through? or understand? or actually do instead of myriad assurances it will be done and then not doing it???}

* Carolanne Reynolds, Editor of West Van Matters, starts in French b/c Mayor just back from France: Bienvenue
Before I start, I really appreciated your remarks[, Madam Mayor,] at the beginning, that Reports and PQP wd not be omitted {in future; this is a reference to their having been deleted at prev mtg when Cclr JF in Chair and Mayor away, all voted to do so}; I really appreciate that, tyvm.  That {deletion/removal from the agenda} was quite shocking.
Anyway, wrt the Working Groups
In November of last year-- there are several things that seem to be a divergence between open, transparent, and democratic govt, and what has been happening.
In November of last year it was suddenly announced that letters wd be removed from Correspondence {on the ccl mtg agenda and in pkg}; and this year there has been no notice of WG mtgs.
The first reason we were given {wrt no notice} was that it was not a cmte appointed by Ccl; but they WERE appointed by a Ccl Cmte, in fact. A plucked rose by any other name wd still look bad!

{What a risible ruse of despicable connivance to change a group's name so it doesn't have to comply with the legislation.  And residents will allow them to get away with this? removal of rights without a peep?  Hope not.}

Anyway, this is not meant for me personally {ie, it's a matter of principle} -- I must interject that cclrs hv bn v kind and invited me to mtgs even without notice and so I do want to say that they have been most kind.  My point has really to do with policy and the public and residents.
I was aghast mbrs of a WG recently VOTED to have a CLOSED mtg  -- clearly contrary to the intent of the LGA and the  Cmnty Charter.
Some cclrs say they've asked their mtgs have notices and have notification but it's not happened.  So perhaps there's something that has to be looked at there.

{Are staff not following instructions?  Whose responsibility is that?  a cclr shdn't hv to spend time checking and chasing up.  Nor shd the public.}

One WG has met seven times and has NEVER had a notice posted!
I'd like to think that campaign promises for openness and transparency meant something.  This divergence is particularly worrying and backward steps.  Certainly a surprise from what we were led to believe.
This agenda item in fact allowing, allows, lack of notice and closed mtgs and it is alarming b/c on the agenda it says this report is "for receipt for information", wch gives the impression that cclrs are just going to say "yes, fine, thanks" and pass it; and that it does not appear welcome/welcoming, or an opportunity, for cclrs to express their views wrt notification and the participation of the public in their mtgs.
This report comes from the Cmnty Engagement Cmte.

{The CEC has three mbrs: the Mayor as Chair, Cclr JF, and Cclr Sop (who replaced Cclr V who resigned from it more than a month ago).}

May I suggest, from what I've read, and from the practice up to this date, it might be better named the Cmnty DISengagement Cmte.
It wd be appreciated if you wd pls tell us when, where, and how mtgs will be posted, how long before the mtg.  For example, I just walked in tonight and, great, there's a mtg posted for Finance & Audit tomorrow, but as I've said in the past, you can't really expect ppl to walk by the Hall the day before somebody's going to have a mtg.  As I've said, a town crier wd be more effective.

{For the record, Fin & Audit has often been on the DWV website Calendar; including one specified as CLOSED.  I've received assurances that notices will be posted and not as closed even though they will go in camera.  FYI, the Cmnty Charter requires all mtgs start open and may only go in camera after making a motion in public specifying under wch part of the act applies, then requiring a vote indicating agreement -- there are some vague and then the philosophy and desire of the cclrs and mbrs become important, hence the vote.  I have never seen another WG posted on the bulletin board outside the M Hall door, the one place they feel  -- and are -- obliged to put the agenda.}

I'm hoping there will be discussion of this item; it will not simply be received for information b/c it has some serious flaws when it comes to openness and public participation.  So I imagine there are some cclrs among you who will speak out and stand up for open govt in our democracy.

Mayor: I will introduce this report as the Chair of the Cmnty Engagement Cmte (CEC).
Anything on a ccl agenda is wide open for public comment and Cclr comment and I wd hope everyone wd engage fully.
The CEC has been meeting privately b/c it has been dealing with hundreds of applications of citizens wishing to roll up their sleeves and work on actual problems, rather than take a passive role in a more advisory capacity.

{As explained above, CEC is a cmte of ccl -- no doubt about that -- and according to the Cmnty Charter cmtes of Ccl must give notice and be public!!!  They can then move to go in camera, citing under wch section, and have a vote for agreement that it qualifies.  This is also done so the public can verify if they agree.  It can't just be a decision to close the mtg.  The grounds are specified.  If not, they can't go in camera.  There have been instances (last year) in wch when a mtg was asked under what section it was going in camera, they cd not find one that applied so they cd not and did not go in camera.
As to the implication of wanting to work on problems vs 'passive', all the cmtes/grps are de facto advisory b/c Ccl makes final decisions, quite apart from either misunderstanding or insulting the efforts of all those residents who served on the many adv cmtes over many years.  No one has been able to explain to me any discernible difference between former cmtes and today's cmtes and WGs, except for shorter time period appointments and freedom to meet more frequently than once a month, wch in any case many adv cmtes did when needed anyway.}

been overwhelmed; dealing with ppl's personal information trying to put them as best we can on WGs, Task Forces, Bds, etc, one adv cmte left and three standing cmtes.
We've taken cmtes that are standing cmtes, Cmnty Engagement and Fin&Aud, previously just Ccl's purview, and included citizen involvement in those.
we've been v clear, now others all in place, apptmts made, incumbent on each cmte to publish its mtg dates and that will on the website.

{what does incumbent mean if not accountable when not done?
been inefficient, hit-and-miss in past so not hopeful; why not make someone responsible, then there's accountability?}

We believe the most effective use of our time and resources is to put ev on the website and drive ppl to website; I cdn't agree more posting a notice on the front of the M Hall isn't an effective way to reach most ppl, and it's too time-consuming for staff.

{not to mention needing thumb-tack protection... Help! WCB to the rescue!}

drive ppl to the website, all materials for the mtgs will be posted there and av to the public
notes from mtgs will be posted there, av to public and Ccl
forums -- to put special questions to the cmte; and we will advertise those through the use of an on-line forum

{hm. Oodles of instances demonstrating staff don't/can't post notices of meetings reliably, now have reports that from a frustrated resident, not surprising I guess, that attempts to reach the on-line forums merely generate server and database error messages.  I said much-touted but may not be functioning yet; now confirmed.}

trying to cut down on administrative, bureaucratic, and v labour-intensive use of staff time

{as far as we can see to this point, no significant difference except the improvement of putting things on the website, so if that's more work, in fact it takes staff time; remains to be seen for the webforums.  Wch brings up another point.  Was told last year mbrs of a group even had a password-protected (ie secret) email discussion list going.  So much for open debate and free-flow of ideas.
In any case, almost none of the mtgs has been posted on the website so this is theoretical at best, misrepresentation otherwise.}

corollary is we're probably being more demanding of public to get info themselves; everybody is welcome to that information.

{then why not have a citizen register so they can be on list for topics they're interested in, such as they do for Tidings???  (and as I've long advocated)  They've got the technology.  Agendas are emailed to all cmte mbrs == just add those names to the list and a press of the button sends it to everyone on the list.  This is not rocket science.
Some seem to think it is and beyond their abilities, b/c it cdn't possibly b/c they don't agree with and support openness and inclusion.}
wrt mtgs that haven't been duly advertised, think that's really just out of enthusiasm
I've been here and there've been mtgs in ev room with the public and they're generally open

{oh yes.  Forgot.  Yes of course, the DOOR is open.
Oh yes, citizens will readily believe that they haven't been told about a mtg they'd be interested in b/c the mbrs of the cmte/WG are 'enthusiastic'.
That makes all the difference.  I'm sure judges have on the list  of acceptable excuses that enthusiasm is justification for breaking the law.
Well, excu-u-u-u-se me.}

Ccl has made a recommendation to the WGs that they try to be open,

{try? try? have we failed to get across the message that mtgs MUST BE OPEN by law?  it's not a question of 'trying'???  Shd we redouble our efforts to explain the difference between a recommendation and a law???}

 but there are some things that are just not appropriate,

{appropriate?  Pardon me, but appropriate is not one of the criteria.  That's what the in camera legislation is for!
don't make it up, for example when you don't want residents listening to hear that you're advocating high density for the Rodgers Creek area of over 200 acres when the OCP limits it to 2.5 upa per acre.
If the WG's recommendation is high density then we don't get to know if anyone advocated less or more than the final report.
or who pushed for an equestrian ctr on public land for their friends or b/c one of their pastimes.....
but this is PUBLIC biz, it's not a private devpr's mtg deciding what they want!!!
Whatever the decision we have the right to know the process and how the decisions have been arrived at.}

and that's not b/c we don't think it's everybody's business, of course it is everybody's business, but the WGs are often dealing with questions where they're learning and everything they decide is returned to Ccl, and as you know that's certainly a public forum.

{EXCEPT for Wed mornings when Ccl and staff have a 'workshop' and discuss ccl biz/items.
at Apr 11th's heard the discussed the budget and and whether or not 2.95% was acceptable was voted on.  Ccl mtg in my book so shd be open with public present.
Oh, dear, forgive me.  It was not a vote.  It was a show of hands or a consensus.
People, please get it straight:
> a meeting is not a meeting when it's a workshop
> a cmte is not a cmte (with legislated rules) when it's called a Working Group
> a vote is not a vote if there is no record of it?
Oh, the magical power of a word!}

we're working with a brand new system

{to decide without that bothersome business about notifying the public and the problem of their knowing what's going on, how someone votes, and -- God forbid! -- the opportunity to provide add'l or missing information, not to mention corrections/clarifications to what the mtg has been told.}

been truly overwhelmed by the public response in favour of that

{of what exactly?  what do they know that they're in favour of?
are they in favour of what they don't know???}

certain amt of energy comes from being assigned a task, and a tight time frame with high expectations
from now on the CEC will be meeting monthly in a traditional formal cmte of Ccl -- hope that will go some way to understanding the new system that we are devising

{belatedly but better late than never}

it's attracting a lot of interest everywhere

{Oh, I bet.  Especially if WV has found a way to circumvent the legislation and a way to meet away from prying questioning eyes.....}

we were putting so much [sic] resources into a public opp that was less than effective
we have yet to see what comes out of these WGs
seems ev working v hard and wishing them to be successful
next aspect we're testing is how well on-line forums work
don't want them to be unwieldy, hoping ppl keep comments concise and constructive, but again ppl can watch that unfold in a conversational way on the website
that's where we're at with a new system
not intended to be a closed system but it has taken a few months to put in place and properly

{it didn't occur to anyone to continue with the old system rather than closing doors before making public the new system???}

now open to Ccl to give your input and get some further direction; will just ask Mr Stuart if he has anything to add

CAO: have noted concerns about the inconsistencies, differences
I met with all staff liaisons representatives this afternoon, working with the Clerk hv established a series of guidelines, will be publishing those on web, and that will help ppl understand how they work and where they can go for info

{why not first????? will look forward to reading!}

Sop: these WGs I perceive as action groups;

(and, she asks sweetly, the advisory cmtes were inaction groups?}

one year; charged with various duties
three I'll be sitting on, one I have seen tremendous enthusiasm;

{yes, such tremendous enthusiasm seven mtgs held with nary a hint to the public a mtg was going to be held -- and they're not even on the Calendar or listed retrospectively!}

will be indepth recommendations to Ccl; clear to me WGs going to be v effective
if we charge citizens to provide activity going to have an action associated with change to our policies -- shd hv structure, and no diff than in past

{unannounced structure and v diff from the past!}

stated in here note web forum; good avenue; discuss issues; certainties for education
also opps for these WGs to engage the cmnty
and opp for public to sit in on the mtgs and that opp shd not go away,

{then why did you let it drop?  did you not happen to notice no notice hence no public?}

and the right as with the Task Force, we had citizens sit in, we even asked opinions and it went v well b/c they gave their opinion

{but there was at least one mtg they tried to go in camera but when asked on what grounds and cdn't give a valid one, they didn't.}

openness of this I think is absolutely imperative;

{then, Bill, you are a strong advocate of the people, MAKE SURE the ppl are included and not left out in the cold, ignored!  We know you can do it.  If you believe it and really want to do it, DO IT!  We're just astonished your WG had seven, yes seven, mtgs with NO NOTICE.  Now, you must have known but implied only a mtg or two, so when I dropped in for a short while (and you, staff, mbrs were v courteous and welcoming in spite of the fact no notice, no agenda, no binder of mtg info), you were taken aback (but cd say nothing) knowing I was there and heard that fact innocently come out while WG planning work for the year.}
am a little concerned we're going to receive this tonight; seems most of it is out here for us to accept and wonder why we're just receiving

{as we wondered too, Bill}

and not something we're going to move along with; under the proviso from my position follow LGA [Cmnty Charter] in relationship how we perceive these cmte mtgs and notified by staff, ev knows where/when they're at, and that the public can attend the mtg as well as ask a question at the end

