Nov 5 Ccl Mtg NOTES
Calendar to Nov 28

by Carolanne Reynolds, Editor

HERITAGE UPDATE:  More stories about the Graham residence, designed by Erickson.  Evidently Julie Christie and Warren Beatty stayed their during the making of McCabe and Mrs Miller.  Also, apparently it has fallen into disrepair. Now what?  Pls send your suggestions to heritage@westvan.org or call 922 4400; site visit planned this week.  See info/comments made during PQP at end of Nov 5 mtg (starts with *****), followed by more after the mtg stopped before a mbr of public wanted to speak.

=  MAIN ITEMS Ccl Mtg Nov 19: PH Gas Station 13th & Marine; DVP 866 20th; rest not out until Thurs, Nov 15; probably won't be a WVM newsletter but agenda will be sent to subscribers.  Revised Ccl Procedures???
=  Vive le Canada; INFObits (Loss of Murchie's; Property Values plummeting; Crime Stats/Regional Policing?; ADRA Survey results); UPDATES (Streamkeepers; Christmas Toy Drive); THEATREWATCH; BOOKWATCH (3); CALENDAR to Nov 28th (Streamkeepers' public mtg Nov 15 agenda; Chamber of Commerce, Library, etc)
=  Nov 5th Ccl Mtg NOTES: Increase in MLAs opposed; Cmnty Ctr Qtrly Update, Parking; Correspondence -- Hugo Ray Pk, Dund Traffic/Parking, Vinson Crk flooding, Atlas cedar tree removal; save the Erickson house!
More on Erickson's Graham house; Book Review (serious); Book Report (naughty); More Acronyms; Quotations

