= MAIN ITEMS Cmte of Whole Agenda Apr 16: BUDGET 2007 (some info to be supplied 'on-table'!  We're still getting info!); Morven Parking (Collingwood); Correspondence List (well, what they've decided we cd see)

= Vive le Canada (Vimy); CULTUREWATCH (Theatre/Book/Webwatch of Animals); INFObits; WVPD UPDATE; Calendar to Apr 22nd;

Lack of Notice for WG/Cmte mtgs; Cmnty (DIS)engagement cmte; Draft Five-Year Capital Plan (from $40M set in stone for ten years, now more than twice as much for five years!); Questions re closed mtgs not complying with in camera legislation and re adoption of Ev Dr Bylaws;

followed by

examples of NONnotification of WG mtgs (Apr 6, 9, and 12), and the straw that broke the camel's back, CITIZENS in DARK -- PARADISE LOST?

= VIMY (wasn't open/democracy one of the concepts we were fighting for?);

= Apr 16th AGENDA; Quotations

ANNOUNCEMENT by PM Stephen Harper; April 3, 2007; Ottawa:

"The Battle of Vimy Ridge was a critical victory for the Allies in the First World War and it was an important milestone for Canada.  Our young country came of age as an independent nation that day and I am extremely proud to represent Canada at the 90th anniversary."

Prime Minister Harper will be accompanied by his wife, Laureen, and their two children, Rachel and Benjamin. In July of last year, the Prime Minister and Mrs. Harper visited the gravesite in northern France of her great uncle, Private James Teskey, who died during the Battle of Arras on June 11, 1917.

In addition to the main ceremony on April 9, the Prime Minister will attend the Freedom of the City parade in Arras on April 7 and an Easter Sunday Dinner with Veterans.

The Battle of Vimy Ridge marked the first time all four Divisions of the Canadian Corps had gone into battle together. Their victory, which came at a cost of more than 10,000 casualties including 3,598 dead, was a vital strategic breakthrough that had eluded their British and French allies for two years. April 9, 2007, will be the first time since 1917 that April 9 has fallen on Easter Monday.

[See VIMY in its own section below and a bit about Canada in WW1 in INFObits just below]

Currently at the Jericho Arts Centre (1675 Discovery, Th to Sun), Apr 6 to 29 (Apr 12th talkback):

United Players' production of THE IMPROMPTU OF OUTREMENT by Michel Tremblay

ONLINE RESERVATIONS or 604 224 8007, ext. 2; www.unitedplayers.com

* ENCORE: The Syringa Tree is back (Vancouver Playhouse) and well worth seeing -- stars our own Caroline Cave.

The Long Exile by MELANIE McGRATH (reviewed by Elizabeth Royte of the NYT)             

Three Inuit families were forcibly relocated to an extremely inhospitable island in Arctic Canada.             

* ANIMALWATCH / WEBWATCH

~  Make your voice heard to save the polar bear: http://PolarBearSOS.org

~  See the adorable otters holding hands/paws: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epUk3T2Kfno

==  INFObits

> China has just bought the entire MG plant in England (~=A350M+) and moved it to China, hence 3000 jobs.  They also recently wanted a British type village, think it was in or near Shanghai so they sent workers to England to learn the trades and then there are so few with those skills, some were hired back in Britain.

> In the VSun -- 1000 ppl a month moving into Surrey

> Did the BC Ferry Corp and the BC govt read about charges being laid wrt the sinking of the Sea Diamond near Santorini within days?

> CANADA AT WAR

Almost 10% of Canada's entire population of seven million people served in the armed forces during the First World War, and nearly 60,000 died.  The great Allied victories of 1918 were spearheaded by Canadian troops, perhaps the most capable soldiers in the entire British order of battle.

The Second World War provided a re-run.  The Canadian navy began the war with a half dozen vessels, and ended up policing nearly half of the Atlantic against U-boat attack.  More than 120 Canadian warships participated in the Normandy landings, during which 15,000 Canadian soldiers went ashore on D-Day alone.  Canada finished the war with the third-largest navy and the fourth-largest air force in the world.

 ===  UPDATE

Still no WVPD Police Chief.

As reported, $122K shortfall in WVPD budget revealed end of March; more details in next issue on the budget.

===  CALENDAR to Apr 22nd  ===  [all at M Hall unless otherwise]

BTW, we're still on the wheel of happy new years (yes, I mean plural, wait for the list) Apr 13 -15, this time the lunisolar calendar: Songkran in Thai, Songkan in Lao; also this time of year in Cambodia, Myanmar, Sri Lanka (Sinhalese and Tamil).

With an energy output that is second only to the big bang, the event called the 'cosmic storm' gives the viewer a detailed look yet at how objects collide, merge, and form into smaller objects and then into large objects. Join us for this beautiful contemporary exhibit of abstracts and uniquely 'woven' abstracts in pastel & ink, watercolour and giclee prints by artists Greg & Eva Kawezynski and Wendy Dallian.

+++  FERRY BUILDING GALLERY +++  "Reflections Vancouver" to Apr 17 to 29

Capilano College IDEA Program -- Original paintings and 2008 Calendar launch.

THE GALLERY AT THE LIBRARY PRESENTS:  BEAUTIFUL BRITISH COLUMBIA -- April 1 - 30.

* Apr 13:       Please join us for an opening reception Friday from 6:30 to 8pm

* Apr 17: Reading James Joyce's Ulysses.  Join Joe Ronsley for an ongoing reading & discussion of Ulysses. Drop in to any session, 10:30am - 12:30pm in the Peter J. Peters Room. For more information call the Reference Department: 925 7405.

* Apr 20:  North Shore Writers Festival Presents: Colin Angus, Fri, 7:30pm KMC

The first person to circumnavigate the planet using human propulsion, Angus will screen his new DVD Beyond the Horizon.

In 1966, electric cars began to appear on roads all over California. Ten years later, where have they gone?

=  EARTH DAY EVENTS:

Former American VP Al Gore explains the facts of global warming in this documentary film.

- 10am ~ Earth Friendly Gardening - A workshop with Sheila Watkins, local gardening writer and teacher.

- 7:30pm ~ North Shore Writers Festival Presents: Girls Night Out: Susan Juby, Robyn Harding & Wendy French; Free

Come find out where such novels as Alice I Think, The Secret Desires of a Soccer Mom, and sMothering, came from!

==  Fri, Apr 13th ~ 8am - 2pm ~ Southern Straits Race -- Start at Dundarave Pier

Join the Environmental Protection Network students at WV Secondary School, the WV Parks Dept, and our partner, Evergreen, in a planting and mulching event at Hay Park (in an area near Inglewood Ave). Refreshments will be served. This youth-led project will enhance the area near Inglewood Ave. For more info: 925-7138.

FYI:

The Parks Department has had enquiries about the status of the backwater rearing channel at Hay Park.  The entry to the channel has been cleared and some water flow restored.  Further questions about the backwater channel can be directed to Stephen Jenkins, Environmental Coordinator, at (604) 925-7192, or to environment@westvancouver.ca.