{BRAVO, BILL.  Now put actions to those words -- a true hero fighting for our rights.
One caveat.  As you said when public input was removed a few years ago, residents ought to be able to speak to an item on the agenda however, as you know with the limitation in my opinion must be strictly adhered to, during the mtg restricted to relevant facts, pertinent/missing/add'l information, ie NO opinions, no views, no lobbying, in wch case shd be ruled out of order.
BTW, in all my years of attending adv cmtes, only once has someone been ruled out of order -- and that was another cclr by the Chair (who also was a cclr), not once a resident.}

and if that happens then in my case I feel we've met the right consistency of the Cmnty Charter and we have satisfied provided this great service.
I don't see that it shd be anything difficult; make sure it's in here that we follow that

{Right on, Bill!}

question p4 re wording -- "mtgs will be open to the public wherever possible recognizing there may be instances where this is not approp", I assume that's in camera, wch on the agenda shd be a statement of in camera

{oooo, Bill, you spotted it; pls stick to the interpretation to the legislation, "where not appropriate" is a crate of codswallop.}

then it says, "examples of those issues covered under the Cmnty Charter as well as instances wch the WG feels are not sufficiently advanced"
Well, if you're open to the public, you're open to the public -- what is not going to be sufficiently advanced at a point that you're not getting ready?  public shd still be able to sit there and listen to what you're trying to advance, as far as I'm concerned

{BRAVO, BILL!  Exactly.  This advanced stuff is nonsense -- you've got it "open to the public" means that!}

then it goes further and says that "the manner in wch the WGs each communicate and engage the public will be specific to purpose of group"

{Can you say loophole?  the size of a truck with a tarpaulin over the contents.}

Each WG has a task wch is action-orientated, so whatever discussions that take place wd be what is advertised and communicated; I don't have a major prob with that

{Yup, yup, yup, Sop, you've got it!}

just find there's mtg guidelines: the WG provide advance notification on the forum, and the public wd be invited to attend, notes from public mtg wd also be posted on the website
might be some confusion, Madam Mayor, as to mtgs conducted by the public or they are the public, that's the ppl we draw these names from; there's also the right, many of these WGs will to go out to the public on a cmnty mtg and then you have the ability for the public to sit in on it

{hm.  just when is the public not the public?}

if we entertain those, following closely to what we had before, without any ramifications, I point out this is not like an advisory group in past, this will be over in a few months here, and the amt of work going to be done by these groups is tremendous.

{like the tremendous enthusiasm, thus closed doors?}

RD: remarkable achievement,

{oh, remarkable indeed!}

three standing cmtes, nine WGs; over 100 ppl volunteered; carefully selected
look over names, outstanding group of ppl, fortunate to have them
I chair Rodgers Creek Area WG, started right away, had five mtgs, not seven but five, been open, had no problems with that

{ahem.  Temporary amnesia?
Has he forgotten completely about the mtg (I think the second) that was declared to be closed by the previous mtg?
None of this required in camera qualification and voting business.
Oh right, it might stem their enthusiasm.
The reason given was that BPP was to make a presentation at the coming mtg -- wch begs the question: did BPP not want the public to know what they planned? did the mbrs not want the public to hear what their opinions were of the BPP proposal?  did cclrs or staff not want their opinions heard?  cd anyone possibly think residents wd not be interested in proposals for hundreds of units above the Upper Levels?
I heard that someone was even discouraged from attending their mtgs at all 'at this stage'.
No problem that at one of the first mtgs, you allowed (well, mayor too b/c she was there) the mbrs -- the mbrs, note, who have neither the right nor the power quite apart from breaking the intent of the legislation -- to vote then have a CLOSED mtg?  Not one of your principles?  or one not worth bringing up?  keeping quiet more important?  Cclr Day is a v nice person after all but I was shocked he'd gone along with this while professing not to agree.  He is the cclr on the WG after all.  The mbrs shdn't be expected to know what the law is.  Cclrs shd.  So shd staff.}

it's been a bit difficult to try to figure out what the procedure was for announcing these mtgs on the web
{indeed -- WV has only had its website since 2000, about seven years -- hardly enough time for staff to figure out how to announce meetings or run on-line forums reliably}

very early; I was trying to get these publicized; we weren't quite sure who was responsible; we've worked that out now and the staff person on ea of the WGs is responsible for seeing that the mtg is publicized; ppl can look up on the Web and find out when the WGs are meeting

{yes, true, he has been trying.  And many times.  I've found it v strange that evidently staff have not done as he asked.  Writing this update Apr 15 and almost none of the WG mtgs are on the DWV website Calendar -- indeed, and I'm sure Rod will be as frustrated as I am when he learns that his Rodgers Crk Area WG mtg for Apr 26 is still NOT on the Calendar.  And I'm confident that he's asked .}

I think we've worked out wrinkles quite well; all the WGs are working now and making good progress
really quite pleased with the way it's going

{Apart from working well, I know of at least two that have yet to meet for the first time.  Rod's optimistic and trusting.}

they show a flexibility and ability to get at specific problems old adv cmtes not able to do so

(sorry; too early to tell -- NO reports from a WG hv bn given to Ccl! some adv cmtes were excellent and did great work, eg the Shoreline report by the Engg Adv Cmte; some cmtes however, were told they cd not comment on anything they had not been given to discuss.}

 I think we're well served by these cmtes and we're moving ahead quite well.

{er, um; examples pls -- it's not just that nothing has gone to Ccl yet from a WG, if we haven't found out about the mtgs, how do we know there's been any movement at all or in what direction???}

JF: remember new endeavour, new way of doing biz
ev on Ccl wd like to see public involvement and transparency throughout process and no intention to prevent the public from participating or observing the workings of the cmtes

{then why not do something about it -- I know you've tried -- why not translate into 'wd like' into 'have'?}

may be instances the info being dealt with has some connection with the privacy of a specific prop owner particularly in something like the Ambleside Study Group or the evaluations of lands, but in fact a person's private biz and out of respect for privacy there may be instances where portions of meeting may be held in camera

{don't forget the legislation deals with that; that's not the argument.}

to allow a free flow of discussion without impacting the personal privacy of some owner.  I don't think anyone wd hv difficulty with that.

{Zoning and density changes have nothing at all whatsoever with the personal privacy of the owner.  Just ask Millennium that has gone through an excruciating five years or so and at least two sets of Public Hearings.  Why shd any other developer be treated differently or given favoured treatment.
Well, I don't mean to advocate everyone shd hv to go through what Mllnm did.  There shd be a process.  The same for everyone and every developer/owner/applicant.}

as we work along, may come to spots, may have to return to CEC, may have to change a bit of process, accommodate a diff avenue and approach
hope Ccl wd give that consideration, but wd be done in a public mtg at Ccl

{good to hear; look forward to it}

a work in process; need to be able to amend it to work in the best interests of those not only participating but public in general and cmnty as a whole

{...while abiding by the legislation....}

may want to change

{want, yes, able or allowed to is different}

some bits of our process as we go along
groups I'm liaising with v excited about this process and anxious to share with anyone who comes out
now est'd guidelines and consistency, ppl know where to go, ppl know where to look, a lot of concerns will dissipate

VV: I didn' t expect this cmnty engagement system to follow the course it has
when considering about a year ago, recognizing the efficiencies of using computers and email, I thought the idea of on-line electronic forums where ppl basically sign on and register and email their opinions; I thought that did sound like progress and shd show us some savings
so when I looked forward to getting this report, the first thing I was looking for wrt what the Mayor introduced, the former schemes were bureaucratic, labour-intensive, heavy use of staff time.
I thought we'd be shown in due course roughly how much time that is, so that we can have a sense of what it cost.  This is pretty well the time of year we talk of budgets, and I was hoping we wd be seeing some indication of what the savings wd be by changing the scheme and I'm disappointed there's no reference to savings, there's no quantification neither in time nor money, so that's the first thing that makes me reluctant to receive this b/c it hasn't the first thing I wanted to see: what did it cost? what are we saving? relative to the previous method
leads me to this perhaps a brave effort, but a problem, been alluded to already with this matter of creating WGs that can choose of their own volition to exclude the public
I'm quite baffled by that, b/c according to the LGA, we ourselves as Ccl cannot magic out of thin air the right to exclude the public.  The conditions on wch that happens are clearly laid down in the LGA; there are only about three or four occasions, things to do with law suits, personnel matters, and they're v tightly controlled; b/c the govt, the enabling legislation I shd say, does not want us to have the power to exclude the public.
how can it be that we can create a cmte of Ccl -- cmtes of Ccl have to follow Ccl procedures I understand --  so we create the CEC, it creates a WG, and by some means I don't understand, by some sort of hocus pocus, that WG is able itself to decide to exclude the public
so I don't understand how Ccl can indirectly confer on a WG a power it doesn't have for itself, so I don't accept that.  It makes no sense to me and it's an offence against democratic principles.
I wd like to admonish the public, Madam Mayor. I really believe that the public can place every trust and faith in its elected M representatives, but I also believe it's with the proviso that the public always can watch, and I can't be more emphatic in reminding the public that this is a serious principle of democracy.

{absolutely so, well said.
Dear Readers: Cclr V's WG has not yet met but I'm confident she not only means what she says on this matter of principle, but that she will also carry through.
Few politicians are straight and lack artifice or spin.
Cclr V may be one.
It is encouraging.
Will the others listen, agree, then DO?}}

So I can't accept this report, I think it's such an important problem, that it simply isn't acceptable, it isn't something that can be received until this statement in effect that WGs can exclude the public is dealt with, so I won't be voting to receive this report.  I know a lot of work, of interest, but we must get back to basic democratic principles and have everything open to the public, and if something, as Cclr F has said, maybe there is a personnel matter, then it has to go to the Ccl, and Ccl itself has to go in camera according to the LGA and under no other circumstances.

{Jaw-droppingly honest, straightforward, and intent to abide by the law.}

MS: don't know why spending so much time on this matter
obviously-- [fire siren starts up!] -- I've been upstaged by Chief Oates again.
Obviously I think these WGs shd be open to the public

{laudable but one of the Fin&Aud cmte mtgs has CLOSED for it on the DWV website Calendar -- I have no doubt that was not Cclr Smith's intention, but (and he's not alone) when does it become a cclr's responsibility/concern that the public are notified when staff don't do as asked?
And why wd staff change if no one responsible or accountable and no repercussions if not done?}

As chair of the Finance Cmte facing our challenging financial situation, we'd be more than happy to have any mbrs of the public to attend and hope they bring good money-making ideas with them when they come
I think what we shd do with these WGs is publish them ev week, list the meetings for the next week, if there's something the WG feels shd be discussed in private, they can excuse any mbrs of the public if there are any there.  That really is the end of it.

{but, Mike, the whole point is that it's not somebody's opinion of 'shd', this is open/public/democratic govt and closing mtgs are only allowed/legal under special stipulated cases.
after reading Mike's words "WG feels" I called him and he further clarified that he really meant that it had to follow the legislation, not a question of 'feeling' as he actually said.}

but to have a WG on Ambleside revitalization and I wd think they wd think they wd want to have the Ambleside ratepayers at the mtg; so I think we shd open up these groups, publish when they're meeting, and move on

{yup; fully agree, 'just do it'.}

CAO: for clarification, the WGs are working in accordance with the legislation, we have got a legal opinion on that

{NONONONO!  Not according to Cmnty Charter -- oh dear, public are not allowed to speak at this point in the ccl mtg so I have to wait until PQP to clarify and let you know this is NOT true!  See PQP below.}

and again as I mentioned earlier on
we're having a mtg with staff to clarify the guidelines, staff to outline their workplan for the entire year, set a specific schedule, and then get that onto the website so any mbr of the cmnty can understand how often these groups are meeting, where they're mtg and what mtgs they can attend
hope to have that in the next couple of weeks

{but why not in place BEFORE WGs started mtg?
to what do you attribute the rejection/non-adherence/foot-dragging?}

Mayor: important recognizing taking spirit of what the Cmnty Charter is driving at, but unencumbering ourselves from some of the litigiousness

{frankly preposterous; never heard of taking legal action -- a red herring, a rhetorical boogie bear trying to paint the legislation as not about residents' rights? In fact, the sleight of hand of calling them "Working Groups" so the provincial law on "Council Committees" can be ignored is more likely to attract litigation, not less.}

 of that and the labour intensiveness, is  all that we're doing.  Absolutely this is all posted

{but it's NOT!  To be fair, Pam is possibly not aware they're not being posted.  Hers, CEC's mtgs, haven't been posted since Jan 22!  See the section following this re email Apr 9/12.}

to me, the height of democratic principles is to have citizens working on citizens' problems for citizens' cmnties and we are trying to take ourselves out a step from that as a Ccl and we look forward to the really broad input from these WGs on the problems set as the priorities for this Ccl as a direct reflection of what the priorities for the cmnty are.

{and just how do you square that with not letting citizens know when and where mtgs are, plus not allowing them to ask questions except at the end (and only wrt 'process and disposition', when neither  pertains to the cmte, and can easily be asked of staff before or after the mtg without wasting the mbrs'/cmte's time)?}

If I can express a disappointment, Cclr V, it's that you cdn't serve on that cmte with us b/c I really truly offered you that apptmt and you came to a couple of mtgs, b/c I know how important transparency and democratic principles are to you.
I'm sorry you're not there, perhaps you'll consider serving next year.