NOVEMBER 16  -- Deadline for Entries: Annual Poster and Literary Remembrance Contest - http://www.westvan60.com/poppy/poppycontest.html  More info at www.legionlegacies.ca and Julie Clements reports she has finished documenting all the WW II Honour Rolls and plaques, and posted five new pages under the Remembrance menu: WW II - 1946 Honour Roll; WW II - St. Francis-in-the-Wood Honour Roll; WW II - St. Stephen's Anglican Church Honour Roll; WW II - WV United Church Honour Roll; WW II - WV Memorial Library Book of Remembrance
{My, she is fast!} Nov 1, 2 & 3, 2007 Poppy Tagging Photos and Nov 4, 2007 Capilano View Cemetery Service Photos are now available on www.westvan60.com
I can't wait for the Nov 11 pix!  Saw the Mayor and Cclrs Day and Sop at the Library after ceremony.
>>>  In honour of Remembrance Day, these are just incredible stories -- yes, World War ONE!!!:
Surviving WWI: Veterans' stories -- Ahead of Remembrance Sunday, Britain's surviving World War I veterans talk about their memories of the conflict...  Harry Patch, who is 109 years old, was called up for service in 1917...  See more at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7084764.stm
===  INFObits
>>>   Sad to see ad for Murchie's; in receivership in VSun, Nov10 pG2 -- loss of a heritage business/company?
The day after the Rodgers Crk WG mtg Nov 8 in wch BPP dropped the fact that property values in California had dropped 30%, here's a report from Chicago that arrived from BBC enews -- even more of a slide.  Looks like we're in for a ride.  See: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7078492.stm
>>>   CRIME STATS (2005) from PoliceBoardWatcher:
Comparing West Van /// North Shore / Vancouver // BC Average of Independent Police / BC Avg RCMP
        Cost per capita:  $222 /// $169 / $291 // $257 / $159
        Popn per police officer:  590 /// 778 / 498 // 555 / 782
        Crime rate per 1000 residents:  60 /// 78 / 117 // 111 / 131
(North Shore = consolidated/average for CNV+DNV+DWV)
What does this mean? If Chief Heed gets his wish (regional police force), our costs are likely to go up and the number of police serving WV will drop.
>>>  ADRA PRESS RELEASE re Survey [this newsletter's version has Canadian spelling; bolding also mine]
For Immediate release [West Vancouver, BC] October 29, 2007
A survey conducted by a West Vancouver [ratepayers'] organization suggests strong opposition to more dense development of the Ambleside [Business District] in West Vancouver. Higher buildings and increased density have been proposed by [a Working Group] appointed by West Vancouver Council.
The survey by the Ambleside and Dundarave [Ratepayers'] Association (ADRA) was conducted by mail and e-mail over the past month.
ADRA President Elaine Fonseca said, "These results indicate a significant level of dissatisfaction and concern regarding the Working Group's proposals."
"Our members showed remarkable uniformity in their [responses:]
* 85% of those who completed the survey oppose any increase in density in the Ambleside Business District;
* 82% said traffic and parking is already a problem in the Ambleside Business District,
* 88% said additional parking should be provided in any new development," said Fonseca.
She went on: "We asked the membership to identify what building heights they support for the Ambleside Business District:
* On the north side of Marine Drive, 45% would permit three storeys, 45% would prefer two storeys. So, together, 90% want to see building heights limited to three storeys or less.
* On the south side of Marine Drive, 66% want building heights limited to two storeys, 28% would limit heights to three storeys. So, some 94% of respondents would prefer to see the height of buildings on the south side of Marine limited to three storeys or [lower."]
The survey also asked ADRA members about residential neighbourhoods generally.
Fonseca said:
* 73% oppose the rezoning of single-family neighbourhoods;
* 68% do not support infill [housing];
"Traffic and parking are seen as significant problems in our neighbourhoods," Fonseca said. "More than 60% of the respondents said parking and traffic are already problems on their neighbourhood streets."
Finally, the results show near unanimity in one significant area: The ADRA President said that "95% of those who completed our survey want limits to new growth to be established in West Vancouver."
Fonseca said ADRA's Board will guide their future actions and comments according to the opinions expressed by their members in the survey.
~ For further information: David Stephenson (dstephenson@telus.net; 926 5736), Director, ADRA
{FYI: These results have been compiled from returned surveys representing several hundred responses. Please note also that some businesses presently in Amb are at .40FAR and the Amb WG incredibly has recommended a flat 1.75FAR and with bonusing to 2.75FAR.  The good news is that Ccl plans to get out information and have more public input.  Thank heavens!  No surprise re the recommendations from the Amb WG wch was composed of almost all bizmen/devprs.  Staff's recommendations vary a bit from the Amb WG's.  Make sure you have your say.}
= [thanks to Hugh Hamilton, Nov 10]
Rodgers has not recently had many salmon, and we wonder why? In 2002 there was a run of chum, but they couldn't get past the culvert obstruction at BC Rail. In 2003 BC Rail put in a large (10ft diameter) culvert and we hoped this would encourage returning salmon.   Not till 2005 and 2006 did we get salmon up to the pool at Marine Drive. In each of these two years we observed three or four coho in late December at the Marine Drive pool, though there could have been more. This year we are still waiting for chum or coho, and are jealous that they seem to prefer Lawson Creek!!
Renaming of Sway'wey [NSNews Nov 4th, excerpt]