Nancy Hermiston, Director with a special guest appearance by Lloyd Burritt, composer

The Dream Healer, a new opera opening at the Chan Centre next spring

St. Francis in the Wood Anglican Church, 4773 South Piccadilly Road

$15 at the door includes refreshments; Reservations: 604 922-3531

==  Wednesday, April 18th  [as requested, not reporting place, just for info b/c venue too small; this for info and example of good work they're doing]

Our group of five students contacted Dr. Hans Schreier at the Institute for Resources, Environment, and Sustainability (IRES) in September 2006 for a topic idea for an Environmental Science Honours Thesis.  Since he did some preliminary sediment and water quality sampling at Ambleside in the summer of 2006 and found high levels of metals, he suggested doing an analysis and characterization of several parameters that influence the health of Sw=E1ywey Creek and Ambleside Lagoon. We started our project with background research in October 2006 and started sampling in December 2006.  We specifically investigated the effect and level of urbanization in the watershed that drains into Sw=E1ywey Creek on the hydrology of the system.  Levels of impervious surfaces were estimated and analyzed in the watershed.  We took sediment samples to further our knowledge on levels of contamination in the system, and how they may differ between Sw=E1ywey Creek and the lagoon.  Surface water samples were collected in both Sw=E1ywey and the lagoon, and analyzed for nutrients to determine how eutrophic the system is.  Electrical conductivity was measured in the lagoon and in Sw=E1ywey Creek to determine the extent of the ocean's effect and stormwater runoff's effects on the system.  Finally, benthic macro-invertebrates were sampled in the lagoon and Sw=E1ywey Creek as a final evaluation of the health of the system.  In addition, this preliminary data can be useful for further sampling that can be undertaken by North Shore Wetland Partners.

NORTH SHORE WETLAND PARTNER BUSINESS MEETING

        Review draft Sw=E1ywey brochure - 10 minutes

        Wetland  Reports - 20 minutes

        2007 Work Plans - monitoring, invasive species, community events - 30 minutes

ADJOURNMENT - 8:55PM

~ 6pm ~ Library Board in the Peters Room at the Library

~ 7pm ~ Board of Variance at M Hall

~ 4:30 - 8:30pm ~ Design Review Cmte (MOVED from Apr 26)

~ 5:30 - 7:30 NSh Family & Youth Justice Cmte at CNV M Hall

Hadden Park (behind the Maritime Museum) near Vanier Park, Vancouver (rain or shine)

Discussion by faith groups / Lost streams history / First Nations participation

To bless the salmon as they head to sea. Join people of different faiths as we offer our combined blessings to the young salmon who have travelled down the local rivers and are preparing for their epic ocean journey.

Info: www.falsecreekwatershed.org and email: salmoncelebration@hotmail.com

===  COUNCIL MEETING NOTES Apr 2nd [names best guess; typed quickly during mtg]

CALL TO ORDER

1.  APPROVAL OF AGENDA /  some additions: 7.2 add'l mtg of Ccl; correspondence

2.  ADOPTION OF MINUTES -- No items scheduled.

Mayor: ... thank JF as acting Mayor, filling in for me; watched both ccl mtgs that I missed; good opp to observe; need a bit more rigour; important to keep public input to three minutes; helps with Council's ability to debate your business

The mayors are meeting tomorrow with the Chair of TransLink to discuss Mr Falcon's TransLink review.

3.         B. Murray, North Shore Spring Bear Festival Society, regarding North Shore Spring Bear Festival

MW: Actually it's Mick Webb....  Many months ago presented a proposal

over a week, inform and educate about the world of the bear, key to successful co-existence

thank DWV for in-kind sponsorship of this event and polite and efficient cooperation from staff

festival on track and ready to go.  Megan will show slides

[Megan reads from slides]: Celebrating our Bears Apr 23 - 29; northshorebearfest.com

in BC av 1000 nuisance bears killed a year b/c perceived as threat

in 2005, the NSh bear popn hit an all-time high of over 100 bears; by the end of 2006 drastically reduced to about 30 bears

goals: celebration; education to practise bear-smart behaviour

support from [list]; 100% volunteer-run festival

hope to be a model for other cmnties; end of April coincides with end of hibernation

Two renowned bear experts sharing stage:

o  Ben Kilham, Nat'l Geographic's Mother Bear Man, did Papa Bear documentary for Discovery Channel 2005; NBC, Dateline, NYT, etc, guest on Leno, Letterman etc; author of book, Among the Bears; olfactory-oriented; bears recognize what they smell and we recognize what we see

o  Charlie Russell, from Alberta, spent better part of 45 years studying bears in their natural habitat;  past 11 years studied bears in Russia; in 1990s spent time on Princess Royal Island writing a book on the Spirit Bear; Cdn best-selling author, Bears of Kamchatka, finishing documentary; BBC film; wants to tell true story about what bears really are (not what we've been told)

Events:  Apr 20 Wild about Bears Workshops; [listed events]

Weekend Apr 27 - 29: KMC Friday, an evening of Bear Talk; and Sat, Cap College, Bear Talk and Walk; and the big day is Sunday, Apr 29 Bear Festival Day in Ambleside Park 10am to 4pm featuring 30+ exhibits, barbecue, live music, entertainers, etc

JC: bear popn on NSh was reduced by 70%

[Ans: yes, 100 to 30]

JC: shot or relocated?

[Ans: combination of the two]

Mick Webb: depends; typical response has been to shoot; modification to encompass relocation to appease public reaction; stressful for bears to be relocated..... known to return.... the answer lies with us.  We live in bear territory; recognize our responsibilities and we're part of the problem

[Mutual thx]

ADRA's position is that Working Groups be treated in the same way as Cmtes of Ccl mtgs, in order that they are open to the public and that advance notice of these mtgs be publicized.  The reason for ADRA's position is that it has been brought to our attention that a meeting had been held regarding the Amb Town Ctr before ADRA had had a chance to hold our Amb Town Ctr mtg on Mar 28th.  We wd like the opportunity to have our directors and mbrs attend these mtgs as this new revitalized town ctr will have an impact on our residents and our cmnty.

* Carolanne Reynolds, Editor of West Van Matters, starts in French b/c Mayor just back from France: Bienvenue

Before I start, I really appreciated your remarks[, Madam Mayor,] at the beginning, that Reports and PQP wd not be omitted {in future; this is a reference to their having been deleted at prev mtg when Cclr JF in Chair and Mayor away, all voted to do so}; I really appreciate that, tyvm.  That {deletion/removal from the agenda} was quite shocking.

Anyway, wrt the Working Groups

In November of last year-- there are several things that seem to be a divergence between open, transparent, and democratic govt, and what has been happening.

In November of last year it was suddenly announced that letters wd be removed from Correspondence {on the ccl mtg agenda and in pkg}; and this year there has been no notice of WG mtgs.

The first reason we were given {wrt no notice} was that it was not a cmte appointed by Ccl; but they WERE appointed by a Ccl Cmte, in fact. A plucked rose by any other name wd still look bad!

Anyway, this is not meant for me personally {ie, it's a matter of principle} -- I must interject that cclrs hv bn v kind and invited me to mtgs even without notice and so I do want to say that they have been most kind.  My point has really to do with policy and the public and residents.

I was aghast mbrs of a WG recently VOTED to have a CLOSED mtg  -- clearly contrary to the intent of the LGA and the  Cmnty Charter.

Some cclrs say they've asked their mtgs have notices and have notification but it's not happened.  So perhaps there's something that has to be looked at there.

I'd like to think that campaign promises for openness and transparency meant something.  This divergence is particularly worrying and backward steps.  Certainly a surprise from what we were led to believe.

This report comes from the Cmnty Engagement Cmte.

It wd be appreciated if you wd pls tell us when, where, and how mtgs will be posted, how long before the mtg.  For example, I just walked in tonight and, great, there's a mtg posted for Finance & Audit tomorrow, but as I've said in the past, you can't really expect ppl to walk by the Hall the day before somebody's going to have a mtg.  As I've said, a town crier wd be more effective.