{wd be fascinating to learn why Cclr V resigned.  Am sure not a decision lightly taken.  Cclr V tends to be serious and thoughtful, not one to make rash decisions.  Maybe she'll say why at a ccl mtg b/c this certainly was left hanging by the Mayor and almost as a chastisement.}

Sop: ea cmte has costs, printing, and wonder where money's going to come from
CAO: ea dept has a small budget for small projects; if any extra special costs--
I know some tasks will require going out and having townhall mtgs, so just in process in identifying those costs, still minor from what I've seen so far, but trying to identify those; we do have a special projects budget every year, and at this point it appears we'll be able to accommodate that.

{much made of cost savings; right of Cclr V to ask, in effect, where's the beef.  Townhalls, while desirable I agree, will add to the costs so can't be justified on those grounds.}

Sop: this is received for info tonight; assume going to go back to CEC
where will be written in our desire to keep as under Charter

{great; but the old bureaucratic ploy -- absolutely essential to ask the big question WHEN?}

Mayor: coming next I believe will be staff recommendations for standardizing the processes, publishing workplans, mtg schedules, all of that
look forward to seeing you there b/c we've had a couple of holidays where we've missed one another
Sop: appreciate all that and we'll certainly meet
I want satisfaction that when this report comes back to us, so we don't have to go through this again that there'll be the attachment that we will follow under the Charter: notification, public involvement within the mtgs, right to go in camera,

{Yay, Bill, laid it out!}

and question period at the end of the mtg by the public.

{whoops, not quite.  Go back to what you said so well when muzzling first started.  Please.  Relevant info shd be sought, from whatever source, even the public.}

Mayor: that will all come to CEC, wch you're on and you can help to fashion that report that will come to Ccl.
[JF made motion -- MOTION CARRIES -- I saw VV opposed -- VIVA!]
Mayor: everybody shd know all welcome
{Words are cheap; show me the moolah..
Being welcome to go a meeting no one knows about is hardly "open"; indeed it makes them all de facto closed.}

5.         Appointments to Community Engagement Committee (File:  0116?20?CEC)
RECOMMENDED: THAT the following citizen appointments be made to the Community Engagement Committee for the term ending December 31, 2007: Patti Bolton; and Alex Tunner.
Sop: did read in report will be three
Mayor: one more, will be following up

{strange; the name of Patti Bolton, a friend of the Mayor, appeared as a mbr of the CEC on the DWV website on Apr 7 but not Alex Tunner's and none other -- was her name on before the Apr 2 mtg???}

VV: surprised to see any names; no disrespect to these no doubt v capable indivs
just don't see how you can, on an org chart, place non-elected reps with elected on a Cmnty Engagement Cmte, b/c that exercises authority over the leaders of the WGs, and I don't think that works
think you can have advice from non-elected mbrs but don't think you can empower them to have any kind of authoritative role -- sets rules for other cmtes
don't think any non-elected ppl on their
Mayor: Ccl did make a decision to do that, but I'll refer to Mr Stuart
CAO: as we've done with Fin/Aud we make distinctions as to what items citizen mbrs can participate in and wch not, for example, the actual external audit presentations the citizens wd be excluded from
can take a look at Cclr V's concerns as they apply to the CEC, keeping in mind it's an adv cmte to Ccl; I don't think they make many decisions;

{C'mon.  We all know Ccl makes the final decisions (but some staff try to).}

can take a look and if Terms of Ref have to be revised, can bring that back to Ccl
RD: inclined to agree with Cclr V

{good sign!}

we've got 81 ppl on these nine Working Groups; got resumes and things of this sort not absolutely private
not sure if CEC does other things, cd be has other functions -- not entirely sure they shd be involved in selecting cmte/WG mbrs themselves
CAO: that activity has been done by the ccl mbrs; the next role is to tie up some loose ends for processes for WGs, and then move into the broader issue of our cmnty engagement strategy and policies with the public in general

{ah, those loose ends.  Getting a bit tangled.  And so far it's been a disengagement strategy.}

RD: okay, that's fair enough
Mayor: wch is why appointing them at this point, having done that work, purview of cclrs
systems, on-line forums, all kinds of things, corollary parts of this new approach
to mention backgrounds of these two ppl: one just finished a Master's degree at Royal Roads in citizen engagement; the other was v involved in sgl transferable vote and democratization in the prov; both WV residents, both with a lot to offer around governance, opennness, transparency, and the kinds of things we're really interested in

{offer?  what about promote? demand? who ensures law followed?
if wishes were horses, beggars wd ride........ (if you're familiar with the old English expression so I dared not change it to donkeys)}

we're v fortunate; will be mindful

{oh, do, do be mindful.}

make certain not involved in things of a personal nature.
CARRIED (VV voted against)
6.         Rezoning and Development Permit Application 06?034 (Collingwood School Wentworth Campus) Application Status
Mayor: Ccl is discussing with our staff about the enrolment exceeding the allowable limit for the Morven campus, traffic/congestion challenges; report in two weeks' time; so aware we're working on both
Mr Jamieson: not here to talk about the Wentworth variance changes; phone calls flew around our cmte working group for Glenmore, also keen on openness and transparency
we were led to believe there'd be some discussion re school in Glenmore, their apparent refusal to reduce enrolment, is this the appropriate time?  not listed on Ccl
Mayor: that will come Apr 16; now or better 16th
Jamieson: won't be here; I'll be skiing; our comments clearly relate to transparency and openness in that we really had some difficulty getting some info out of the School... they were to talk to us
huge trust issues; some issues such as underground parking; they clearly lied to us
how does Ccl feel about the bylaw ignorance?  I know there's been some letters recently, from Andy who pointed out that the govt gives a $2208 per student subsidy -- 118 extra students comes to $260,544, these children are paying fairly handsome school fees; there's about $1.5M involved in this
and for that revenue the school is generating, we're carrying the load
this issue started in 2004; I've checked my dated correspondence, communicating with K Lee in the Engg Dept, that started with parking and school numbers
no effort even on a temp a basis reduce even by 20 pupils as a token
quite concerned they're going to get away with it this year and next year, and the devt at Wentworth is going to take more than thre years to come to fruition, and this is just going to go on and on and on
you guys can't ignore it any more; large legal or liability responsibility if there is a fire or medical emergency in our area; at 3pm a 20-min delay -- no doubt some smart lawyers out there who cd get some money of the pockets of the WV Ccl if you're going to ignore this for longer
I do realize the weapons to get the school to comply may be relatively feeble; but on moral high ground, I speak for my neighbours not myself alone, not happy for them to continue overstuffing the school by 120 pupils

{hm, feeble, if they can notify of show cause hearing and Ccl cd pull biz licence and shut school down? fines?  Someone told me this was brought to the M's attention in 2000.  Regardless, what's the procedure that nothing has been done to help the residents and address their concerns quite apart from ensuring our zoning bylaws are adhered to???}

Bruce McCartney: can I pose my questions after I've seen the outline of what the city is proposing?
Mayor: no, unfortunately we hear public input and then we have our discussion and then we move to the next thing
This will come back Apr 16 in another iteration, so maybe better come back Apr 16
BMcC: 98 Glenmore Drive; why I'm here, I found out about this agenda item at  25 to 7, no notice There's a calling tree list among the neighbours in Glenmore saying something's happening at City Hall, impacting us; better get on this
sitting on my deck, looking east, directly over school, in my sightline directly; some sort of visual impact
for good due process, you've heard already suggest shd be transparency, input of public
I can hear the creak of the gate opening ev morning at 6:30, close enough to be consulted
if M limits parking in front of my house b/c convenient for students, suggest houses on Glenmore shd be part of notice
wd like to make it clear; number of ppl will be v active, depending on content of this report, b/c we have not been invited into this process; whatever scope of notice it include us
Mayor: glad you gave them to us now; you will be notified of Apr 16 mtg; you'll be in good shape to participate
CAO: this is Wentworth campus, will be public report on Morven campus; wd like assure residents interested whatever think needs to be done will have a public consultation process
SJN: report will be av one week before the ccl mtg will be on ccl agenda
Mayor: now move to Wentworth proposal just for info at this stage
SJN: this is an applic for rezoning to permit expansion to have an elementary and a middle school
prelim review by staff; proposal altered to comply with envtal concerns; not in condition to be taken out to nbrhd; to be reviewed by Design Review Cmte, before Ccl proceeds
Sop: looked at this; think top of bank shd all be dedicated park; playing fields open to public to use; maybe school look at space for child daycare
traffic off Chairlift; Chippendale presume will be correct and spot for buses, biodiesel
plan; tickets otherwise resident-only parking; cmnty benefits can be derived from this that we shd examine/consider when it comes back to Ccl
VV: Wentworth campus on agenda but the mbrs of public who spoke about Morven
shd assure them taking concerns seriously; not procrastinating or glossed over, dealing with Wentworth now
consult with ppl living around Wentworth area; know about stresses around Morven; response from nbrs
not inclined to hold it up at this point
Mayor: both nbrhds be made aware as will Collingwood's parents
Sop: when back to Ccl -- Design Cmte Apr 5 then?
Mayor: and says public information mtg midApril
SJN: back in May
Sop: early?
SJN: depends; might be variations b/c of speaking with nbrs, expect midMay.
JF: cd staff give Ccl some indication of the 10Kft connector; important aspect.
Mayor: 1000ft connector!
SJN: yes, we'll report on that
7.         Board of Variance Bylaw No. 4487, 2007 :... to be introduced and read a first, second, and third time.
RD: Ccl appoints all five mbrs; present legislation being reviewed
not less than three mbrs -- if not unanimous, tabled to next mtg
RB, Dir/AS: [according to] solicitor, simple majority will apply
RD: even with three mbrs?
RB: yes; as noted in the handout before the mtg
Mayor: just looking
RB: shd hv bn in your blue copies
Mayor: that shd be taken out.  Sorry, Cclr Day; if not time sensitive
apologize for that
7.1       Draft [Five-]Year Capital Plan 2007 - 2011 (File: 0860-01)
RECOMMENDED:  ...   be received and made available for resident comment.
Mayor: b/c I missed the mtg
thank staff for excellent info; getting close
a couple of concerns I'd like to underscore
challenge to stick to stated priorities, not to... ev cmnty wants us to do; bottom line impact
the other thing that came up from staff, significant challenge of attracting staff b/c labour market shrinking
I think our residents' quality of life is directly affected by our staff and their attention to our issues and providing outstanding service
at a health conference at Wosk Ctr Thurs and of the ten [occupations? with] acute shortage; six are health science professionals; by 2015, 85% shortfall in lab technicians.....[etc]; that's just healthcare
feeling already challenge to fill positions in engg and planning
upside for WV, we have such an engaged cmnty; will have to start doing things on our own
branding us as employer of choice; those of us committed to public service will have to pull together to attract....
can't measure what our staff do here
budget discussion for ccl mrgs,  Apr 16, 23, 30
Fin/Aud Cmte will meet weekly starting tomorrow at 4:30, open to the public (Tuesdays)

{two of us attended, hearing this; it went in camera within a few minutes; although there was no item on agenda (when we finally got one after asking) as usual for public questions, Chair M Smith, kindly asked if we had any so we cd before leaving; CAO said it shd hv bn on the agenda and will be in future.  It was the following week.}

to allow to pick up from what happened at ccl mtg; want to continue wrt Fiscal Task Force recommendations
that's on budget writ large
important to begin the debate; going out to public; good for Ccl to understand where Ccl is coming from; wd you like to introduce the capital budget
RL: made av in draft form last Thurs -- sets out proposed prog from 2007 - 11

{there'll be a new draft before the Apr 16 mtg, we learned at the Fin&Aud cmte mtg Apr 10}

recognizes continuing resource constraints until completion of new cmnty ctr; schedules attached-- by mid 2008, final project under RFMP
includes continuation of enhanced infrastructure maintenance
provision of a new police bldg on a placeholder basis
Amb Park infrastructure improvements including a restaurant concession by priv devpr
replacement of Almondel Bridge
capital costs for new radio equipment required for Police Dept joining EComm
details slightly different from orig documentation supplied Mar 12
Funding sources described in report:
new cmnty ctr is funded by combination of Endowment and Capital Facilities Reserve Funds along with long-term borrowings that will cover costs associated with partnership with Vancouver Coastal Health; projected availability of funds, certain assumptions implicit wrt level and timing of land sales
Infrastructure maintenance prog funded from escalating transfers from general operating funds, includes a one-time catch-up transfer from the Endowment Fund in 2007
for new police bldg, depending on its location, likely funded by comb sale of existing site and long-term borrowing for the balance
acquisition of the Argyle props from DCCs and land acquisition reserve funds currently on hand
other projects from comb of reserve funds, cmnty amenity contributions, and partnership arrangements
Conclusions: draft plan ambitious undertaking in light of resource restraints
requires decisions re cmnty amenity policy, certain land sale opps, resolution of disposition of Wetmore site, and reconsideration of the purposes and policies governing the Endowment Fund; most of these were commented on by the Fiscal Task Force.
Mayor: two wishing to speak; begin with David Roach; keep comments to three minutes