..."Park Royal was once lush with marshes and sloughs," said Squamish Chief Ian Campbell. "This was Sway'wey -- not just some little creek." The creek and lagoon once provided the villages in the area access by canoe to a burial ground that was behind Park Royal towers, said Campbell.
According to a Vancouver Sun article from 1940, the lagoon was also home to John "Navvy Jack" Thomas whose family lived in a "neat, white house on the west side of the creek's delta". Navvy Jack, a gravel excavator from Wales, was the first European settler in the area. He was the grandfather of [the wife of] the late Chief Dan George of the Burrard Inlet Tsleil-Waututh Nation.  For the whole article, go to:
WEST VANCOUVER  Emergency Services Toy Drive  --  November 5th - December 15
Contact:  Const. Jeff Palmer, Community Services Unit (WVPD) - 925 7348
                Assistant Fire Chief Martin Ernst (WVFD) - 925 7370 
2007 West Vancouver Emergency Services Toy Drive Ready For Launch
West Vancouver Emergency Services are responding together again to brighten the holiday season for children and families in need.
From Nov 5th through Dec 15th, WV Police Headquarters and all WV Fire Halls will collect new toy and gift donations for delivery to the Lower Mainland Christmas Bureau and the Family Services Christmas Bureau of the North Shore.
This is the second year WV Firefighters and Police will work together on the Toy and Gift Drive.  Last year WV residents put aside a month of damaging windstorms, power outages, and mudslides to generously donate over 500 gifts.  WVFD Fire Chief Jeff Oates and WVPD Chief Constable Kash Heed were first to donate to the 2007 Drive.  "We look forward to building on the success of last year's drive," says Chief Constable Heed, "WV Firefighters and Police Officers believe sincerely in helping people. We're fortunate to work in a community where so many residents feel the same."
"Our community really stepped up last year," added Fire Chief Jeff Oates, "Police and Firefighters will proudly help bring our community's generosity to those in need and will be ready with all the muscle required to deliver donated gifts."
Residents are encouraged to bring New and Unwrapped Gifts to the WV Police Headquarters or any WV Fire Hall.  Please note we are unable to accept any used gift items.
Donation Locations:
WV Police: WVPD Headquarters - 1330 Marine
WV Fire and Rescue Services: Fire Hall # 1, 760 - 16th St;  Fire Hall # 2, 6272 Marine; Fire Hall #3, 4895 Marine; Fire Hall #4, 965 Cross Creek Road
>>>  Saw The American Pilot by David Greig (Scottish playwright), at the Jericho Arts Ctr; premiere in Canada for this play.  Thoughtful (interplay of Afghan and American cultures) but it ended Nov 3.  In any case am positive we'll see more of Maija Tailfeathers, one of only two half Blackfoot and half Saami (Norwegian Laplander) people in the world (played a daughter brought up traditionally but on the doorstep of the modern world -- she even has seen a bit of television at a friend's house).  Interesting hearing the Translator's view of the US after a few weeks in New York and San Diego.
>>>  Also saw His Greatness (Arts Club, Granville Island) b/c we admire Alan Gray's work and he was superb.  Takes place in 1980 when Tennessee Williams was here in Vancouver.  David Marr was also excellent.  Sorry, it ended Nov 10.   I'm referring to it as His Graytness......
>>>  Just had to see the inimitable Jay Brazeau in Albee's The Goat... who is Sylvia?  -- another great performance.  Susan Ristic, his wife (played Stevie, the wife), was also excellent.  What marriage hasn't had a crisis at some point (though maybe not so bizarre; presume it's a metaphor for whatever problem).  Albee is homosexual (as is son in play) so maybe PR msg -- how great being gay is in comparison with bestiality (love is hardly a choice).  Naturally I was tickled that sprinkled throughout were comments about language -- correcting and complimenting someone's usage.  Set was sophisticated.  Again, apologies since it ended Nov 10 too.
>>>  This time therefore, a headsup: Tideline is on now and I'll be seeing that (playwright in Montreal, won prize, about Canada and Lebanon, and as you know, I love Beirut; no illusions this is great theatre but has a tug for me); and Richard III with a powerful combination: Scott Bellis directing Bob Frazer!!!
= ONE:  ~ 1:30 - 3pm ~ Saturday Nov 17th at the Museum: "West Vancouver: A View Through the Trees" by Elspeth Bradbury.  Elspeth will talk about her long-awaited book on the history of the forests of West Vancouver.  Books are $45; proceeds go to the Lighthouse Park Preservation Society.  Enquiries to environment@westvancouver.ca -- it's an elegant book with beautiful photographs.  (See Calendar below).
= TWO:  The Dord, the Diglot, and an Avocado or Two: The Hidden Lives and Strange Origins of Common and Not-So-Common Words by Anu Garg
{Remember 32 Books (980 9032) in Edgemont Village has it.  And no, although I was involved in the book (copyeditor) it was pro bono; the email notice sent out by Anu has a corrected version of the blurb on the back cover, to wit:
What could a senator, a Muppet, an advice columnist, and a baseball player all have in common? What is one word that describes Bob Dole, Elmo, Miss Manners, and Ozzie Smith?
They all are illeists.
An illeist is one who refers to himself in the third person (for example: "Miss Manners does not condone ...")...
= THREE: 'How to Talk About Books You Haven't Read' by PIERRE BAYARD; reviewed by Jay McInerney in the NYTimes book review: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/11/books/review/McInerney-t.html?_r=1&8bu&emc=bu&oref=slogin
"A French literature professor on how to solve a classic problem: so many books, so little time."
Ain't it the truth!!!