I'm hoping there will be discussion of this item; it will not simply be received for information b/c it has some serious flaws when it comes to openness and public participation.  So I imagine there are some cclrs among you who will speak out and stand up for open govt in our democracy.

Mayor: I will introduce this report as the Chair of the Cmnty Engagement Cmte (CEC).

Anything on a ccl agenda is wide open for public comment and Cclr comment and I wd hope everyone wd engage fully.

The CEC has been meeting privately b/c it has been dealing with hundreds of applications of citizens wishing to roll up their sleeves and work on actual problems, rather than take a passive role in a more advisory capacity.

been overwhelmed; dealing with ppl's personal information trying to put them as best we can on WGs, Task Forces, Bds, etc, one adv cmte left and three standing cmtes.

We've taken cmtes that are standing cmtes, Cmnty Engagement and Fin&Aud, previously just Ccl's purview, and included citizen involvement in those.

we've been v clear, now others all in place, apptmts made, incumbent on each cmte to publish its mtg dates and that will on the website.

We believe the most effective use of our time and resources is to put ev on the website and drive ppl to website; I cdn't agree more posting a notice on the front of the M Hall isn't an effective way to reach most ppl, and it's too time-consuming for staff.

drive ppl to the website, all materials for the mtgs will be posted there and av to the public

notes from mtgs will be posted there, av to public and Ccl

forums -- to put special questions to the cmte; and we will advertise those through the use of an on-line forum

trying to cut down on administrative, bureaucratic, and v labour-intensive use of staff time

corollary is we're probably being more demanding of public to get info themselves; everybody is welcome to that information.

wrt mtgs that haven't been duly advertised, think that's really just out of enthusiasm

I've been here and there've been mtgs in ev room with the public and they're generally open

Ccl has made a recommendation to the WGs that they try to be open,

 but there are some things that are just not appropriate,

and that's not b/c we don't think it's everybody's business, of course it is everybody's business, but the WGs are often dealing with questions where they're learning and everything they decide is returned to Ccl, and as you know that's certainly a public forum.

> a vote is not a vote if there is no record of it?

we're working with a brand new system

been truly overwhelmed by the public response in favour of that

certain amt of energy comes from being assigned a task, and a tight time frame with high expectations

from now on the CEC will be meeting monthly in a traditional formal cmte of Ccl -- hope that will go some way to understanding the new system that we are devising

it's attracting a lot of interest everywhere

we were putting so much [sic] resources into a public opp that was less than effective

we have yet to see what comes out of these WGs

seems ev working v hard and wishing them to be successful

next aspect we're testing is how well on-line forums work

don't want them to be unwieldy, hoping ppl keep comments concise and constructive, but again ppl can watch that unfold in a conversational way on the website

that's where we're at with a new system

not intended to be a closed system but it has taken a few months to put in place and properly

now open to Ccl to give your input and get some further direction; will just ask Mr Stuart if he has anything to add

CAO: have noted concerns about the inconsistencies, differences

I met with all staff liaisons representatives this afternoon, working with the Clerk hv established a series of guidelines, will be publishing those on web, and that will help ppl understand how they work and where they can go for info

Sop: these WGs I perceive as action groups;

one year; charged with various duties

three I'll be sitting on, one I have seen tremendous enthusiasm;

will be indepth recommendations to Ccl; clear to me WGs going to be v effective

if we charge citizens to provide activity going to have an action associated with change to our policies -- shd hv structure, and no diff than in past

stated in here note web forum; good avenue; discuss issues; certainties for education

also opps for these WGs to engage the cmnty

 

am a little concerned we're going to receive this tonight; seems most of it is out here for us to accept and wonder why we're just receiving

and not something we're going to move along with; under the proviso from my position follow LGA [Cmnty Charter] in relationship how we perceive these cmte mtgs and notified by staff, ev knows where/when they're at, and that the public can attend the mtg as well as ask a question at the end

and if that happens then in my case I feel we've met the right consistency of the Cmnty Charter and we have satisfied provided this great service.

I don't see that it shd be anything difficult; make sure it's in here that we follow that

question p4 re wording -- "mtgs will be open to the public wherever possible recognizing there may be instances where this is not approp", I assume that's in camera, wch on the agenda shd be a statement of in camera

then it goes further and says that "the manner in wch the WGs each communicate and engage the public will be specific to purpose of group"

Each WG has a task wch is action-orientated, so whatever discussions that take place wd be what is advertised and communicated; I don't have a major prob with that

just find there's mtg guidelines: the WG provide advance notification on the forum, and the public wd be invited to attend, notes from public mtg wd also be posted on the website

might be some confusion, Madam Mayor, as to mtgs conducted by the public or they are the public, that's the ppl we draw these names from; there's also the right, many of these WGs will to go out to the public on a cmnty mtg and then you have the ability for the public to sit in on it

if we entertain those, following closely to what we had before, without any ramifications, I point out this is not like an advisory group in past, this will be over in a few months here, and the amt of work going to be done by these groups is tremendous.

RD: remarkable achievement,

three standing cmtes, nine WGs; over 100 ppl volunteered; carefully selected

look over names, outstanding group of ppl, fortunate to have them

I chair Rodgers Creek Area WG, started right away, had five mtgs, not seven but five, been open, had no problems with that

it's been a bit difficult to try to figure out what the procedure was for announcing these mtgs on the web

very early; I was trying to get these publicized; we weren't quite sure who was responsible; we've worked that out now and the staff person on ea of the WGs is responsible for seeing that the mtg is publicized; ppl can look up on the Web and find out when the WGs are meeting

I think we've worked out wrinkles quite well; all the WGs are working now and making good progress

really quite pleased with the way it's going

they show a flexibility and ability to get at specific problems old adv cmtes not able to do so

 I think we're well served by these cmtes and we're moving ahead quite well.

JF: remember new endeavour, new way of doing biz

ev on Ccl wd like to see public involvement and transparency throughout process and no intention to prevent the public from participating or observing the workings of the cmtes

may be instances the info being dealt with has some connection with the privacy of a specific prop owner particularly in something like the Ambleside Study Group or the evaluations of lands, but in fact a person's private biz and out of respect for privacy there may be instances where portions of meeting may be held in camera

to allow a free flow of discussion without impacting the personal privacy of some owner.  I don't think anyone wd hv difficulty with that.

as we work along, may come to spots, may have to return to CEC, may have to change a bit of process, accommodate a diff avenue and approach

hope Ccl wd give that consideration, but wd be done in a public mtg at Ccl

a work in process; need to be able to amend it to work in the best interests of those not only participating but public in general and cmnty as a whole

may want to change

some bits of our process as we go along

groups I'm liaising with v excited about this process and anxious to share with anyone who comes out

now est'd guidelines and consistency, ppl know where to go, ppl know where to look, a lot of concerns will dissipate

VV: I didn' t expect this cmnty engagement system to follow the course it has

when considering about a year ago, recognizing the efficiencies of using computers and email, I thought the idea of on-line electronic forums where ppl basically sign on and register and email their opinions; I thought that did sound like progress and shd show us some savings

I thought we'd be shown in due course roughly how much time that is, so that we can have a sense of what it cost.  This is pretty well the time of year we talk of budgets, and I was hoping we wd be seeing some indication of what the savings wd be by changing the scheme and I'm disappointed there's no reference to savings, there's no quantification neither in time nor money, so that's the first thing that makes me reluctant to receive this b/c it hasn't the first thing I wanted to see: what did it cost? what are we saving? relative to the previous method

leads me to this perhaps a brave effort, but a problem, been alluded to already with this matter of creating WGs that can choose of their own volition to exclude the public

I'm quite baffled by that, b/c according to the LGA, we ourselves as Ccl cannot magic out of thin air the right to exclude the public.  The conditions on wch that happens are clearly laid down in the LGA; there are only about three or four occasions, things to do with law suits, personnel matters, and they're v tightly controlled; b/c the govt, the enabling legislation I shd say, does not want us to have the power to exclude the public.

so I don't understand how Ccl can indirectly confer on a WG a power it doesn't have for itself, so I don't accept that.  It makes no sense to me and it's an offence against democratic principles.