David Roach: wd like to suggest, make av the financial position of the District in advance of the Apr 16 mtg; financial position; prelim annual report, balance sheet, for year ending Dec 31
reason: working through report, I notice some real differences, in the amts you can withdraw for 2007/8, about $25M
My own estimate of Y/E based on audited balance 2005, plus reasonable assumptions as to interest earned, and draw of $7M -- don't know if happened, haven't report; land sale of Upper Lands cd be $5 or 7M, but don't know b/c no report; works out perhaps we've got somewhere between ~$26M and $28M as at the end of last year in the Endowment Fund; based on the 2005 threshold value and working forward with a 2% increase for CPI as indicated in the 2007 budget report, the Endowment Fund threshold is about $20M, that leaves us with $6.4 to $8.4M we can draw from the Endowment Fund, but what we have planned from the EF, the latest report from Mr Laing, is $13.7M, a diff of about $5.3M wch for 2007 is slightly different from the $1.7M indicated in Mr Laing's report tonight.  Perhaps the 2007 draw for the Cmnty Ctr wasn't $7M, might hv bn less, but we don't know that, and so the reason I'm asking for the statement of the financial position of the District is to that we can resolve these issues before going to last public mtg Apr 16, 14 days from now.
Mayor: tyvm; over three minutes now, sorry.  We'll try to get that, don't know if it's possible.
{Someone who was curious about how far overtime Dave Roach had gone, tells me he'd spoken for three minutes, 32 seconds to be exact, commenting that given the relative unimportance of the budget it was obviously necessary to remind Mr. Roach that he'd gone overtime; normally she warns and gives a bit of time for someone to sum up.  The financial information however is pretty hard to 'sum up'.}
RL: at the townhall mtg on Th there was a request by Mr Roach to know what the balances were in the Endowment Fund and Capital Facilities Reserve Fund and since then I've actually prepared a five-year projection of the transactions through those funds, and what the balances are at the end of each year; and I can make that av on the web starting tomorrow.
{Oh, you don't say -- two weeks later and no sign of these projections on the website.....}
CAO: Apr 16 is not last chance; planning to have the budget on ev ccl mtg now to mid May; add'l ccl mtg re budget Apr 30
Mayor: and Fin&Aud Cmte mtgs and of course you can provide us your input any time
DR: final comment; when we do this stuff, we seem to get it piecemeal and I'm sure you're getting it piecemeal too; we can't just sit down and look at it all together, one place, one time and get it out of the way, wch wd be an advantage to us and to you.
so if you're able to organize it in such a fashion we cd get this information and have it in front of us, then we cd deal with it once and for all.
CAO: the problem is that the year-end timing is not consistent with our budget cycle and so that's just a reality we have to deal with, we can deal with estimates but, if our goal of concluding budget discussions is in January, we will never be in the position to have all of this Y/E info except on a estimated basis, av for budget discussions -- that's just a practical difficulty that we face.

{Fine, but that wasn't Mr. Roach's question -- why then can't we have the estimated info at the same time as the proposed budget, and the projections, and the FTE staffing tables, and all the other data necessary for informed discussion... if informed discussion is really what you want.  This is a question of not only why is it so late, but also why do we have to drag it out, piecemeal as he says?  Why does anyone have to ask when mtgs are or when the needed information will be available?  We've pointed out that salary information is available at the end of Feb when T4s sent in but that's been refused as well.}

CR: Editor of WV Matters, 1497 Marine Drive;  couple of questions
wd also like to echo Mr Roach's comments of having statements as of Dec 31st; I think if it's difficult at least some sort of estimate wd be better than nothing -- that wd be my comment on that, whatever cd be done.
I agree that if we had it all, we can't really comment on this until we see that, and also I had asked for Information Technology (IT) information, but anyway, as long as we have it before -- is it by the 16th you said we'd have it, or tomorrow we wd have some of the Y/E information?
CAO: we're presenting info to the Fin/Aud cmte mtg tomorrow, and hoping to run as much of this info over the next two weeks through that cmte, so that we can make it av to the public
CR: will public be able to attend that F&A mtg?
CAO: I believe so

{Ah, yes.  UPDATE: We attended that mtg and as soon as they were about to present that information they declared they were going in camera and we had to leave, but that was a great soundbite for TV, wasn't it.  Never did get the IT budget info last year so hope to this year.}

CR: Thank you; the other question I have about, ah, I see it has land sales, and I wd like to know the process as to the decision-making for land sales.  In particular when the Wetmore property was purchased, the commitment was made that there wd be widespread public consultation as to what to do with the Wetmore prop; I understand for land sales what you got from Ministry or BPP or whatever, something you don't really need public input for, but to sell some of the public land, it has come to my attention that in the past sometimes park land has been up for sale and the public wd like to know about that, and I'd like to be on record that the commitment was made that use of the Wetmore prop wd have widespread public consultation before it was sold or whatever is going to be done with it.
Thank you.

Sop: timeline, maybe May have to make decisions on budget; don't have many mtgs left
Mr Laing who's had a difficult time in trying to put this forward
consideration for our land holdings, ie, Wetmore site
I've often commented shd look at all our holdings, having plan and priority re a site, rather than selling off valuable land to meet budget obligations
second, shd hv public mtg wrt threshold of Endowment Fund whether to be altered
the infrastructure in some cases near fail-safe, need of ongoing increased funds to meet demands of future
unless we adopt new principles even in this five-year budget going to find ourselves ev year back in same situation
over years had pay-as-you-go; we've invested, in our recreation, investment at 22nd is going to turn out to be a great plan, with the Health Assn and all that's there
we knew wd hv demand on us, once that is out of the way, now have a new situation
issues start cropping up: Almondel Bridge, $3M bill have to face now, other amts $1M; seems to me a never-ending story
demands and pressure on budget not going to be solved in three or four mtgs
I think we need some drastic thoughts on new modelling in relationship to how going to find ourselves in serious trouble; taxpayer and pressure on prop tax; inevitable; certainly, look at new modelling for Engg Dept how to raise funds in future
cmnty amenities, take serious look -- eased up sewer plants by devprs in future
all ways and means providing release of some pressure
you're going to another mtg tomorrow, Madam Mayor, another pressure on prop tax
don't know what direction that's going to go; diff time, have to take a serious look, not move along without some public input esp when it comes to selling our land.

VV: v interesting study of our capital position
are we living within our means or not? perhaps Dir/Fin might help with that
money moves in and out of funds
take Mr Roach's remarks, $5M discrepancy
-- so my question around Cap Reserves and End'mt Fund
some intent to sell some other lands, proceeds reimburse the Endowment Fund"
I don't think that's as simple as it sounds; do own [Wetmore] site and others
if selling to get money, predicated on assumption with decent zoning, so that someone can build multiple housing units on it; without that not much money coming to us as result of sale; depends on accepting further densification
less than a week ago, final report of MOT by consultant Urban Systems on LGB to Hwy 1 connector planning study; that tells us how much cost us to restore the waiting times now we have at the LGB if we carry on with our planned devts, on WV side it's $100M
if you look at 4000 dwellings our OCP says, we wd have to charge those new dwellings $25K as a fee, extra DCC just to pay our share to rearrange approaches so not waiting any longer than now
see all this as connected
want to sell land to get money, then more ppl, then probs at bridgehead; cause us to incur other costs
quite curious about this nice little fund Golf Devt Fund, identifies $875K voted a year ago--  to rehabilitate bldg we meant the panabode bldg -- gone a whole year, money not spent to rehabilitate that bldg, given to understand other proposals
I don't understand this, once money in a fund that we voted for a special fund, is it legal for it to be appropriated for an alternate purpose?
CAO: when Ccl approves a budget, we're obligated to proceed; sure Ccl comfortable with scope, etc
what happens with five-yr; there are a number of reports that come back to Ccl, particularly capital expenditures
no question of legality, just putting aside funds
recently rather than for reserve fund, instead for banquet hall
issues Ccl has the opp to debate, not only inclusion in capital budget, particularly eg Grt Hall, if gap and wdn't proceed unless funding for gap
Wetmore was an investment, full understanding to return to Endowment Fund; if not, then wd hv to find funds to replace the value of that contribution.

{--but bought for around $6M and now worth $12 - 20M, depending on zoning.  Many options.  Cd zone it multifamily sell or lease for pots of $ while keeping perhaps the bottom two or three floors -- for an art gallery, or some other civic/cmnty use thus return the original sum pocket the profit and still have it owned by the M!  Again, put out for widespread cmnty consultation, not just during budget crush time with belated and incomplete picture/information.}

VV: re Golf fund, staff seek to save Ccl from its own folly? is that why delay?
[chuckling] that's impossible, we have to have our golf clubhouse
Mayor: whole bunch of process before anything spent.
JF: v interesting five-year cap plan; good look at what we've been doing
ongoing maintenance, upgrading, sewer, etc, spent a lot of money but nec, for many years, little had gone on; behind eight ball so to speak; same for rec facilities, nothing had taken place
have spent a lot of money in last few; well spent; providing facilities used for next 30 to 40 years; a lot of social and health needs
I too think set aside time for a public process and to deal with Endowment Fund threshold as well as decisions re land
one of first may be police stn; cont with Amb plans, what happens on corner of 13th pivotal; sooner public can be involved the better
any input received from the two draft policies at same time, amenities and sponsorship -- any public input on those?
Mayor: any we know of?
SJN: public sponsorship one has been reviewed by adv cmte, public, will be reporting back to Ccl

MS: not quite sure where to go with this
we're not approving these projects tonight, it's a draft plan out to public for comment, not in position re voting tonight
blunt reality is that at the end of 2000 we had $51.5M in Capital Reserves, got an awful lot less now, and will have an awful awful lot less when the cmnty ctr's paid for
We have here proposal from staff, the general fund alone over next five years for $118M worth of projects, so if you knock off $33M for the cmnty ctr, leaves $85M for next five years

{whoa, wooo-oo-oo!  don't you recall the days when Mayor Wood just a few years ago presented a Ten-Year Capital Plan for $40M that was 'set in stone'?  This more than double proposed in half the time!} 

IMO the whole mark of a good biz or good org, protection of capitalism is key, that's why they call it capitalism; you have to be constantly protecting your capital base
I wd like to see this, and hv seen prev Ccls, replacing capital as they spend it, b/c the reality is there's always gong to be a demand for capital
we see it now, $85M for next five years; always be a demand; when we see proposals to lower thresholds, these types of things, I really view them with alarm.  I don't think it's the way to go. This Endowment Fund was est'd years ago so District wd hv a nest egg earning interest, think it was a wise decision
For this or any other Ccl to change IMO it not the correct way to do biz
shd go forward with plan, get public comments
challenge for us and staff is to come up with ways of taking some of our assets to generate new capital, to replace signif drain on capital we've had in last few years; look forward to what the public has to say.
Mayor: wonder if Mr Laing or Mr Stuart cd comment wrt restrictions we operate under LGA, Endowment Fund, capital
CAO: and the kitchen sink
Mayor: know we need to bring some things in compliance
CAO: re Endowment Fund, bylaw itself needs to be updated to bring in compliance with Charter
number of issues re purpose of fund, what expenditures allowed; expectation generally not nest egg without ideas what to spend on
issues around what is appropriate threshold, things thrown into bylaw when created
questions around appropriate threshold;

{AAWOOGA!!! "questions around appropriate threshold" =  possible translation: "how can we manipulate the Endowment Fund so we can get at more of that money?"  Keep your eyes open -- someone wants to raid the piggy bank and suggestions there are questions about the "appropriate threshold" are nothing less than advanced warning of the raiding party making plans , that is unless you think they're going to raise the threshold.}

issues around bylaw, conforming with Charter
will be bringing a report to Ccl dealing with the mechanics of that
wrt capital in general, Endowment Fund now is beneficiary of all land sales; rules what we can spend operating money on; what we can do in terms of sales of assets, what we can do with that money
general rule, you can't relieve yourself of assets without reinvesting or at least without committing themselves towards capital investments, you can't be selling property and investing that in operating costs; fairly tight rules around how we operate
In add'n rules coming in how we value assets, from an appreciation standpoint
want to assure Ccl what's being proposed here is certainly legal and within Ccl's ability to make a decision on
some v important policy assumption: include Ccl willing to consider debt, for example for the construction of a Police bldg -- not in this year so Ccl has a number of years for Ccl to consider how to approach that -- ; there's a presumption that when we built the cmnty ctr, there wd be profit that wd emanate from the Wetmore site that we wd use toward the costs of the cmnty ctr,

{That's news to me -- flipping Wetmore to pay off cost overruns on the cmnty ctr !?!?!? I don't recall any discussion of that when Wetmore was purchased -- Ron Wood made it emphatic that there wd be broad consultation b/c there'd been some criticism of such a large purchase.
Besides, does anyone really think that's what the community thought the Wetmore purchase was to be used for, or wants done with it now?
Roll back tape.  When I queried about some funding a few years ago on the plans labelled as 'land sales', b/c I know WV has very little M-owned land, the MMgr said it was 'lanes and street ends, for example'.}

so there's an assumption of some land sales.  There's the sale of the Horseshoe Bay firehall site, another example.  Those were built into the capital planning model under wch Ccl approved prev projects.
In add'n: partnerships, eg Ambleside concession; cmnty amenity contributions.
staff constraints are that we're not going to go ahead with a particular project unless revenue source is in the account and av to us and Ccl has the opp to approve that.
This Five-Year Plan is a framework, consistent with the Fiscal Task Force it is departing, not just depending on capital reserves; agree things are changing
lots of policy issues here
laying the framework for our Ten-Year Capital.