===  CALENDAR to Nov 28th  === [M Hall unless otherwise noted; confirm b/c sometimes changes]

==  Tuesday Nov 13th -- Cmnty Grants/Soc Services WG ~ 7pm
==  Thursday Nov 15th
~ 4:30pm ~ Heritage Strategic Plan Implementation WG
~ 6:30pm (doors open at 6pm): End Homelessness Now Public Forum: Getting The "Chronically Homeless" Off The Streets; St. Andrews-Wesley United Church (Burrard and Nelson); Info: www.endhomlessnessnow.ca or 683 4574 A free public forum dedicated to finding solutions to ending chronic homelessness.
~ 7pm ~ NSh Family Court & Youth Justice Cmte at CNV M Hall
~ 7:30pm ~ WV Streamkeepers: Public Mtg (St Stephen's, 885 - 22nd) AGENDA
1. Call to Order, Introductions, Announcement of the Board for 2007-2008
2. Approval of Agenda // 3. Adoption of Minutes of March 15th 2007  // 4. Matters arising out of the Minutes of March 15th meeting
5. Review of the Rodgers Creek Area Plan Working Group - Michael Ritter / John Barker
6. Spawner Surveys - What we will be doing and who will do it- Elizabeth Hardy
7. Working with West Van Secondary students on Spawner Surveys - John Barker
8. Reports on Directors' Meetings of October 9th and November 6th 2007
9. Creek Reports: a) Community Adviser - Rob Bell-Irving; b) Municipal Report - Steve Jenkins; c) Hatchery Report - Elizabeth Hardy; d) Nelson/Eagle/Wood Creeks - Elizabeth Hardy; e) Rodgers Creek - Hugh Hamilton; f) McDonald/Lawson Creeks - John Barker; g) Brothers Creek and tributaries - Michael Ritter; h) Cypress/Claymore/Willow Creeks - Barrie Adams; i) Larson Creek - Kurt Peiffer/Bruce McArthur; j) North Shore Wetland Partners and Sway'wey Creek -Paul Berlinguette; k) West Vancouver Shoreline Preservation Society - Ray Richards
10. Announcements:  Egg-Take for our Nelson Creek hatchery. November 17th at DFO Tenderfoot Hatchery north of Squamish starting at 10am
11. Other business // 12. Adjournment   

==  Friday Nov 16th -- Arts & Culture Strategy ~ 8:45am
==  Saturday Nov 17th ~ 1:30 - 3pm at the Museum
Please join Elspeth Bradbury, the author of recently published book, West Vancouver: A View Through the Trees, who will describe the relationship between plants and people through 10,000 years of co-evolution.  West Vancouver has been blessed with magnificent natural surroundings. Above all, it is the forest that has shaped the community's history that colours its present and challenges its future.
==  Sunday Nov 18th
~ 10am - 3pm ~ WV Cmnty Ctr & Srs' Craft Market at Srs' Ctr
WV Memorial Library Book Club members are invited to swap their gently used book club books, meet and mingle, and enjoy some refreshments. Donate $20 to the Grandmothers Campaign in Africa; at WV United Church.
~ 3pm ~ Winter Harp, concert at St. Francis-in-the-Wood Anglican Church; info www.stfrancisinthewood.ca or call 922 3531 ($15); info on their rare instruments and photos: www.winterharp.com
SFU Harbourside Courses:
Nov 16 -17 ~~ Urban Design: Public Realm; Details: http://www.sfu.ca/city/course7popup.htm
Nov 20 ~~ 6:45pm ~ The Principles and Politics of Urban Sustainability - What Vancouver can learn on implementing smarter growth? SFU Harbour Centre; Seating is limited. RSVP by email: rsvp@planningcommission.ca Info: 604-873-7477
The Vancouver City Planning Commission is presenting an evening with Councillor Robert Liberty from Metro Portland, Oregon - an early and leading smart growth advocate....
Nov 23 - 24 ~~ New Approaches to Transportation in an Era of Energy and Climate Challenges; Details: http://www.sfu.ca/city/course8popup.htm [CANCELLED]