I wd like to admonish the public, Madam Mayor. I really believe that the public can place every trust and faith in its elected M representatives, but I also believe it's with the proviso that the public always can watch, and I can't be more emphatic in reminding the public that this is a serious principle of democracy.

So I can't accept this report, I think it's such an important problem, that it simply isn't acceptable, it isn't something that can be received until this statement in effect that WGs can exclude the public is dealt with, so I won't be voting to receive this report.  I know a lot of work, of interest, but we must get back to basic democratic principles and have everything open to the public, and if something, as Cclr F has said, maybe there is a personnel matter, then it has to go to the Ccl, and Ccl itself has to go in camera according to the LGA and under no other circumstances.

MS: don't know why spending so much time on this matter

obviously-- [fire siren starts up!] -- I've been upstaged by Chief Oates again.

Obviously I think these WGs shd be open to the public

As chair of the Finance Cmte facing our challenging financial situation, we'd be more than happy to have any mbrs of the public to attend and hope they bring good money-making ideas with them when they come

I think what we shd do with these WGs is publish them ev week, list the meetings for the next week, if there's something the WG feels shd be discussed in private, they can excuse any mbrs of the public if there are any there.  That really is the end of it.

but to have a WG on Ambleside revitalization and I wd think they wd think they wd want to have the Ambleside ratepayers at the mtg; so I think we shd open up these groups, publish when they're meeting, and move on

CAO: for clarification, the WGs are working in accordance with the legislation, we have got a legal opinion on that

and again as I mentioned earlier on

we're having a mtg with staff to clarify the guidelines, staff to outline their workplan for the entire year, set a specific schedule, and then get that onto the website so any mbr of the cmnty can understand how often these groups are meeting, where they're mtg and what mtgs they can attend

hope to have that in the next couple of weeks

Mayor: important recognizing taking spirit of what the Cmnty Charter is driving at, but unencumbering ourselves from some of the litigiousness

 of that and the labour intensiveness, is  all that we're doing.  Absolutely this is all posted

to me, the height of democratic principles is to have citizens working on citizens' problems for citizens' cmnties and we are trying to take ourselves out a step from that as a Ccl and we look forward to the really broad input from these WGs on the problems set as the priorities for this Ccl as a direct reflection of what the priorities for the cmnty are.

If I can express a disappointment, Cclr V, it's that you cdn't serve on that cmte with us b/c I really truly offered you that apptmt and you came to a couple of mtgs, b/c I know how important transparency and democratic principles are to you.

I'm sorry you're not there, perhaps you'll consider serving next year.

Sop: ea cmte has costs, printing, and wonder where money's going to come from

CAO: ea dept has a small budget for small projects; if any extra special costs--

I know some tasks will require going out and having townhall mtgs, so just in process in identifying those costs, still minor from what I've seen so far, but trying to identify those; we do have a special projects budget every year, and at this point it appears we'll be able to accommodate that.

Sop: this is received for info tonight; assume going to go back to CEC

where will be written in our desire to keep as under Charter

Mayor: coming next I believe will be staff recommendations for standardizing the processes, publishing workplans, mtg schedules, all of that

look forward to seeing you there b/c we've had a couple of holidays where we've missed one another

Sop: appreciate all that and we'll certainly meet

Mayor: that will all come to CEC, wch you're on and you can help to fashion that report that will come to Ccl.

[JF made motion -- MOTION CARRIES -- I saw VV opposed -- VIVA!]

Mayor: everybody shd know all welcome

RECOMMENDED: THAT the following citizen appointments be made to the Community Engagement Committee for the term ending December 31, 2007: Patti Bolton; and Alex Tunner.

Sop: did read in report will be three

Mayor: one more, will be following up

VV: surprised to see any names; no disrespect to these no doubt v capable indivs

just don't see how you can, on an org chart, place non-elected reps with elected on a Cmnty Engagement Cmte, b/c that exercises authority over the leaders of the WGs, and I don't think that works

think you can have advice from non-elected mbrs but don't think you can empower them to have any kind of authoritative role -- sets rules for other cmtes

don't think any non-elected ppl on their

Mayor: Ccl did make a decision to do that, but I'll refer to Mr Stuart

CAO: as we've done with Fin/Aud we make distinctions as to what items citizen mbrs can participate in and wch not, for example, the actual external audit presentations the citizens wd be excluded from

can take a look at Cclr V's concerns as they apply to the CEC, keeping in mind it's an adv cmte to Ccl; I don't think they make many decisions;

can take a look and if Terms of Ref have to be revised, can bring that back to Ccl

RD: inclined to agree with Cclr V

we've got 81 ppl on these nine Working Groups; got resumes and things of this sort not absolutely private

not sure if CEC does other things, cd be has other functions -- not entirely sure they shd be involved in selecting cmte/WG mbrs themselves

CAO: that activity has been done by the ccl mbrs; the next role is to tie up some loose ends for processes for WGs, and then move into the broader issue of our cmnty engagement strategy and policies with the public in general

RD: okay, that's fair enough

Mayor: wch is why appointing them at this point, having done that work, purview of cclrs

systems, on-line forums, all kinds of things, corollary parts of this new approach

to mention backgrounds of these two ppl: one just finished a Master's degree at Royal Roads in citizen engagement; the other was v involved in sgl transferable vote and democratization in the prov; both WV residents, both with a lot to offer around governance, opennness, transparency, and the kinds of things we're really interested in

we're v fortunate; will be mindful

make certain not involved in things of a personal nature.

CARRIED (VV voted against)

Mayor: Ccl is discussing with our staff about the enrolment exceeding the allowable limit for the Morven campus, traffic/congestion challenges; report in two weeks' time; so aware we're working on both

Mr Jamieson: not here to talk about the Wentworth variance changes; phone calls flew around our cmte working group for Glenmore, also keen on openness and transparency

we were led to believe there'd be some discussion re school in Glenmore, their apparent refusal to reduce enrolment, is this the appropriate time?  not listed on Ccl

Mayor: that will come Apr 16; now or better 16th

Jamieson: won't be here; I'll be skiing; our comments clearly relate to transparency and openness in that we really had some difficulty getting some info out of the School... they were to talk to us

huge trust issues; some issues such as underground parking; they clearly lied to us

how does Ccl feel about the bylaw ignorance?  I know there's been some letters recently, from Andy who pointed out that the govt gives a $2208 per student subsidy -- 118 extra students comes to $260,544, these children are paying fairly handsome school fees; there's about $1.5M involved in this

this issue started in 2004; I've checked my dated correspondence, communicating with K Lee in the Engg Dept, that started with parking and school numbers

no effort even on a temp a basis reduce even by 20 pupils as a token

you guys can't ignore it any more; large legal or liability responsibility if there is a fire or medical emergency in our area; at 3pm a 20-min delay -- no doubt some smart lawyers out there who cd get some money of the pockets of the WV Ccl if you're going to ignore this for longer

I do realize the weapons to get the school to comply may be relatively feeble; but on moral high ground, I speak for my neighbours not myself alone, not happy for them to continue overstuffing the school by 120 pupils

Bruce McCartney: can I pose my questions after I've seen the outline of what the city is proposing?