{Again, note assumption of selling Wetmore when promise made taking money to buy it, there'd be FULL public consultation as to what to do with that property/asset?}

**********  ADDED AGENDA ITEM: Add'l ccl mtg Apr 30 -- PASSED

Sop left for EvDr b/c of conflict of interest
8.         Evelyn Drive Area:  Official Community Plan Bylaw No. 4360, 2004, Amendment Bylaw No. 4492, 2006 and Zoning Bylaw No. 2200, 1968, Amendment Bylaw No. 4493, 2006 ("the Two Bylaws")
The Two Bylaws received first reading on November 14, 2006.  A Public Hearing regarding the Two Bylaws was held on December 04, 2006 and closed. The Two Bylaws received second and third reading on December 18, 2006.  BOTH RECOMMENDED FOR ADOPTION
JC: since two will read separately for separate vote
JC: Zoning
9.         Consent Agenda Items - Reports and Correspondence
10.       Development Variance Permit Application 07?003 (7040 Marine Drive)
            THAT the report dated March 16, ... be received for consideration on Monday, April 23, 2007.
11.       Development Applications Status List (File:  1010?01)
            RECOMMENDED THAT the Development Applications Status List be received.
12.       West Coast Railway Association - Royal Hudson Steam Train (File:  1605?15/1610?20?1684)
            THAT Council approve an exemption from the Sounding of Train Whistles Prohibition Bylaw No. 1684, 1958 for the West Coast Railway Association to allow the Royal Hudson Steam Train to sound its whistle while passing through West Vancouver on two trips scheduled for April 14 and 16, 2007.
13.       Correspondence List (entire in prev issue) -- RECOMMENDED: ... be received.
Mayor: [items wanted] removed?
VV: remove item 8 [13.8] re Gleneagles Golf Course; discuss later?
RD: 13.1
Mayor: [Receipt] Motion carries.  Begin with Correspondence item 13.1

(1)       March 19, 2007, regarding Parkside Road - Construction and Vandalism
        Referred to the Director of Planning, Lands & Permits, and the Director of Administrative Services for consideration and response.
RD:  letter from Wally and Dorothy Beck.  I think this is the Wally Beck who's the jazz musician whose music I've enjoyed over the years, I'm not sure.  Pretty sad story.  Lived in house for 50 years and a big big huge house being built right next to them destroying their peace and tranquillity, just hope that our new WG on Housing and Nbrhd Planning can take a look at some of the problems our residents are having with some of these spec devts [on] lots next to our houses, and making life pretty hard for ppl, and this is a good letter about what ppl are up against.  I'd just like to note that and hope the WG can come up with some solutions as a way of protecting our nbrhds.

{OOOO!  How daring!  he even put a name to the letter that staff had carefully deleted!!!  Surprised his knuckles weren't rapped!
For those late to this scene, censorship (or removing letters from public eyes) under the guise of protection of privacy started in November.  They've relented, after the absurdity was pointed out, wrt organizations.  More work needed on this to see the light.}

Mayor: 13.8, Gleneagles Golf Course
(8)       March 24, 2007, regarding Gleneagles Golf Course Project
        Referred to the Director of Parks & Community Services for consideration and response.
VV: letter from someone nearby, potential for noise construction and rented out for functions
been thought about to extent doesn't disturb nbrhd
suppose we intend to deal with parking; safe for pedestrians; points raised in his letter, doubt been addressed yet; looking for assurances concerns will be addressed
CAO: one of the reasons this project has not gone had; appropriateness; interests golf course, those wanting to save, ecology, parking; such a divergence of views
those who want to save banquet hall, ... parking, am trying to have a game plan outlined ev supportive of, given Ccl's decision apparently to go ahead with both proposals
once had mtg, will be reporting back to Ccl; none of the concerns new
Mayor: this is beginning of a process; beginning with CAO, myself, Mr Pike, interested residents --all aspects, soon, next week?
CAO: trying to schedule that now
Sop: why is Ccl not involved?
CAO: Ccl directed staff to meet with the residents so that's what we're doing initially, will report back to Ccl
Mayor: point is to report back to Ccl on process
Sop: you'll meet with public, you'll report to us, then we'll say go meet with public again?
Mayor: idea is to come up with a process; got to start somewhere
Sop: after all these years, this issue, involves many areas; Ccl shd be involved from the outset and dealing with it and getting on with it; this process of going back and forth, back and forth, another seven months go by; don't know if right way
CAO: we're pretty clear directions from Ccl; only issues scope of project and issues
will be reporting back to ccl, don't think five to seven months; mtg quickly
dealing with now, on same site or separate
what's scope of Gtt Hall project, pro-shop, bistro; how confirm costs, get conceptual designs
think can move on this and bring something back to Ccl
again residents have pointed out noise, have to be sensitive to that
Sop: certainly have to talk to public about those issues
concerns me, think there's misconstrued position where Ccl believes this facility shd be and where staff believes it shd be; that came up last time before us
assuming when we undertook to look at this and fund it; we were assuming one particular site, was the old site and surrounding it.  I know for a fact staff have made presentations out there and have a different view, that they want this bldg elsewhere.  I want to know specifically what staff's intentions are in relationship to where they want it built.
CAO: quite aware of Cclr Sop's preferences and some mbrs of Ccl; direction we got was to meet with Golf and ppl saving Grt Hall and arrive at a decision both can support; direction we got and will report back to Ccl
Sop: what's staff position where it shd be?
Mayor: positions, a little early; having watched Ccl's decision on DVD and after several years of trying to put this on the agenda of the select cmte on Rec Facilities and not something they wanted to tackle, I think it's great the direction Ccl set.
I think sending the MManager, the Dir of Parks, and the Mayor to sit down for a preliminary mtg to scope out a process, a budget, cmnty involvement, what mbrs of Ccl want to be involved that's where we're beginning great
not a decision or positional type of mtg, it's a beginning
Sop: beg to differ; on basis we want look at golf plan to cover costs, maintenance in future
at time we made some decisions; as Cclr Day, let's take a look and get serious, wasted five years in not looking at it; assumption was all on one site and if we're going to divvy up and look at borrowing
not so sure want to go into debt for a bldg on the first green
certainly I'd be looking at advantage of a bldg around the Grt Hall, saved funds for it and borrow for rest; based on a golf plan that wd pay for this over a period of time; not that golf revenues go back into general revenue; we'd have a format, a biz plan; besides talking to the cmnty out there
my assumption at time; seems to have withered away
disturbing  to me staff feel still on first tee
CAO: we're not withering anything away
assure Ccl if as result after deliberation, consensus is all together, fine with us.
Mayor: let's draw this decision to a close
Sop: as long as someone's getting the msg
RD: take it that staff is interviewing the groups; seems WRA has one site in mind and the golfers another, makes it tricky; attempt to find a compromise; difficult to obtain but got to do it
CAO: have two groups with goals and hope to find a way to do that; trying to schedule that mtg.


MS: first mtg of childcare WG; went v well; citizens excellent choices

[no notice!!!]

staff; needless to say cclr strong addition to group
one of the first challenges is the Cedardale; need to have mtg with the Sch Bd
1200 students moving into schools and we're moving them out
all mbrs of Ccl and Sch Bd together with staff -- resolve best for all residents of WV including chn
Mayor: asked Meghan to set that mtg up; time for Ccl and Sch Bd to get together

RD: on Rodgers Crk Working Group -- all been up there now, three separate trips up there
up a few days ago, had sun; prev group went up in the driving rain -- site is steep just as well b/c a lot of creeks appear in winter and disappear in summer; challenge in that area, clear to concentrate on flat areas, and leave steep alone; fair degree of consensus on cmte and owners; diff site to develop, have to do it sensitively
Apr 12 next mtg, public is always invited, BPP will be making a detailed analysis of its challenges on that site, giving a clear picture of what it hopes to do in response, in response cmte will get into discussion with BPP; again public invited; on Apr 12 here 5:30 in Ccl Chambers

{despite all his best intentions and efforts, not quite sure of situation; pls see my email to Rod of incredulity and confusion trying to find out what was going on in section below just after this (Apr 9/12).
As you'll see, on Apr 9 still NOT on website, neither on the Calendar nor on WG's webpage;
LATER: not on Apr 15 either!}

JF: The Ambleside Study WG met last Tuesday from 8-10am at Ch/Comm bdroom. We had one mbr of the public attend

{AMPWG -- no notice!
AND they've had two mtgs, not just one (I have email from JF saying that) without notice
and saying one with public present?  ha! FARCE! it was the spouse of one of the mbrs!
not surprising when no notice but rather misleading to say a mbr of public there....}
interesting mtg for our first get together
realize rather complex issue to discuss and attempting initially to decide the process, come to some consensus, how going to approach this, what were issues of primary concern, list priorities, what first before second
did game sticky notes, wrote three most important issues; fascinating experiment; managed to get them all prioritized; wide-ranging discussion, creative input, amenable disagreement at this point; we'll have to see how goes from there

Sop: a report will be coming shortly to Ccl from Soc Services, grants -- got it done in record time, ahead of other Ms; shows what a team of grt ppl can do including a qualified cclr
{several chuckles}
also started second phase on a recommendation to Ccl, on a triM basis; think we hv to look at Sq Nation too wrt social services; you kindly with Mr Stuart will get someone to be on bd with us, think it's vital
shortly will be starting up Envtal WG -- assure you end of year incredible positions for Ccl to look at,far-reaching and leadership as well
you and I, Mdm Mayor have yet to start Cmtny Ctr governance model -- Apr 15 I think
what I've seen, and on Fiscal Task Force, engaging new citizens, action cmtes so know they have tasks, awfully informed; think will find resounding success

Mayor: look forward to results
went to opening of new ultrasound Sat at LGH
struck me no issue with private contributions -- strength of cmnty there that morning; families shared stories; one family named a room for the doctor who helped them
lot to learn from the LGH Fdn...  Congratulations to them and can feel empowered by them.


CR:  Sorry, after not coming for some time, now a few times, but I wanted to follow up on something that was said.
I listened to Cclr Vaughan's comments about the money {with this new system of WGs}, and I think there's still the same staff, there's still goodies served, but I think one of the advantages of the new system is the web forum {if/when it works}; I think that's a new thing that's great in the new system.  I don't want Cclr Day to think I was referring to him (RodgersCrWG).  They say they've had five mtgs; it was another cmte/WG that had had seven mtgs without notices, not Cclr Day's.  He's worked v v hard to try to get notices up.
RD: seven times!  I thought we were Number One.
Sop: no, the Social Services [WG]; time sensitive about the grants, we had to
Mayor: talking about money
RD: oh, okay.
CR: glad to hear going to be notices
I understand you're going to come up with guidelines as to when and where the notices, how long, and that's going to come when?
Mayor: Mr Stuart may know the date; all will be on the website

{Trust us.  All will be revealed.  In the fullness of time.
Stay Calm. Be Brave. Wait for the Signs.}

CAO: met with staff this afternoon; Sheila's drafted up some guidelines;

{rather belatedly, no?}

we're just going to incorporate some fine-tuning and put that on the website.

{the fine-tuning?  how about the main melody?  or just the metronome???}

Our hope is that in fact the WGs will not just look at 24 hours [for the notice], but in fact schedule for the balance of the year to the extent that they can and put that on the website.  We're also talking about a way to make sure when you go to District's website, on the home page, you can just go to one link and immediately go to all the schedules for all the WGs.
CR: Right.  That's what I was going to ask, is where, b/c I know some of them have been having [them, info] around the actual WG name and most ppl don't go there.  Most helpful, just if you'd like to know at least what I find, is just to click on the Ccl and Cmnty Calendar.  So if you click on the Calendar you get your ccl mtgs and things like that, and that's really v helpful.  I use that as the one-stop for all the mtgs.  Other places that's fine but we find Calendar most helpful.
I'm still a little worried at the end of the discussions about that item, and I'm seeking clarification about the closed mtgs.  Possibly the CAO is not aware but in fact there was a WG that voted to have their next mtg closed.  So that's not following the LGA [Cmnty Charter], and I know Mr Stuart thinks they [WGs] have been [complying with the legislation], but they haven't.

{that's the statement he made earlier in the evening and I didn't want listeners to think that was the case, so felt compelled to set the record straight. 
It's quite a subtle point I'm trying to clarify.  The CAO said the WGs were complying with the legislation b/c he has a legal opinion that WGs don't have to comply.
Get my drift?
Maybe we shd get them to specifically promise they'll abide by the legislation no matter what name they call a group that meets to provide recommendations to Ccl (except staff of course).} 

The next thing, and I'm sure it's not going to happen again, so I just wanted to let you know.  That was part of the cause of the worry of some ppl, that some mbrs cd just vote to close a mtg, and that was it.  So I am glad to hear you're going to have some guidelines, but also, Cclr Smith then said if they've got some good reasons, then they can do it.