==  Tuesday Nov 20th or Wednesday Nov 21st
        possible dates for next Rodgers Creek Area Plan WG mtg -- check
==  Thursday Nov 22nd -- possible mtg wrt recreation in the Rodgers Creek Area
==  Tuesday Nov 27th -- mtg or Open House wch may be postponed to first week in Dec

==  Wednesday Nov 21st at 7pm: Library Board (at Library) and Board of Variance
==  Thursday Nov 22nd ~ Police Board mtg moved to Nov 28
==  Wednesday Nov 28th
        ~ 4pm ~ Police Bd mtg moved from Nov 22, in Police Dept Boardroom
        ~ 4:30pm ~ Heritage Strategic Plan Implementation WG

--  Landscapes -- Nov 6 - 25 -- Lynne Greene, Peter Langer, Leslie McGuffin, Barbara Wilson
        Opening Night: 6 - 8pm Nov 6; Artists in Attendance:  2 - 3pm Nov 10

+++  WV MEMORIAL LIBRARY +++ see www.westvanlib.ca for more!
Thursday 15 ~~ DOC.TALKS: Supersize Me:  6:30pm
Food for Thought: Eat, Drink & be Wary
This fall's Thursday night documentary and discussion series focuses on the business of food and drink, from the effects of globalization to a look at the marketing of excesses. We even supply free popcorn.  Morgan Spurlock embarks on a journey to find out if fast food is making Americans fat.  Spurlock's gruelling diet spirals him in to a metamorphosis that will make you think twice about picking up another Big Mac. Free event, no registration required.
Tuesday 20  ~~ Reading James Joyce's Ulysses: 10:30 - 12:30pm
        Please bring your own copy of the novel. Drop in - no registration required.
Friday 23 ~~ Friday Night Concert Series Presents: Musica Intima; Free concert but seating is limited so come early and enjoy refreshments by Friends of the Library. Doors open at 7pm, concert starts at 7:30pm.

+++  WV MUSEUM +++   BEHIND THE WIRE -- Nov 7 to Feb 9 
THE WARTIME DIARY AND ART OF ROBERT BUCKHAM. [Full description in previous issue]
Guest Speaker Series
=  Wednesday 7 - 8:30pm November 14
Guest speaker: Major Harjit Sajjan, Reservist, British Columbia Regiment, Reconnaissance Squadron
Topic: The Canadian Forces in Afghanistan Protecting Canadians -- Rebuilding Afghanistan
Major Harjit Saijan, a Reservist with the British Columbia Regiment where he is Officer Commanding, Reconnaissance Squadron, served in Afghanistan in 2006 under Brigadier General David Fraser, Commander of the Multi-National Brigade. Major Sajjan shares his personal experiences and discusses the Canadian Forces contribution in Afghanistan.
=  Wednesday 7 - 8:30pm November 21
Guest speaker: Lauryn Oates, Vice-President, Canadian Women for Women in Afghanistan
Topic: Women and War in Afghanistan
Lauryn Oates is a professional human rights advocate and international development practitioner, with expertise in gender and women's human rights. Since 1996, Oates has worked as an activist for women's rights in Afghanistan as founder of the Vancouver and Montreal Chapters of the non-profit solidarity network, Canadian Women for Women in Afghanistan. She managed the CIDA-funded Women's Rights in Afghanistan Fund and other projects supporting women's movements and peace building in the Middle East and Central Asia from 2002-2006 at the International Centre for Human Rights and Democratic Development. Her talk focuses on how the ongoing war in Afghanistan has affected the lives of Afghan women.
= Tuesday 7pm November 27 at the WV Memorial Library (1950 Marine)
                Special guest: David Paperny, President, Paperny Films
Documentary Screening of Forced March to Freedom, Paperny Films, 2001
David Paperny's documentary film, "Forced March to Freedom", is based on a book of the same name written and illustrated by Robert Buckham. The film illustrates the experiences of Canadian air personnel imprisoned in German PoW camps during World War II. 
At the end of the Second World War, ten thousand prisoners of war anticipated liberation courtesy the advancing Russian Red Army. The retreating Germans forced the prisoners to march out of Stalag Luft III in the dead of winter toward the centre of a collapsing Third Reich in order to keep the PoW's as hostages. Forced March to Freedom tells the story of this amazing test of endurance through the eyes of Robert Buckham, a bomber pilot and artist who produced countless sketches and watercolours of prison camp life, as well as one of the only chronicles of the forced march itself. Interviews with Buckham and other PoW's accentuate the sketches of camp life and the march as well as the few actual photographs of the march known to exist. The film producer David Paperny gives you the inside account of making the documentary film.
=  Wednesday 7 - 8:30pm November 28
Guest speaker: Brian Seward, MMM.CD, Rtd., 6th Field Engineer Squadron, North Vancouver
Topic: Close to Home: Peace Keeping Missions Abroad
Brian L. Seward came to Canada after serving in the Royal Navy and Merchant Navy from 1944 to 1955. He joined the 6th Field Engineers Squadron in North Vancouver in 1962 as a Sapper and served 28 years in all ranks up to Sergeant-Major and Captain. He served in NATO (Germany) in 1972 and attended numerous joint exercises with the US 407th Engineers, building bridges, repairing roads, and removing explosives. Seward was awarded the Order of Military Merit for his dedicated and exceptional service by Governor General Edward Schreyer in Ottawa 1980.