Mayor: no, unfortunately we hear public input and then we have our discussion and then we move to the next thing

This will come back Apr 16 in another iteration, so maybe better come back Apr 16

BMcC: 98 Glenmore Drive; why I'm here, I found out about this agenda item at  25 to 7, no notice There's a calling tree list among the neighbours in Glenmore saying something's happening at City Hall, impacting us; better get on this

sitting on my deck, looking east, directly over school, in my sightline directly; some sort of visual impact

I can hear the creak of the gate opening ev morning at 6:30, close enough to be consulted

if M limits parking in front of my house b/c convenient for students, suggest houses on Glenmore shd be part of notice

wd like to make it clear; number of ppl will be v active, depending on content of this report, b/c we have not been invited into this process; whatever scope of notice it include us

Mayor: glad you gave them to us now; you will be notified of Apr 16 mtg; you'll be in good shape to participate

CAO: this is Wentworth campus, will be public report on Morven campus; wd like assure residents interested whatever think needs to be done will have a public consultation process

SJN: report will be av one week before the ccl mtg will be on ccl agenda

prelim review by staff; proposal altered to comply with envtal concerns; not in condition to be taken out to nbrhd; to be reviewed by Design Review Cmte, before Ccl proceeds

Sop: looked at this; think top of bank shd all be dedicated park; playing fields open to public to use; maybe school look at space for child daycare

traffic off Chairlift; Chippendale presume will be correct and spot for buses, biodiesel

plan; tickets otherwise resident-only parking; cmnty benefits can be derived from this that we shd examine/consider when it comes back to Ccl

VV: Wentworth campus on agenda but the mbrs of public who spoke about Morven

shd assure them taking concerns seriously; not procrastinating or glossed over, dealing with Wentworth now

consult with ppl living around Wentworth area; know about stresses around Morven; response from nbrs

not inclined to hold it up at this point

Mayor: both nbrhds be made aware as will Collingwood's parents

[MOTION, APPLICATION RECEIVED]

Sop: when back to Ccl -- Design Cmte Apr 5 then?

Mayor: and says public information mtg midApril

SJN: back in May

Sop: early?

SJN: depends; might be variations b/c of speaking with nbrs, expect midMay.

JF: cd staff give Ccl some indication of the 10Kft connector; important aspect.

Mayor: 1000ft connector!

SJN: yes, we'll report on that

RD: Ccl appoints all five mbrs; present legislation being reviewed

not less than three mbrs -- if not unanimous, tabled to next mtg

RECOMMENDED:  ...   be received and made available for resident comment.

Mayor: b/c I missed the mtg

thank staff for excellent info; getting close

a couple of concerns I'd like to underscore

challenge to stick to stated priorities, not to... ev cmnty wants us to do; bottom line impact

the other thing that came up from staff, significant challenge of attracting staff b/c labour market shrinking

I think our residents' quality of life is directly affected by our staff and their attention to our issues and providing outstanding service

at a health conference at Wosk Ctr Thurs and of the ten [occupations? with] acute shortage; six are health science professionals; by 2015, 85% shortfall in lab technicians.....[etc]; that's just healthcare

feeling already challenge to fill positions in engg and planning

upside for WV, we have such an engaged cmnty; will have to start doing things on our own

branding us as employer of choice; those of us committed to public service will have to pull together to attract....

can't measure what our staff do here

budget discussion for ccl mrgs,  Apr 16, 23, 30

Fin/Aud Cmte will meet weekly starting tomorrow at 4:30, open to the public (Tuesdays)

to allow to pick up from what happened at ccl mtg; want to continue wrt Fiscal Task Force recommendations

that's on budget writ large

important to begin the debate; going out to public; good for Ccl to understand where Ccl is coming from; wd you like to introduce the capital budget

RL: made av in draft form last Thurs -- sets out proposed prog from 2007 - 11

recognizes continuing resource constraints until completion of new cmnty ctr; schedules attached-- by mid 2008, final project under RFMP

includes continuation of enhanced infrastructure maintenance

provision of a new police bldg on a placeholder basis

Amb Park infrastructure improvements including a restaurant concession by priv devpr

replacement of Almondel Bridge

capital costs for new radio equipment required for Police Dept joining EComm

details slightly different from orig documentation supplied Mar 12

other projects from comb of reserve funds, cmnty amenity contributions, and partnership arrangements

Mayor: two wishing to speak; begin with David Roach; keep comments to three minutes

David Roach: wd like to suggest, make av the financial position of the District in advance of the Apr 16 mtg; financial position; prelim annual report, balance sheet, for year ending Dec 31

reason: working through report, I notice some real differences, in the amts you can withdraw for 2007/8, about $25M

My own estimate of Y/E based on audited balance 2005, plus reasonable assumptions as to interest earned, and draw of $7M -- don't know if happened, haven't report; land sale of Upper Lands cd be $5 or 7M, but don't know b/c no report; works out perhaps we've got somewhere between ~$26M and $28M as at the end of last year in the Endowment Fund; based on the 2005 threshold value and working forward with a 2% increase for CPI as indicated in the 2007 budget report, the Endowment Fund threshold is about $20M, that leaves us with $6.4 to $8.4M we can draw from the Endowment Fund, but what we have planned from the EF, the latest report from Mr Laing, is $13.7M, a diff of about $5.3M wch for 2007 is slightly different from the $1.7M indicated in Mr Laing's report tonight.  Perhaps the 2007 draw for the Cmnty Ctr wasn't $7M, might hv bn less, but we don't know that, and so the reason I'm asking for the statement of the financial position of the District is to that we can resolve these issues before going to last public mtg Apr 16, 14 days from now.

Mayor: tyvm; over three minutes now, sorry.  We'll try to get that, don't know if it's possible.

RL: at the townhall mtg on Th there was a request by Mr Roach to know what the balances were in the Endowment Fund and Capital Facilities Reserve Fund and since then I've actually prepared a five-year projection of the transactions through those funds, and what the balances are at the end of each year; and I can make that av on the web starting tomorrow.

Mayor: and Fin&Aud Cmte mtgs and of course you can provide us your input any time

DR: final comment; when we do this stuff, we seem to get it piecemeal and I'm sure you're getting it piecemeal too; we can't just sit down and look at it all together, one place, one time and get it out of the way, wch wd be an advantage to us and to you.

CAO: the problem is that the year-end timing is not consistent with our budget cycle and so that's just a reality we have to deal with, we can deal with estimates but, if our goal of concluding budget discussions is in January, we will never be in the position to have all of this Y/E info except on a estimated basis, av for budget discussions -- that's just a practical difficulty that we face.

CR: Editor of WV Matters, 1497 Marine Drive;  couple of questions

wd also like to echo Mr Roach's comments of having statements as of Dec 31st; I think if it's difficult at least some sort of estimate wd be better than nothing -- that wd be my comment on that, whatever cd be done.

I agree that if we had it all, we can't really comment on this until we see that, and also I had asked for Information Technology (IT) information, but anyway, as long as we have it before -- is it by the 16th you said we'd have it, or tomorrow we wd have some of the Y/E information?