{he's subsequently said he'll abide by the legislation.}

Well, I'm afraid that I think I wd like to stick with the LGA and at the ADRA AGM Feb 6th, Cclr JF then committed that all her mtgs to go in camera wd follow the LGA--
JF: --my mtgs, I don't speak for other groups

{as you see below, I refrained from pointing out that JF had just had two WG mtgs with NO notification to the public!  By now you'll be depressed to realize that even listening to all the ccl mtgs, you don't get the whole story, you get what some want you to hear.}

CR: Right, for your mtgs.  And I think what some of us are asking, just as Cclr V was saying, Ccl and Ccl cmte mtgs are restricted to what they can declare in camera, that that shd apply to all mtgs, and that it shd not just be suddenly, "we don't want to discuss this in public".  I think if you're going to have guidelines, and Ccl now, Ccl cmtes, have the guidelines of in camera according to the LGA/Cmnty Charter, but all your WGs, or whatever you want to call them, shd hv the same guidelines for in camera.  So if that's made clear, and ppl understand it, then I think there wdn't be any confusion.
Mayor:  that's the spirit we're talking about, I think.
CR: that's the spirit of the--
CAO: the intent is to meet the spirit; the difficulty is with the Charter, you also get into all kinds of v finite wranglings around procedures and how minutes are dealt with, and what we're trying to do is adopt the spirit of the legislation but make sure we don't adopt all the unnec technicalities associated with it.

{His word -- it is obvious that it has required the services of a head wrangler to twist out from under the legislation by various twisted means.}

So that's the purpose of the guidelines, to ensure the spirit is met

{but the basic question remains: why was notification stopped in the first place? and why were all the previous advisory groups trashed in first part of last year and replaced by a new set of "working groups" and then, after dozens of meetings, did someone think it time to formulate some "guidelines" on how these group might operate? one might be excused for wondering if this isn't another case of the proverbial cart before the horse and with our being left behind to pick up the droppings.....}

so that the groups are not, and I'll just go back to some of the comments we heard when we reviewed the cmtes, how do we deal with minutes, how detailed do the agendas have to be, how detailed do the minutes have to be, how do they get approved, how do they not get approved, how do we get the notices up, the comment that having the notices outside the Ccl Chamber, wch is the statutory obligation, doesn't really meet the intent of the Act.  So what we're trying to do here is put together some guidelines that meet the intent of the Act but provide the groups with the flexibility. The only issue I've heard to this point from the groups is how do we deal with something, that at this point we just want to talk about, it's not ready to go out into the public; it wd be inappropriate if it was commented on in the public, until we've had a chance to consider it, and how do we deal with that.  And so we've got to struggle with ensuring we meet the intent of the Act and yet deal with those kinds of sensitivities.
CR: Okay. Well, we appreciate the fact that it cd be on the cmnty calendar or wherever you tell us it's going to be; we appreciate the fact that you're probably saying that notes wd be more efficient than minutes -- have no problem with that -- but I do have a problem with if, when a body decides, "we're uncomfortable discussing this in public".  This is public biz, this is an open democracy.  You discuss things in public except for those things in camera, I really don't see why anybody else... b/c it's the natural tendency of ppl to say, I just want to talk about this and not be responsible for what I say or whatever ..., I mean it's just a tendency anywhere; that's why there have had to be rules about going in camera, b/c most ppl wd rather not speak in public.  So that's my concern -- is that the in camera rules [LGA/Cmnty Charter], they shd apply everywhere, no problem with that; but to give a group, saying, well, we're just uncomfortable with that, I'm sorry I don't think that meets the intent or spirit of the legislation wch was specifically designed to stop that.
thank you
Mayor: thank you

{Background, FYI:
it was the Rodgers Crk Area WG that voted its next mtg wd be closed -- for a presentation by British Pacific Properties, the landowner of most of the area, no less!!!
Members don't have that right!
Ccl/Cclrs can't even simply vote that their next mtg will be closed.
And the Mayor was at that RCAWG mtg -- why did she allow it?  why didn't she point out not just that that's not possible/proper/legal, but also that she did not favour such exclusions?  who wd have dared counter her?  why not insist on open mtgs?  didn't she campaign on openness?
The essential point is that the LGA/Cmnty Charter provides for in camera; it is only for those reasons possible; that's what we seek assurance of, NOT someone's whim or opinion or feeling it shd be closed.  Secrecy, greed of devpr, deals, not to be facilitated.
There has been more lack of public notification/inclusion than I've ever seen before in 20 years of being involved in M affairs.}

Keith Pople: My question tonight concerns a procedure used by Ccl, one of the agenda items, the Ev Drive one in wch it is recommended bylaws be adopted.  Back in Dec, I think it was agreed by Ccl that prior to adopting any one of these amending bylaws, it wd be nec to present a master plan.  To my knowledge the master plan has not been presented yet.  Wonder why looking at adopting this bylaw.
Mayor: v good question; a lot of work still to be done.
SJN: the condition that Ccl placed on adoption is that a covenant be entered into, registered on title, that wd say that the prop wd not be developed until a master plan was produced and approved by Ccl.  That covenant is now registered on title.  The condition was met by Ccl.  The bylaws themselves are now, they have now been put in place by Ccl, they est'd the general parameters, but the master plan has yet to be produced.  It will be produced, it will be submitted to Ccl, it will go through the Designed Review Cmte, it will be put out for public comment.  It will then come back to Ccl for approval, and at that point in time, a second covenant will be put on title to replace the first covenant.  That second covenant will be that the land shall only be devpd in accordance with the master plan
KP: are you saying there is a master plan now?
SJN: no, there is not a master plan now; there's a covenant on title requiring a master plan before any devt occurs on the site.
KP: the way I read it, was that the adoption of the bylaws wd require the completion of the master plan, and discussion by Ccl
SJN: requires covenant placed on title that the prop wd not be developed in the absence of a master plan approved by Ccl.

===   WG LAMENTS: Apr, 6, 9, 12&nb= sp; ===  to Cclrs Day, Smith, Soprovich, Vaughan
fyi  Apr 6 appended with Intro and Update Apr 12 at end.

Just checked the DWV website and there was no change on the home page, the WG page, or the Calendar.
IOW the home page says there are mtgs planned for 12th and 26th (but does not say where or when), the WG page says there's a mtg Apr 26 with the proposed agenda to be confirmed on the 12th, and there's no reference whatsoever to any RCAWG mtg in April.
It's not just that a procedure shd hv bn established along with the WGs, but also on Feb 5th I was told procedures wd be put in place, and Apr 2nd (and before) assurances made about notification, public, etc.  With all the goodwill in the world, it is hard to take seriously the commitment (or is it incompetence and lack of organization so all unintentional and truly unfortunate) to providing the public with meaningful information or opportunities for involvement.
Is it a policy now?
Can you give me a date you think it will be followed?
The Calendar is the most efficient (one stop) to use and put in the newsletter.
If you put a link to the Calendar on the home page, it wd be much easier for the public to find out what mtgs are on.
Again, my constructive suggestion is that one person be in charge of maintaining the Calendar -- and be accountable.
======================== =========================<= /div>

Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 18:05:42 -0700
To: day
From: Carolanne Reynolds <EditorWVM@WestVan.org>
Subject: Working Groups / DWV Website
Cc: bill, vivian, mikes, dstu, pleslie

Much appreciated that Dave Stuart said at the last ccl mtg the WGs wd be on the website.
Thx to Patricia for a link on the DWV home page that comes up.
Thanks to you for pushing to get notification of Rodgers Crk Area WG mtgs.

Here's the status and you'll find it confusing --
        -- but not surprising,
                rather a continuation of chaos and missing information -- even contradictory!
For example, no Cmnty Engagement Cmte mtgs listed after January (below copy and pasted from DWV website) -- though appointments were made after that date.
Agendas don't even have the item for the Public any more.
And nobody seems to have noticed or cared until I pointed it out.
IMHO, it is outrageous and far from the intent of the Cmnty Charter to have mbrs of a WG vote to close their next mtg.  As Cclr Vaughan asked last week, how can powers be extended to a cmte that Ccl itself does not have?  And this is quite apart from the principle of promises of transparency.
It's not that cclrs aren't welcoming from my experience or staff polite (staff chaired the Cmnty Grants/NShSocial Services mtg), but some of these 'new' arrangements are far from what was basic in the past.
We're no longer talking just about notification.  There are no longer agendas available for a resident to pick up.  Mtg binders are non-existent.  We were given an agenda at the Fin & Audit cmte mtg when we cdn't find one (and that puts a resident in an awkward position, shd not have to ask).   When told to leave b/c it was going in camera (but without the motion to do so having been made while public still present), I wondered if I cd ask some questions b/c no such item on the agenda.
Again, I must thank Dave Stuart for saying that was an omission and will be done in future.  Hope so.
Thought bubble at time: no one has apparently been concerned about notification to ensure it (except your Herculean efforts, but note none of Cclr Vaughan's WGs have met yet), and many oblivious to the omission of that item.
Was told the unannounced seven mtgs of the Cmnty Grants/NSh were b/c of 'privacy' or 'personal nature' of grants.  I pointed out that surely the grants were for organizations and none to residents so no personal information discussed.  Besides, and at that time I chose not to debate, the grant process in past years was always done during a Cmnty Srvces adv cmte mtg often with several residents present.  It's public money.  There is no justification for doing it in camera.  B/c of some feelings of favouritism in the past a former chairman and his group developed a set of criteria to make it more objective and it worked well.  This time we don't even know what system was used or how done b/c no one knew about the mtgs.

By now, you realize that these  issues are all central to democracy and pledges for open, transparent govt.  I know you and some other councillors share that opinion.   Although I've spoken privately on several occasions over the past months, it is now time to give concrete examples in the hope that not only openness from the past that has been closed

Clicking on the link (on the home page below) for WGs shows only one listed, yours (Rodgers Crk).  It says the next mtg is Apr 26th, saying the agenda to be confirmed on the 12th, presumably once confirmed this Apr 26th agenda will be sent out.  There's no mtg listed for the 12th however the home page says there are mtgs on the 12th and 26th.   The DWV Calendar has no RCrkWG mtg either on the 12th or the 26th, none for April at all.

Please allow me to suggest for the umpteenth time that Ccl (or the MMgr as CAO) designate someone with the responsibility of not only having mtg information on the website but also accurate/consistent.
Given the list of salaries over $75K for staff as of 2005 (and undoubtedly they are much higher two years later), there must be someone to whom that task can be given and be accountable for rather than, as it appears, be spread out among various staff mbrs unable to coordinate successfully or assure either correct or complete information.

This has gone on so long as to be unconscionable.
It is my hope that you and others will ensure notification, adherence to the  Cmnty Charter, and restore the public's right to attend plus be invited to provide relevant or pertinent information at the appropriate time if what has been presented has omitted facts or been incorrect (honest mistakes have been made in the past, not just incompleteness).

The three sections referred to appear below (so you don't have to go surf the website yourself).
=====  >>> ALL FROM DWV WEBSITE <<<  =====
1>>> ******* Upcoming Meetings (Working Groups)
As of April 4, 2007, below is a list of upcoming, public meetings for the Working Groups:
Rodgers Creek Area Working Group
April 26th, 2007
Main Floor Conference Room (Municipal Hall)
Agenda (to be confirmed on the 12th):
        *       Mulgrave to present
        *       Dann's to present their equestrian proposal
        *       Built Form Principles and Character
Go To Top
2>>> *******  CALENDAR
----- April 10, 2007 -----
Finance & Audit Comm. Mtg.
4:30 PM-7:00 PM (MFCR)
----- April 13, 2007 -----
Southern Straits Race
8:00 AM-12:00 PM (Start-Dundarave Pier)
----- April 16, 2007 -----
Committee of the Whole Mtg.
7:00 PM-10:00 PM (Council Chamber) (every Monday from 7:00 PM to 10:00 PM)
----- April 18, 2007 -----
Library Board
7:00 PM-8:30 PM (Peters Room, WV Memorial Library) (day 21 of every 1 month from 7:00 PM to 8:30 PM)
Board of Variance
7:00 PM-9:00 PM (Council Chambers) (the third Wednesday of every 1 month(s) from 7:00 PM to 9:00 PM)
----- April 19, 2007 -----
Design Review Comm. Mtg. (MOVED FROM APRIL 26TH)
4:30 PM-8:30 PM (Council Chambers)
N.S. Family & Youth Justice Comm.
5:30 PM-7:30 PM (CNV Municipal Hall, Conf Rm A) (every 3 weeks on Thursday from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM)
----- April 20, 2007 -----
North Shore Writers Festival 2007
April 20-April 28 (WV, NV, CNV Libraries)
----- April 21, 2007 -----{NB: Informed them this the wrong date, it's 28th; DWV website now fixed}
Streamkeepers Adopt-A-Fish
10:00 AM-2:00 PM (WV Memorial Library)
----- April 22, 2007 -----
Earth Day Celebration
All Day (G.E. Comm. Centre)
----- April 23, 2007 -----
Council Meeting
7:00 PM-10:00 PM (Council Chamber) (every Monday from 7:00 PM to 10:00 PM)
----- April 26, 2007 -----
Carnival & Amusement Rides
April 26-April 29 (G.E. Comm. Centre)
Design Review Comm. Mtg. (MOVED TO APRIL 19TH) (NOTE TIME CHANGE)
3:30 PM-7:30 PM (Council Chambers)
5:00 PM-7:00 PM (DNV Municipal Hall)
Police Board Mtg.
7:00 PM-9:00 PM (WV Chamber of Commerce Boardroom)
----- April 30, 2007 -----
Council Meeting
7:00 PM-10:00 PM (Council Chamber) (every Monday from 7:00 PM to 10:00 PM)
3>>> *******  HOME PAGE
Budget 2007
Budget 2007 was presented at a Town Hall Meeting, and Council is still receiving public comment on the draft budget
Upcoming Meetings (Working Groups)
Public meetings, for April, include the Rodgers Creek Area Working Group on April 12 and April 26.
Hay Park Stewardship Event
Join West Van Secondary Students on Sunday, April 15th
Celebrate Earth Day at Gleneagles Community Centre
On April 22nd, 10 am - 1 pm
Opportunity - Wellness & Complementary Medicine Services
Now accepting proposals for a holistic approach to health and wellness. Information meeting Wednesday, April 18,
Community Engagement
Get involved with our Community Engagement program.
>>> *******  after a couple of clicks you get:
2007 Community Engagement Committee Meeting Schedule
January 22, 2007
January 12, 2007
2006 Community Engagement Committee Meeting Dates
======================== ========================== =======