+++  WV ARTS COUNCIL +++ visit www.silkpurse.ca for more events (most ticketed)
Tuesday, November 6 - Sunday, November 18, 2007
'Woman - A Visual Journal'
The human figure has been revered as a symbol for perfection since the time of the Ancient Greeks, who modeled their gods in our image. In celebration of what it means to be a woman, join us for an exhibition of pencil and watercolour drawings of women by artist Pat Rafferty, who is devoted to a better understanding of the elements that make up the human figure and how to better portray them.

~ 4 - 7pm ~  Wednesday, November 28th at West Van Partners Centre, 1846 Marine
This is the Chamber members' opportunity to come and see our new offices, at 1846 Marine Drive, and join in this special Member Showcase as our launch event.  We are now located in the West Van Partners Centre, an office looking to the future by supporting and enhancing the connection between businesses and the community.
The new offices are home to the West Vancouver Chamber of Commerce, the West Vancouver Community Foundation, the Coho Society of the North Shore, and North Shore Spirit of B.C. Committee.
District staff for Cultural Services, Partnership Development, Special Projects/Events and 2010 Initiatives will be working alongside community agencies.  It's a fresh approach to what we all believe -- that we are here to serve the community better.
This event is a wonderful opportunity to bring a non-member with you to see the benefits of chamber membership in action!
Members having tables at this event: British Pacific Properties, Capilano College, Cypress Mountain, Heritage Law, Park Royal Shopping Centre, The Outlook.
We expect a large turnout as this is our premiere event in this location, so please call the office if you would like to reserve a table.  There will be fabulous door prizes, delicious appetizers and refreshments served.  In order to know the number for catering, please RSVP to:  www.westvanchamber.com or call 926 6614.