CR: will public be able to attend that F&A mtg?

CAO: I believe so

CR: Thank you; the other question I have about, ah, I see it has land sales, and I wd like to know the process as to the decision-making for land sales.  In particular when the Wetmore property was purchased, the commitment was made that there wd be widespread public consultation as to what to do with the Wetmore prop; I understand for land sales what you got from Ministry or BPP or whatever, something you don't really need public input for, but to sell some of the public land, it has come to my attention that in the past sometimes park land has been up for sale and the public wd like to know about that, and I'd like to be on record that the commitment was made that use of the Wetmore prop wd have widespread public consultation before it was sold or whatever is going to be done with it.

Thank you.

Sop: timeline, maybe May have to make decisions on budget; don't have many mtgs left

Mr Laing who's had a difficult time in trying to put this forward

consideration for our land holdings, ie, Wetmore site

the infrastructure in some cases near fail-safe, need of ongoing increased funds to meet demands of future

unless we adopt new principles even in this five-year budget going to find ourselves ev year back in same situation

over years had pay-as-you-go; we've invested, in our recreation, investment at 22nd is going to turn out to be a great plan, with the Health Assn and all that's there

we knew wd hv demand on us, once that is out of the way, now have a new situation

issues start cropping up: Almondel Bridge, $3M bill have to face now, other amts $1M; seems to me a never-ending story

demands and pressure on budget not going to be solved in three or four mtgs

I think we need some drastic thoughts on new modelling in relationship to how going to find ourselves in serious trouble; taxpayer and pressure on prop tax; inevitable; certainly, look at new modelling for Engg Dept how to raise funds in future

cmnty amenities, take serious look -- eased up sewer plants by devprs in future

all ways and means providing release of some pressure

you're going to another mtg tomorrow, Madam Mayor, another pressure on prop tax

don't know what direction that's going to go; diff time, have to take a serious look, not move along without some public input esp when it comes to selling our land.

VV: v interesting study of our capital position

are we living within our means or not? perhaps Dir/Fin might help with that

money moves in and out of funds

-- so my question around Cap Reserves and End'mt Fund

some intent to sell some other lands, proceeds reimburse the Endowment Fund"

I don't think that's as simple as it sounds; do own [Wetmore] site and others

if selling to get money, predicated on assumption with decent zoning, so that someone can build multiple housing units on it; without that not much money coming to us as result of sale; depends on accepting further densification

less than a week ago, final report of MOT by consultant Urban Systems on LGB to Hwy 1 connector planning study; that tells us how much cost us to restore the waiting times now we have at the LGB if we carry on with our planned devts, on WV side it's $100M

see all this as connected

CAO: when Ccl approves a budget, we're obligated to proceed; sure Ccl comfortable with scope, etc

what happens with five-yr; there are a number of reports that come back to Ccl, particularly capital expenditures

no question of legality, just putting aside funds

recently rather than for reserve fund, instead for banquet hall

issues Ccl has the opp to debate, not only inclusion in capital budget, particularly eg Grt Hall, if gap and wdn't proceed unless funding for gap

Wetmore was an investment, full understanding to return to Endowment Fund; if not, then wd hv to find funds to replace the value of that contribution.

VV: re Golf fund, staff seek to save Ccl from its own folly? is that why delay?

[chuckling] that's impossible, we have to have our golf clubhouse

Mayor: whole bunch of process before anything spent.

JF: v interesting five-year cap plan; good look at what we've been doing

ongoing maintenance, upgrading, sewer, etc, spent a lot of money but nec, for many years, little had gone on; behind eight ball so to speak; same for rec facilities, nothing had taken place

have spent a lot of money in last few; well spent; providing facilities used for next 30 to 40 years; a lot of social and health needs

I too think set aside time for a public process and to deal with Endowment Fund threshold as well as decisions re land

one of first may be police stn; cont with Amb plans, what happens on corner of 13th pivotal; sooner public can be involved the better

any input received from the two draft policies at same time, amenities and sponsorship -- any public input on those?

Mayor: any we know of?

SJN: public sponsorship one has been reviewed by adv cmte, public, will be reporting back to Ccl

MS: not quite sure where to go with this

we're not approving these projects tonight, it's a draft plan out to public for comment, not in position re voting tonight

IMO the whole mark of a good biz or good org, protection of capitalism is key, that's why they call it capitalism; you have to be constantly protecting your capital base

I wd like to see this, and hv seen prev Ccls, replacing capital as they spend it, b/c the reality is there's always gong to be a demand for capital

we see it now, $85M for next five years; always be a demand; when we see proposals to lower thresholds, these types of things, I really view them with alarm.  I don't think it's the way to go. This Endowment Fund was est'd years ago so District wd hv a nest egg earning interest, think it was a wise decision

For this or any other Ccl to change IMO it not the correct way to do biz

shd go forward with plan, get public comments

challenge for us and staff is to come up with ways of taking some of our assets to generate new capital, to replace signif drain on capital we've had in last few years; look forward to what the public has to say.

Mayor: wonder if Mr Laing or Mr Stuart cd comment wrt restrictions we operate under LGA, Endowment Fund, capital

CAO: and the kitchen sink

Mayor: know we need to bring some things in compliance

CAO: re Endowment Fund, bylaw itself needs to be updated to bring in compliance with Charter

number of issues re purpose of fund, what expenditures allowed; expectation generally not nest egg without ideas what to spend on

issues around what is appropriate threshold, things thrown into bylaw when created

questions around appropriate threshold;

issues around bylaw, conforming with Charter

will be bringing a report to Ccl dealing with the mechanics of that

wrt capital in general, Endowment Fund now is beneficiary of all land sales; rules what we can spend operating money on; what we can do in terms of sales of assets, what we can do with that money

general rule, you can't relieve yourself of assets without reinvesting or at least without committing themselves towards capital investments, you can't be selling property and investing that in operating costs; fairly tight rules around how we operate

some v important policy assumption: include Ccl willing to consider debt, for example for the construction of a Police bldg -- not in this year so Ccl has a number of years for Ccl to consider how to approach that -- ; there's a presumption that when we built the cmnty ctr, there wd be profit that wd emanate from the Wetmore site that we wd use toward the costs of the cmnty ctr,

so there's an assumption of some land sales.  There's the sale of the Horseshoe Bay firehall site, another example.  Those were built into the capital planning model under wch Ccl approved prev projects.

In add'n: partnerships, eg Ambleside concession; cmnty amenity contributions.

staff constraints are that we're not going to go ahead with a particular project unless revenue source is in the account and av to us and Ccl has the opp to approve that.

This Five-Year Plan is a framework, consistent with the Fiscal Task Force it is departing, not just depending on capital reserves; agree things are changing

lots of policy issues here

laying the framework for our Ten-Year Capital.

**********  ADDED AGENDA ITEM: Add'l ccl mtg Apr 30 -- PASSED

Sop left for EvDr b/c of conflict of interest

The Two Bylaws received first reading on November 14, 2006.  A Public Hearing regarding the Two Bylaws was held on December 04, 2006 and closed. The Two Bylaws received second and third reading on December 18, 2006.  BOTH RECOMMENDED FOR ADOPTION

JC: since two will read separately for separate vote

CARRIED

JC: Zoning

CARRIED

9.         Consent Agenda Items - Reports and Correspondence

10.       Development Variance Permit Application 07?003 (7040 Marine Drive)

RECOMMENDED:

            THAT the report dated March 16, ... be received for consideration on Monday, April 23, 2007.