CHECKED APR 12th @ 3:30pm
The Rodgers Creek Area WG page is still the same saying the mtg is Apr 26 and agenda to be confirmed on 12th.
The Calendar still has no mention of any Rodgers Crk Area WG mtgs at any time during the month.
The home page still says RCrk WG mtgs Apr 12 and 26 but not where or when

Despite the heroic efforts of Cclr Day (whom I've just phoned and he said there was a mtg later this afternoon), the glorious public openness program is as shrouded in mystery and confusion as ever.
As an aside, it was much simpler and actually worked back in the 80s when the receptionist pencilled in mtgs on a calendar she kept handy -- that way they were all in one place and no double-bookings!

===   CITIZENS in DARK -- PARADISE LOST?  === or, when the rope snapped.

Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 04:36:13 -0700
From: Carolanne Reynolds
Subject: Citizens in Dark = Paradise Lost???

Please forgive me.  I'm about to burst; catharsis required.
Your Editor almost always confines herself to urging openness and expressing dismay when not followed and the delay in adherence to professed policies.  Politeness and patience.

Any vestige of patience dissipated this evening.

Your normally loquacious lover of liberty was appalled to the point of silence.  So I did not speak at the end of the mtg and didn't even want to -- afraid of what I wd say.
You heard/read commitments from councillors and staff that cmtes/WGs have abided by the legislation re in camera, want notification and public involvement.  Sad to say, this is simply not true judging by the actions of some.

Perhaps in my newsletter I'll start a section "Setting the Record Straight" with corrections when a statement is made at Ccl (obviously out of innocence or for effect to impress/mislead the listener) that is either wrong or gives the wrong impression.

I am so incensed this evening, to an extent rare for me, and it must be the accumulation, the final straw, that I just can't wait for the newsletter and will relate some now.

Staff statement: all cmtes/WGs have followed legislation wrt going in camera.
BROKEN by MANY (list can be supplied)! Do they think we don't know or notice? We're mushrooms?
At least one councillor claimed not to know the section listing permitted in camera items, not to have read it.  FYI, it's on the web, see http://www.qp.gov.bc.ca/statreg/stat/C/03026_04.htm#section90)
Another said he'd been told that b/c named a Working Group it didn't have to follow the legislation for cmtes (this was after the first ruse was to claim cmtes/mbrs weren't appointed by Ccl so legislation didn't apply -- but we pointed out even if appointed by the CEC, the CEC was appointed by Ccl and the application forms said they'd be appointed by Ccl), hence my comment at Ccl that a rose is a rose (well, that was my point).  Yet another said believed staff when they went in camera.
(It's honourable these elected councillors are trusting b/c wd be painful to think they are so easily duped or manipulated.)

When asked why their cmte or WG went in camera or were closed, councillors gave the following reasons:
a) it was just introductions, get to know each other -- THIS DOES NOT QUALIFY!
Several used this excuse.
When the adv cmtes started up in the past, during the first mtg, they all introduced themselves.  This is hardly a question of privacy; they needn't say anything personal -- usually it's a matter of name, why interested in the cmte, perhaps profession and wch part of WV they live in.
b)  re grants mtg (Cmnty Grants/NSh Soc Srvcs WG), b/c of personnel or privacy -- NOT VALID!
Public money, public groups; grants are not given to any person (or they shdn't be!) and every year in the past they've been finalized at a cmte mtg with residents present.
c) the mbrs voted to -- BUT THEY DON'T HAVE THAT RIGHT!
The Chair/cclr was told after that mtg (some weeks ago) that they cdn't and shdn't have voted to have the next mtg as closed, incredibly they discussed doing it again at the April 12th mtg and the cclr, who previously said he was not in agreement with closed mtgs, was actually wholly complicit by unquestioningly giving them dates for the closed meeting they now want to hold!
Do you see why I feel double-crossed?

re notification: this is to the point of ridiculousness with claims done but in fact not done.
Answer: I thought staff did it -- but they hadn't.  It is too much to expect cclrs to chase up staff.
(A couple of weeks ago Rod said it was confusing and he'd spoken to three different staff mbrs.  I believe him when he says he's tried and thought it was done. Let's take today as an example however. FYI, today, Apr 12 I called him b/c I'd heard there was a Rodgers Creek Area WG mtg later this afternoon and he said yes.  I told him first, it wasn't on the District's website Calendar, second, on the WG's page it had Apr 26 as a mtg with an agenda to be confirmed Apr 12, third, on the home page it said there were mtgs Apr 12 and 26 but not where or when, and fourth, when you click on it you get the second (WG's web page) saying 26th (but again no time or place).
I strongly believe that anyone's complaint is worthless without a solution or a construction suggestion/alternative.  Here's mine therefore.  Give one person the responsibility for putting mtg information on the website -- and make them ACCOUNTABLE.  Staff haven't been doing it for over three months with no repercussions, perhaps one of the reasons no discernible improvement.

Quite apart from this charade,

All cmtes/grps must start in public and then move the motion to go in camera citing the section; the mbrs vote and maybe not all will agree it applies.  I've been at several mtgs in wch staff have said they were going in camera and when not able to answer under wch section, the mtg didn't go in camera.

Let's look at the record:

=  Cmnty Grants WG had met seven times before the one I attended, with never a notification (not yet either).

=  Who knows how many times he Cmnty Engagement Cmte (CEC) have met?  The last two they have on the website are Jan 12 and 22.  AND THEY'RE THE ONES DECIDING HOW TO ENGAGE THE CMNTY!  No wonder Vivian resigned (but I still think staying in and fighting for what's right is valid also -- and she was the only one voting against receiving the guidelines fed to Ccl by the Chair of the CEC, the Mayor, even though the loopholes and wriggle room wd delight a maggot).  Sop, good for him, at least said he wanted the report to come back with the proviso in camera legislation followed and public able to speak; Vivian voted against receiving the report until those were in the guidelines.
That's why I referred to it as the Cmnty DISengagement Cmte.

=  Housing Character and Dialogue met a week or so ago and NO NOTIFICATION!

=  One cclr promised at ADRA's AGM (Feb 2007) that as chair all the Ambleside Master Plan WG mtgs wd follow the legislation.  And then we found out that two mtgs had been held before the ADRA mtg on Ambleside Mar 28 with NO NOTICES.  So much for that promise.

=   One Fin&Audit Cmte mtg was on the DWV website calendar as CLOSED.  Clearly not legal.  Mike has said that wdn't happen again, has committed to notification and surprised not always done, today clarified that although at the ccl mtg he didn't quite say that, his mtgs will follow legislation re in camera.

=  One cclr stated a mbr of public had come to a WG mtg (that had no notice).  Unfortunately I happen to know that the one mbr of the public who attended was the spouse of a mbr -- so no surprise that 'resident' came -- ah, but what a beautifully sounding statement to Council and TV watchers.
And you know that's not the only time that's happened -- the statements for public consumption, that is.
Why do you think I'm fighting for residents to be able to come and see how mtgs are conducted?  So often mbrs are given incomplete information so no surprise leads sometimes to a predictable recommendation or conclusion......

Remember I asked for the mtg guidelines the beginning of Feb and was told by the end of the month.
Asked again, told Mar 26th but Mayor still on holiday so came to Ccl Apr 2nd, and despite assurances (and false claims), large gaps and falling short of openness and transparency led to believe wd be there quite apart from keeping within the bounds of the Cmnty Charter.
'Tis to weep.


Now a rather strange experience this afternoon.
As I said, there was NO notification so public cd attend the Rodgers Creek Area WG Apr 12: no notice of meeting posted on the bulletin board outside the M Hall door, no agenda on the DWV website, nothing or incomplete on the website in three places so if there was a mtg, no info as to where or when.  The public cd not possibly attend that mtg with what was to be found on the DWV website or on the notice board.  As I've said, a town crier wd be more effective (if they gave him the full details).

Remember this is the group some weeks ago that VOTED to have its next mtg CLOSED when it doesn't have the right to do so!  That next mtg was to have a presentation by BPP -- who own almost all of the 200+ acres under discussion for planning what to put there, how much and where, so no wonder some wanted it closed.  How delightful!  The dream of many.  The Mayor was at that mtg so if she even mentioned she wanted openness it was not listened to and voted down, quite apart from the fact no one was familiar with the Cmnty Charter apparently.

So what happened this afternoon, the no-notice mtg of the RCAWG?
Moved from conference mtg room to Ccl Chamber.
In the gallery: two ppl there I didn't know; at least one mbr of staff in the gallery; two proponents of an equestrian ctr in the area; Cclr Vaughan; and a WV Streamkeeper director (who knew about the mtg as I did).
What to my wondering eyes shd appear? the strangest arrangement for a mtg I've ever seen.
The WG sat around a table set in the centre, between the podium and the horseshoe at wch cclrs sit, with the Chair (the cclr) with his back to the podium and the gallery.
Every seat was filled behind/around the horseshoe.  On the left were consultants of BPP, (I think) the one private landowner of the area (just a few lots) and to the right, Jim MacLean and Walter Thorneloe of BPP (perhaps on that side b/c the maps were on the west wall so easy to see from there), and more staff including SJN (Dir/Planning).
The hour-long presentation by BPP went well (I think by ecologist Patrick Lucey) and all impressed (as I was) that this devt was starting with identifying the areas that need to be protected and the housing put in 'cmnty pods', while still sticking to the OCP restriction of 2.5 units per acre, but with a mix of single-family, duplex/townhouses, and multi-family (much needed b/c of aging demographic).
All this plus roads are even on the maps; BPP has been working with staff for a long time to get to this stage.
Discussion after the presentation was more than interesting.  One mbr said the group shd meet in camera to discuss principles, increased density, after earlier saying that it's madness to have so few units/such low density/ and that it shd be discussed 'freely'.  To my astonishment and profound disappointment and sense of betrayal plus having been misled, the Chair, a cclr, then said that cd be May 10th!  What happened to laudable statements by cclrs at the last ccl mtg (not just privately to me) that mtgs shd be open and wd be?  Was that for public consumption and my trusting, optimistic, and hopeful ears?  (and publication?)  And I fell for it.  Sorry, folks.  When Outlook called me today I even gave that name as one of the four councillors who I thought were in favour of following legislation re in camera and believed in openness.  How tricked I was.

May I hasten to add that one mbr of the WG, Michael Rosen, a planner and former chair of the Advisory Planning Cmte, bless his soul, said he was "uncomfortable going in camera; mtgs shd be open.... know it's cumbersome but it's principle".  Bravo. NOT the chair (the cclr), and NO OTHER MBR  of the WG or staff brought up the fact that they don't have the right to meet in camera or announce that a mtg will be closed.  Evading scrutiny and accountability too tempting?

Do we have to teach ppl who serve on municipal govt cmtes that our system is public, our govt operates in public -- if you find it unpalatable to make statements and promote your opinions in public, don't serve.  You're suited to a private company, not public business.


Here's the agenda, fyi:
1. Land use (presentation by BPP)
2. Infrastructure including movement systems and utilities (presentation by BPP)
3. Confirmation of agenda items for Apr 26 mtg
4. Other business.


= No minutes or notes.  (how does anyone find out what happened in past mtgs?)  if there are notes kept of the meetings, which is supposed to happen, how do we know they are accurate if not brought to the WG for approval?  Do they exist or were they missing?

= NO item for public questions/input.  (totally eliminated!)