--->  For more events at KMC, see www.kaymeekcentre.com
at KMC:  Music for Mental Health -- Thursday, November 22, beginning at 7pm
Live music, auction, and no-host wine bar. Enjoy an evening of pop, Broadway, and jazz with three of Vancouver's top vocal talents: David Steele, Steve Maddock, and Karin Plato. A fundraiser for the Canadian Mental Health Association.
===  CCL MTG NOTES Nov 5th  ===
1.  APPROVAL OF AGENDA -- Add'l letters
2.  ADOPTION OF MINUTES: Oct 15 and 22
3.         V. MacGregor, President, West Vancouver (BC/Yukon) Branch 60, Royal Canadian Legion, regarding Veterans' Week November 5 - 11, 2007
{Remarks and video: The Legion's Legacies; see www.legionlegacies.org}
thx; join us Nov 11th; stand for act of remembrance
{we all did: We will remember them.}
Mayor, Proclamation of Veterans' Week, then: Thank you for the model of sacrifice, charity, and desire to serve that you offer West Vancouver every day; quite remarkable what you do for the cmnty... appreciate that.
4.         S. Isaac, regarding Existing Bylaws Pertaining to Bed & Breakfast Accommodations        
SI: Dave Isaac's here from Acumen Consulting (as moral support)
I made an application for a B&B licence but it was rejected b/c only existing B&Bs are allowed to operate
hope will be rescinded; 2010 Olympics fast approaching, need especially in Sea-to-Sky corridor
I'm proposing wrt First Nations culture
most B&Bs traditional English-style and in my instance I wd like to promote the Coast Salish culture; brought the matter before the Chief and Ccl of the Squamish Nation and he told me on the phone this afternoon that he was in full agreement of promoting the culture and wd endorse it.  Wd be willing to pass a band resolution wrt that support.
don't see anything in the bylaws that prohibit a B&B so must be within your policy -- think there was a grandfather clause and they wd not look at any future B&Bs
cdn't find anything that wd prohibit one; posing that question, don't know
SJN: B&Bs are defined in the Zoning Bylaws and unless listed, category not allowed in area
in consideration of zoning changes; Ccl received one of those, in Dund in past and decided not to allow; can apply, quite stringent
Mayor: kicks off the zoning process
SJN: allowed to exist as long as no more than two bedrooms; some prior may have more from time to time
JF: in initial discussions, this Ccl had discussions wrt B&Bs re 2010, going to be a need during the Olympic period and the run up.  I thought the cmte was going to look into that, granting that.
Motto is welcome, be our guests, and can't very well have that if we have nowhere for them to stay.  Think there's a motel in HBay
Has Olympic Cmte looked into that?
CAO: looked at in broad spectrum; issue if we cd not apply our bylaws during the Olympic period
VANOC just now getting into that, and renting homes; shd see report in next six months
JF: cd Ms Isaac register some place then when resolved, contacted?
CAO: we can follow up on that
SI: the 2010 Cmte, the four tribes in the Sea-to-Sky Corridor will be hosting; by promoting the culture through art, food, lodging, wd have a lasting impact in a post Olympic period.
JC: at the All-Candidate mtg at KMC, we were asked about B&Bs in run-up and to my recollection ev at this table said they wd support that
we have absolutely no accommodation in the M, unless stay with Cclr Ferguson
get at this sooner rather than later
Sop: made application?
SI: yes, and turned down
Cypress Mountain -- that alone will have an impact on commercial accommodation, esp in WV
RD: we have your name and not your address...  [for] Clerk's Dept
SI: 640 Ballantree Rd, in a cul de sac
JC: Ccl request a report from staff re B&Bs in WV within 90 days
RD: pretty good idea; remember site in Dundarave and struck me as a good site but nbrs turned out and really opposed, don't know how many
SI: only one
Mayor: no discussion
RD: nevertheless glad you answered it; so think we shd revisit it; don't have a hotel in WV, Olympics coming; can set up where can be without disruption
Sop: wondering about staff report -- zoning? public mtg?
JC: forcing ppl to rezone, expensive; Ccl cd just rescind
CAO: cd present some option; cd for temp or permanent basis
VV: my question -- for a few months or just during the Olympics; arriving, stay on a bit later
a lot of ppl who set up will say not worth capital for just a few months
staff just some simple points; see where ppl stand; don't want to go over and over again; maybe just during Olympics
Mayor: done during Expo, not sure your question
JC: Mr Stuart said he cd provide some options
SSch: comprehensive report re B&B options within 90 days
5.         Presentation by Western Community Services Society (formerly "Eagle Harbour Community Services Society") regarding Spacenet Play Equipment, Gleneagles Community Centre
JCl: I'm John Clark, here with Mary Fawley, Carl van Winkel and Chester [other names]
my honour $8,671 to assist in installation; delighted; complements a $15K donation and the M is contributing to Spacenet, completed; tyvm
Mayor: Old Eagle Harbour [Cmnty Ctr]... think... X cdn't be here tonight
Sop: I want to congratulate on one of these cmtes