11.       Development Applications Status List (File:  1010?01)

            RECOMMENDED THAT the Development Applications Status List be received.

12.       West Coast Railway Association - Royal Hudson Steam Train (File:  1605?15/1610?20?1684)

RECOMMENDED:

            THAT Council approve an exemption from the Sounding of Train Whistles Prohibition Bylaw No. 1684, 1958 for the West Coast Railway Association to allow the Royal Hudson Steam Train to sound its whistle while passing through West Vancouver on two trips scheduled for April 14 and 16, 2007.

13.       Correspondence List (entire in prev issue) -- RECOMMENDED: ... be received.

Mayor: [items wanted] removed?

VV: remove item 8 [13.8] re Gleneagles Golf Course; discuss later?

RD: 13.1

Mayor: [Receipt] Motion carries.  Begin with Correspondence item 13.1

        Referred to the Director of Planning, Lands & Permits, and the Director of Administrative Services for consideration and response.

RD:  letter from Wally and Dorothy Beck.  I think this is the Wally Beck who's the jazz musician whose music I've enjoyed over the years, I'm not sure.  Pretty sad story.  Lived in house for 50 years and a big big huge house being built right next to them destroying their peace and tranquillity, just hope that our new WG on Housing and Nbrhd Planning can take a look at some of the problems our residents are having with some of these spec devts [on] lots next to our houses, and making life pretty hard for ppl, and this is a good letter about what ppl are up against.  I'd just like to note that and hope the WG can come up with some solutions as a way of protecting our nbrhds.

Mayor: 13.8, Gleneagles Golf Course

        Referred to the Director of Parks & Community Services for consideration and response.

VV: letter from someone nearby, potential for noise construction and rented out for functions

been thought about to extent doesn't disturb nbrhd

suppose we intend to deal with parking; safe for pedestrians; points raised in his letter, doubt been addressed yet; looking for assurances concerns will be addressed

CAO: one of the reasons this project has not gone had; appropriateness; interests golf course, those wanting to save, ecology, parking; such a divergence of views

those who want to save banquet hall, ... parking, am trying to have a game plan outlined ev supportive of, given Ccl's decision apparently to go ahead with both proposals

once had mtg, will be reporting back to Ccl; none of the concerns new

Mayor: this is beginning of a process; beginning with CAO, myself, Mr Pike, interested residents --all aspects, soon, next week?

CAO: trying to schedule that now

Sop: why is Ccl not involved?

CAO: Ccl directed staff to meet with the residents so that's what we're doing initially, will report back to Ccl

Mayor: point is to report back to Ccl on process

Sop: you'll meet with public, you'll report to us, then we'll say go meet with public again?

Mayor: idea is to come up with a process; got to start somewhere

Sop: after all these years, this issue, involves many areas; Ccl shd be involved from the outset and dealing with it and getting on with it; this process of going back and forth, back and forth, another seven months go by; don't know if right way

CAO: we're pretty clear directions from Ccl; only issues scope of project and issues

will be reporting back to ccl, don't think five to seven months; mtg quickly

dealing with now, on same site or separate

what's scope of Gtt Hall project, pro-shop, bistro; how confirm costs, get conceptual designs

think can move on this and bring something back to Ccl

again residents have pointed out noise, have to be sensitive to that

Sop: certainly have to talk to public about those issues

concerns me, think there's misconstrued position where Ccl believes this facility shd be and where staff believes it shd be; that came up last time before us

CAO: quite aware of Cclr Sop's preferences and some mbrs of Ccl; direction we got was to meet with Golf and ppl saving Grt Hall and arrive at a decision both can support; direction we got and will report back to Ccl

Sop: what's staff position where it shd be?

Mayor: positions, a little early; having watched Ccl's decision on DVD and after several years of trying to put this on the agenda of the select cmte on Rec Facilities and not something they wanted to tackle, I think it's great the direction Ccl set.

I think sending the MManager, the Dir of Parks, and the Mayor to sit down for a preliminary mtg to scope out a process, a budget, cmnty involvement, what mbrs of Ccl want to be involved that's where we're beginning great

not a decision or positional type of mtg, it's a beginning

Sop: beg to differ; on basis we want look at golf plan to cover costs, maintenance in future

at time we made some decisions; as Cclr Day, let's take a look and get serious, wasted five years in not looking at it; assumption was all on one site and if we're going to divvy up and look at borrowing

not so sure want to go into debt for a bldg on the first green

certainly I'd be looking at advantage of a bldg around the Grt Hall, saved funds for it and borrow for rest; based on a golf plan that wd pay for this over a period of time; not that golf revenues go back into general revenue; we'd have a format, a biz plan; besides talking to the cmnty out there

my assumption at time; seems to have withered away

disturbing  to me staff feel still on first tee

CAO: we're not withering anything away

assure Ccl if as result after deliberation, consensus is all together, fine with us.

Mayor: let's draw this decision to a close

Sop: as long as someone's getting the msg

RD: take it that staff is interviewing the groups; seems WRA has one site in mind and the golfers another, makes it tricky; attempt to find a compromise; difficult to obtain but got to do it

CAO: have two groups with goals and hope to find a way to do that; trying to schedule that mtg.

14. REPORTS from MAYOR/COUNCILLORS

MS: first mtg of childcare WG; went v well; citizens excellent choices

[no notice!!!]

staff; needless to say cclr strong addition to group

[chuckles]

one of the first challenges is the Cedardale; need to have mtg with the Sch Bd

1200 students moving into schools and we're moving them out

all mbrs of Ccl and Sch Bd together with staff -- resolve best for all residents of WV including chn

Mayor: asked Meghan to set that mtg up; time for Ccl and Sch Bd to get together

RD: on Rodgers Crk Working Group -- all been up there now, three separate trips up there

up a few days ago, had sun; prev group went up in the driving rain -- site is steep just as well b/c a lot of creeks appear in winter and disappear in summer; challenge in that area, clear to concentrate on flat areas, and leave steep alone; fair degree of consensus on cmte and owners; diff site to develop, have to do it sensitively

Apr 12 next mtg, public is always invited, BPP will be making a detailed analysis of its challenges on that site, giving a clear picture of what it hopes to do in response, in response cmte will get into discussion with BPP; again public invited; on Apr 12 here 5:30 in Ccl Chambers

JF: The Ambleside Study WG met last Tuesday from 8-10am at Ch/Comm bdroom. We had one mbr of the public attend

 

interesting mtg for our first get together

realize rather complex issue to discuss and attempting initially to decide the process, come to some consensus, how going to approach this, what were issues of primary concern, list priorities, what first before second

did game sticky notes, wrote three most important issues; fascinating experiment; managed to get them all prioritized; wide-ranging discussion, creative input, amenable disagreement at this point; we'll have to see how goes from there

Sop: a report will be coming shortly to Ccl from Soc Services, grants -- got it done in record time, ahead of other Ms; shows what a team of grt ppl can do including a qualified cclr

{several chuckles}

also started second phase on a recommendation to Ccl, on a triM basis; think we hv to look at Sq Nation too wrt social services; you kindly with Mr Stuart will get someone to be on bd with us, think it's vital

shortly will be starting up Envtal WG -- assure you end of year incredible positions for Ccl to look at,far-reaching and leadership as well

you and I, Mdm Mayor have yet to start Cmtny Ctr governance model -- Apr 15 I think

what I've seen, and on Fiscal Task Force, engaging new citizens, action cmtes so know they have tasks, awfully informed; think will find resounding success

Mayor: look forward to results

went to opening of new ultrasound Sat at LGH

struck me no issue with private contributions -- strength of cmnty there that morning; families shared stories; one family named a room for the doctor who helped them

lot to learn from the LGH Fdn...  Congratulations to them and can feel empowered by them.