In fact, after deciding what wd be on the agenda (item 3), the Chair (the cclr), still with his back to the gallery where the inconsequential, in effect gagged/silenced, residents sat, did not even turn to thank them for coming or seeing if anyone had any questions.  (Some other WGs even if missing the public input item have been courteous to anyone who turned up.  Surely a minimum.  I'd even heard in the past some residents enquiring about attending a RCAWG was discouraged by staff.  The stories are endless, and totally depressing.)
Thus ended the Rodgers Creek WG mtg.
And then the mbrs huddled for their confidential discussions.

How do we get across to biz ppl that govt is public, it doesn't and can't function with private debates over important issues, by virtue of the very fact it is PUBLIC business and the people have a right to know.   At some point the will of the people shd at least be taken into consideration -- one hopes not so late that it's at rubberstamp stage with little time for meaningful amendments or changes.  It is also unfair to developers to have them alter plans to meet the wishes/directives of staff and a WG for years and then find opposition.
It's not right wrt residents (in this case the impact of devt of 200+ acres) and costly for devprs who made accommodations designed for approval. 
People can satisfy themselves govt is functioning fairly with openness, a foundation so long fought for to reach the standards of our democracy.  I cannot stand back merely observing the cancellation of many gains so painfully attained since the Magna Carta and the days of the Star Chamber.


On Tuesday to my surprise I learned of a mtg of a WV Sports Forum that had met (Mar 27), a group I'd never even heard of, nor had the couple of councillors I asked.  Don't get me wrong, it's great to have that input.
PLEASE NOTE: one councillor has shown exceptional mettle.  Cclr Vaughan was brave enough to vote against receipt of those leaky guidelines in the CEC report saying she wd wait till compliance with the legislation was clearly stated.  One of her unassailable points (and the Apr 2 Ccl comments on WGs will be in WVM13) was querying how Ccl cd give powers to cmtes that they as a Ccl haven't themselves.  Her WG has yet to meet and she has given me assurances it will comply right from the beginning.  Given her votes and stands in the past, I feel confident we can count on what she says.   I'm counting on her to be one who will not disappoint.  Not only that, I'm a mbr of that WG.

There's no doubt, Dear Readers, that people can change.  Maybe this status report will be a wake-up call for some.  I will be watching extremely carefully from now on and will label excuses as excuses, and will give credit where merited and I see it.  Please forgive some charitableness may shrink as I watch to see wch councillors from this day forward actually comply with the intent of the Cmnty Charter.  It is not nice to feel one has been fooled after giving the benefit of the doubt.  It has been years since I've felt so insulted and offended, and despairing of the direction our govt is going especially seeing how the public is being systematically excluded.
If no one complains or insists, ladies and gentlemen, it will get worse.  Power begets power, gets hungry for more power.  How irresistible to wield it when not watched.  Indeed, a tenet of psephology is that govts must be watched.  You snooze, you lose.

Sorry if that trivializes what is an alarming situation in our cmnty if allowed to continue and get worse.  The disparity between what's being said and what's being done is shocking and unparalleled in my experience of observing WV affairs since 1987 when I sat on the interim heritage cmte.  Lying and misleading are not new -- it's the extent.   Astonishing.  It is my hope that this will be brought to enough residents' attention that we can not only stem the tide but also to reverse it and lead it back to truly representative government with respect for the public, their inclusion, participation, and views.

Another important aspect of the last six months:
Don't be frightened or cowed by a 'legal opinion' they can do some things -- it's become something of a Swiss army knife for closure and removal from public view.  It may be time to get a second legal opinion, one commissioned by constituents, not one hired by staff.  Letters to Ccl might not all be complimentary (letters suddenly disappeared from the public agenda in November), residents might not all be in favour of projects or changes advocated by some staff or WG mbrs.

Thank you if you've read to the end.  Your contribution to your cmnty is valuable and essential, and part of what makes WV/Canada so special.  And so are you, since you care and contribute.  Being informed is a critical part of going forward effectively and productively.

===  VIMY  ===
Updated Mon. Apr. 9 2007 12:56 PM ET
CTV.ca News
Under warm sunshine, thousands of people gathered at the Vimy Ridge Memorial in France to remember a much colder, darker day 90 years ago when some 3,600 Canadian soldiers died capturing the site.
The Vimy battle saw as many as 100,000 Canadian soldiers attack the German stronghold over four cold and foggy days.
While the mission was ultimately a success, the toll was high. Nearly 3,600 Canadian soldiers lost their lives and another 7,000 were wounded in the battle. Their sacrifice is being remembered today.
"Every nation has a creation story to tell; the First World War and the Battle of Vimy Ridge are central to the story of our country," Prime Minister Stephen Harper told those gathered, who include Canadian veterans and high school students.
"It was here for the first time that our entire army fought together on the battlefield, and the result was a spectacular victory, a stunning breakthrough that helped turn the war in the Allies' favour.
"Often, the importance of historical events is only understood with the benefit of hindsight. But at Vimy, everyone immediately realized the enormity of the achievement."
Queen Elizabeth also praised the "verve of the Canadian attack", noting that "in capturing this formidable objective, the Canadian Corps transformed Vimy Ridge from a symbol of despair into a source of inspiration.''
The Queen, dressed in a cream tweed suit and hat, then laid a wreath to officially rededicate the Vimy War Memorial.
"To their eternal remembrance, to those who have so recently lost their lives in Afghanistan, to Canada and to all who would serve the cause of freedom, I rededicate this magnificently restored memorial,'' she said.
The memorial, completed in 1936 after 11 years of construction, has recently undergone a $20-million restoration, after falling, for many years, into disrepair from water damage.
Celebrated modernist sculptor Walter Allward designed the ten-storey-tall memorial, which has long been praised for its subtle blending of abstract modernism and Christian imagery.
The monument has been returned to its original pristine white, names have been re-engraved, a new lighting plan is in place, and original landscape elements have been returned to the grounds.
A parallel ceremony commemorating the Vimy anniversary was held at the National War Memorial in Ottawa Gov-Gen Michaelle Jean led that ceremony, paying tribute today to the "extraordinary courage" of Canadian soldiers past and present.
The honorary commander-in-chief of Canada's armed forces said the victory by Canadians at Vimy in 1917 was "the day a young Canada marked out a place of its own."
Other smaller ceremonies are being held across the country.
Vimy was one of Canada's greatest triumphs during the First World War. In four days, Canadian soldiers were able to accomplish what the Allies hadn't been able to do in three years. Military historian Tim Cook says until the Canadian victory, many had thought Vimy Ridge impregnable.
"The Germans had held this position for two years and fortified it during that time," he explained to CTV News. "French and British troops had attacked it at least three times and lost more than 150,000 men. Here the Canadians are on the ninth of April, 1917, facing this fortress, and they attack it and succeed."
The Canadian Corps pushed past landmines, barbed wire and machine gun nests to capture more ground, more prisoners and more guns than any previous British offensive.
The key to their victory was the innovation of a creeping artillery barrage that would serve as a moving wall of high explosives and shrapnel that would protect the advancing soldiers.
While the "creeping barrage" had been used previously by the British at the Battle of the Somme, the Canadians perfected the technique at Vimy Ridge, advancing behind a continuous line of shells.
The battle is now considered a defining moment in the birth of Canadian nationalism, allowing Canadian soldiers to prove that they could be victorious without British help.
"What it did was make them think they were terrific soldiers, and made them think Canada could do special things," military historian Jack Granatstein told CTV.ca.
Nine decades after the Canadian Corps stormed Vimy Ridge, the battle's presence is still felt.
Human remains still fill the soil at the site. Beneath the scattered bones of Canadians and their German enemies lie the remains of the British and French soldiers who had tried to take the hill before them.
A Canadian documentary team recently hired archeologists to excavate two small, randomly chosen squares of Vimy land, a couple metres across. They found the remains of at least two soldiers.
And during restoration work on the memorial, the bodies of two German soldiers were found in the top 18 inches of soil.

===  CMTE OF WHOLE AGENDA Apr 16th = ; ===

2.         Draft 2007 Budget - Supplementary Information Report Arising from the Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007 (File:  0860-01)
            (Report to be provided on-table)
Information relating to the Draft 2007 Budget is set out below:
(a)               2007 Proposed Budget - Towards a Sustainable Future (received at Committee of the Whole Meeting on March 12, 2007 and made available at Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007);
(b)               2007 Budget Presentation to Council (received at Committee of the Whole Meeting on March 12, 2007 and made available at Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007);
(c)                Draft [Five-]Year Capital Plan 2007-2011 (received at Council Meeting on April 02, 2007 and made available at Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007);
(d)               Draft Public Amenity Contribution Policy (received at Committee of the Whole Meeting on March 12, 2007 and made available at Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007);
(e)               Draft Partnership and Sponsorship Policy (received at Committee of the Whole Meeting on March 12, 2007 and made available at Town Hall Meeting on March 29, 2007); and
(f)                  Unadopted Minutes of the Town Hall Meeting re Draft 2007 Budget held on March 29, 2007 (for information only - scheduled for adoption at Council Meeting on April 23, 2007).
3.         Collingwood School - Morven Parking (File:  1010-20-06-034)
RECOMMENDED:  THAT notification be given to Collingwood School and residents within 150 metres of the proposal described in the report from the Community Planner dated April 2, 2007, to provide an opportunity to comment prior to further consideration at the Council meeting of Monday, May 28, 2007.
4.         Correspondence Lists.... to be received.
Correspondence received up to March 30, 2007 and distributed to Council on April 05, 2007 (with exceptions for time sensitive items)
Requests for Delegation -- No items presented.
Action Required
(1)       L.E. Jackson, Chair - GVRD Board, March 26, 2007, regarding Future of the Region Sustainability Dialogues Summary: Transportation
Referred to the Director of Engineering and Transportation for consideration and response.
(2)       B. Binnie, President - Union of BC Municipalities [UBCM}, March 29, 2007, regarding Opportunity to Comment on Changes to the Ultimate Limitation Period - British Columbia Limitation Act
Referred to the Director of Administrative Services for consideration and response.
No Action Required (receipt only)
(3)       Committee and Board Meeting Minutes
            (a)       Community Engagement Committee - October 30, 2006, November 20, 2006, November 27, 2006 and January 12, 2007
            (b)       Design Advisory Committee - December 14, 2006 (File: 0115?20?DAC01)
(4)       C. Taylor, Minister - Provincial Ministry of Finance, March 09, 2007, regarding District of West Vancouver's Proposal of a Levy on Ski Tickets
(5)       S.E. Dowey, City Clerk - City of NV, March 27, 2007, regarding Smoking Prohibition in Bus Shelters Bylaw
(6)       Federation of Canadian Municipalities, March 30, 2007, regarding United States Government Moves to Soften Proposed Border Identity Document Regulations
(7)       E-COMM 9-1-1 (Emergency Communications for Southwest BC), Undated, 2007, regarding E-COMM Stakeholder Report - Fourth Quarter Results 2006
Responses to Correspondence
(8)       Mayor P. Goldsmith-Jones, March 30, 2007, Reply to A. Duyker, Canadian Cancer Society - British Columbia & Yukon regarding Request for Proclamation of April as Daffodil Month
Responses to Questions in Question Period -- No items presented.
Correspondence received up to April 06, 2007 and distributed to Council on April 12, 2007 (with exceptions for time sensitive items)
Requests for Delegation -- No items presented.
Action Required
(9)       K. Vance, Senior Policy [Adviser], UBCM, April 04, 2007, regarding RCMP Contract Issues
Referred to the Acting Chief Constable for consideration and response.
No Action Required (receipt only)
(10)     April 05, 2007, regarding Density (File: 1060?01)
(11)     S.E. Dowey, City Clerk - City of NV, April 05, 2007, regarding Demolition Waste Recycling Plan
(12)     R. Faris, Vice Chair, and other members of =C9cole Cedardale Parent Advisory Council, March 09, 2007, regarding Taylor Way and Inglewood Avenue Traffic Issues
(13)     B. Binnie, President, UBCM and Chair, Local Government Leadership Academy, March 23, 2007, regarding Message from the Chair
(14)     GVRD, Communications and Outreach Briefing, February 26, 2007, and Presentations on: (a) Wastewater Treatment and Detergent Overuse and (b) Detergent Reduction Program - North Shore Focus
Responses to Correspondence
(15)     K. Pike, Director, Parks and Community Services, April 10, 2007, Reply regarding Capilano Rugby Club - Alternative Approval Process and Adjacent Neighbourhood Issues
(16)     K. Pike, Director, Parks and Community Services, April 04, 2007, Reply regarding Sna7m Smanit - Spirit of the Mountain
Responses to Questions in Question Period -- No items presented.

===  QUOTATIONS  ===

An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come.   -- Victor Hugo

Not to engage in the pursuit of ideas is to live like ants instead of like men.   -- Mortimer Adler

Lucius Annaeus Seneca (Latin): ignoranti quem portum petat nullus suus ventus est
The wind is never favourable to those who don't know where they are going

One of my favourites, via Eric Partridge, is: illegitimi non carborundum  (Translation in next issue :-))

Kurt Vonnegut, Jr died 2007 Apr 10 at the age of 84.   In "A Man Without a Country", he wrote:
There is no reason good cannot triumph over evil, if only angels will get organized along the line of the Mafia.