15. PUBLIC QUESTIONS/COMMENTS

CR:  Sorry, after not coming for some time, now a few times, but I wanted to follow up on something that was said.

I listened to Cclr Vaughan's comments about the money {with this new system of WGs}, and I think there's still the same staff, there's still goodies served, but I think one of the advantages of the new system is the web forum {if/when it works}; I think that's a new thing that's great in the new system.  I don't want Cclr Day to think I was referring to him (RodgersCrWG).  They say they've had five mtgs; it was another cmte/WG that had had seven mtgs without notices, not Cclr Day's.  He's worked v v hard to try to get notices up.

RD: seven times!  I thought we were Number One.

Sop: no, the Social Services [WG]; time sensitive about the grants, we had to

Mayor: talking about money

RD: oh, okay.

Mayor: Mr Stuart may know the date; all will be on the website

CAO: met with staff this afternoon; Sheila's drafted up some guidelines;

we're just going to incorporate some fine-tuning and put that on the website.

Our hope is that in fact the WGs will not just look at 24 hours [for the notice], but in fact schedule for the balance of the year to the extent that they can and put that on the website.  We're also talking about a way to make sure when you go to District's website, on the home page, you can just go to one link and immediately go to all the schedules for all the WGs.

CR: Right.  That's what I was going to ask, is where, b/c I know some of them have been having [them, info] around the actual WG name and most ppl don't go there.  Most helpful, just if you'd like to know at least what I find, is just to click on the Ccl and Cmnty Calendar.  So if you click on the Calendar you get your ccl mtgs and things like that, and that's really v helpful.  I use that as the one-stop for all the mtgs.  Other places that's fine but we find Calendar most helpful.

I'm still a little worried at the end of the discussions about that item, and I'm seeking clarification about the closed mtgs.  Possibly the CAO is not aware but in fact there was a WG that voted to have their next mtg closed.  So that's not following the LGA [Cmnty Charter], and I know Mr Stuart thinks they [WGs] have been [complying with the legislation], but they haven't.

The next thing, and I'm sure it's not going to happen again, so I just wanted to let you know.  That was part of the cause of the worry of some ppl, that some mbrs cd just vote to close a mtg, and that was it.  So I am glad to hear you're going to have some guidelines, but also, Cclr Smith then said if they've got some good reasons, then they can do it.

Well, I'm afraid that I think I wd like to stick with the LGA and at the ADRA AGM Feb 6th, Cclr JF then committed that all her mtgs to go in camera wd follow the LGA--

JF: --my mtgs, I don't speak for other groups

CR: Right, for your mtgs.  And I think what some of us are asking, just as Cclr V was saying, Ccl and Ccl cmte mtgs are restricted to what they can declare in camera, that that shd apply to all mtgs, and that it shd not just be suddenly, "we don't want to discuss this in public".  I think if you're going to have guidelines, and Ccl now, Ccl cmtes, have the guidelines of in camera according to the LGA/Cmnty Charter, but all your WGs, or whatever you want to call them, shd hv the same guidelines for in camera.  So if that's made clear, and ppl understand it, then I think there wdn't be any confusion.

Mayor:  that's the spirit we're talking about, I think.

CR: that's the spirit of the--

CAO: the intent is to meet the spirit; the difficulty is with the Charter, you also get into all kinds of v finite wranglings around procedures and how minutes are dealt with, and what we're trying to do is adopt the spirit of the legislation but make sure we don't adopt all the unnec technicalities associated with it.

So that's the purpose of the guidelines, to ensure the spirit is met

so that the groups are not, and I'll just go back to some of the comments we heard when we reviewed the cmtes, how do we deal with minutes, how detailed do the agendas have to be, how detailed do the minutes have to be, how do they get approved, how do they not get approved, how do we get the notices up, the comment that having the notices outside the Ccl Chamber, wch is the statutory obligation, doesn't really meet the intent of the Act.  So what we're trying to do here is put together some guidelines that meet the intent of the Act but provide the groups with the flexibility. The only issue I've heard to this point from the groups is how do we deal with something, that at this point we just want to talk about, it's not ready to go out into the public; it wd be inappropriate if it was commented on in the public, until we've had a chance to consider it, and how do we deal with that.  And so we've got to struggle with ensuring we meet the intent of the Act and yet deal with those kinds of sensitivities.

CR: Okay. Well, we appreciate the fact that it cd be on the cmnty calendar or wherever you tell us it's going to be; we appreciate the fact that you're probably saying that notes wd be more efficient than minutes -- have no problem with that -- but I do have a problem with if, when a body decides, "we're uncomfortable discussing this in public".  This is public biz, this is an open democracy.  You discuss things in public except for those things in camera, I really don't see why anybody else... b/c it's the natural tendency of ppl to say, I just want to talk about this and not be responsible for what I say or whatever ..., I mean it's just a tendency anywhere; that's why there have had to be rules about going in camera, b/c most ppl wd rather not speak in public.  So that's my concern -- is that the in camera rules [LGA/Cmnty Charter], they shd apply everywhere, no problem with that; but to give a group, saying, well, we're just uncomfortable with that, I'm sorry I don't think that meets the intent or spirit of the legislation wch was specifically designed to stop that.

thank you

Mayor: thank you

Keith Pople: My question tonight concerns a procedure used by Ccl, one of the agenda items, the Ev Drive one in wch it is recommended bylaws be adopted.  Back in Dec, I think it was agreed by Ccl that prior to adopting any one of these amending bylaws, it wd be nec to present a master plan.  To my knowledge the master plan has not been presented yet.  Wonder why looking at adopting this bylaw.

Mayor: v good question; a lot of work still to be done.

KP: are you saying there is a master plan now?

SJN: no, there is not a master plan now; there's a covenant on title requiring a master plan before any devt occurs on the site.

KP: the way I read it, was that the adoption of the bylaws wd require the completion of the master plan, and discussion by Ccl

SJN: requires covenant placed on title that the prop wd not be developed in the absence of a master plan approved by Ccl.

16. ADJOURNMENT

===   WG LAMENTS: Apr, 6, 9, 12&nb= sp; ===  to Cclrs Day, Smith, Soprovich, Vaughan

fyi  Apr 6 appended with Intro and Update Apr 12 at end.

Just checked the DWV website and there was no change on the home page, the WG page, or the Calendar.

IOW the home page says there are mtgs planned for 12th and 26th (but does not say where or when), the WG page says there's a mtg Apr 26 with the proposed agenda to be confirmed on the 12th, and there's no reference whatsoever to any RCAWG mtg in April.

It's not just that a procedure shd hv bn established along with the WGs, but also on Feb 5th I was told procedures wd be put in place, and Apr 2nd (and before) assurances made about notification, public, etc.  With all the goodwill in the world, it is hard to take seriously the commitment (or is it incompetence and lack of organization so all unintentional and truly unfortunate) to providing the public with meaningful information or opportunities for involvement.

Is it a policy now?

Can you give me a date you think it will be followed?

The Calendar is the most efficient (one stop) to use and put in the newsletter.

If you put a link to the Calendar on the home page, it wd be much easier for the public to find out what mtgs are on.

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