been on one of these with son Sam last few years when he was four to seven
builds healthy bodies, good
Mayor: can you let us when the [installation?] will take place
Ans: hope in time for Christmas
6.         Provincial Electoral Area Boundary Readjustments
RECOMMENDED THAT Council consider the following deferred motion of October 01, 2007:
 "THAT Council write to the British Columbia Electoral Boundaries Commission opposing any increase in the number of Members of the Legislative Assembly in the Province of British Columbia."
RD: don't know why anyone wd oppose this; popn has grown but will retain number in north even though popn has decreased; given increase shd hv more, not of belief sponging off
MS: take contrary view and vigorously support
one, decreases our representation -- we have four on north shore and adding eight with none for us
two, everyone's learning to do more with less than us -- we've got hundreds of senators, MPs, MLAs, etc; know all the power in the cabinet.  Need more like a hole in the head; see written to other Ms; .....
others look after ...  don't know what senior govts do except salaries and pensions
health...[prov] tax ppl that earn it and give to ppl that don't
VV: time to repeat some well-know statistics from ev dollar, 50 cents to feds, prov 42 cents, and M govt 8 cents; so don't know why increase bureaucracy of prov
tax freedom day is already in June; have an agreement with Cclr Smith that those who earn money shd decide how to spend it
outside of health and education, prov handling
Don't see how we're making progress by adding to the size of the bureaucracy; think we shd go ahead with this resoln to inform the prov govt of our opinion
JF: surprisingly see myself in agreement with Cclrs Vaughan and Smith
if they wish to rejig borders, but simply b/c increase in popn in prov no
can't see why 79 can't serve
RD: agree with my colleagues that fed/prov govts take too much and Ms don't get enough
we're left with too little and provide services ...
these aren't bureaucrats, they're representatives of the ppl;
prov educ, univs, transportation
Ms provide most services, prov some much needed , and fed most money and least of all
this wd be in line with popn growth
Sop: rather odd that I'm last this time
thought prov govt wd downsize but not been the case
interesting we were overcharged by TransLink and we had to be refunded
surplus federally, only consequence for family $1200 on childcare rebate of $225 and large surplus of millions.
put us in jeopardy, tax day over half a year; then say have to give some back; system is haywire, don't need to increase size of Victoria, we shd be downsizing
RD: point of order: TransLink is regional, an extension of the municipalities, not a provincial agency
Mayor: I'm going to actually speak against the motion, not b/c of wishing to support larger govt
but I think as local govt you pick your battles with the prov and we've done that
we've worked v hard on the taxation formula wrt the new TransLink legislation b/c we don't believe it helps WV to link that to prop taxes; we've worked v hard to keep the homeowners' grant issue in front of the prov govt b/c it disenfranchises so many ppl in WV from that important piece of legislation; we've got a history of fighting Eagleridge Bluffs and BC Ferries where we think it affects us.  And I think that's the reputation we want to have.  I don't think we back away from a fight, but I think this one is not particularly our battle.  I don't pretend to understand representation in the north, but the Premier is supporting that, overruling the Electoral Commission as is the Attorney-General.  I'm going to vote against the motion b/c I think we want to stay focused on the things we're truly trying to impact in Victoria for WV
and I'll call the question
{turned out to be FOUR THREE IN FAVOUR OF MOTION so motion opposing to increase MLAs  passes}

7.         Community Centre Quarterly Update - Volume V, October 18, 2007
RECOMMENDED:... report ... from the Deputy Director, Parks and Community Services be received for information.
June Sutherland: mbr of WV Pottery Studio Adv Cmte; [this time] my question why the Ccl cdn't find 1700sf in a 85Ksf bldg
Mr Pike said two options and did not elaborate what they were
Mayor gave .... notice when on agenda
Mayor: excuse me, have him answer rather than sit there
SJN: quarterly report been known for some time; asked to report on sizes of rooms and it is present in this report
JS: yes, it is, been asking that for many many months;  [sent] email to Val Kettler; had no acknowledgement;  now 56K on five floors replacing in old 28K [what's happened to studio]
KP: the options were and are: possible facilities outside the Cmnty Ctr and continuing to review that; asking for a sketch plan a 3D arts studio in Srs' Ctr; looking at those two and can bring those back looking at the costs
JS: do you discuss this?
Mayor: purpose of this report
JS: you've been storing the pottery stuff for two years and must be costing a fortune
Betty Ditters: making a reappearance b/c I'm angry; retired art teacher and former pottery teacher
concerns me did not transfer to Gleneagles
world speaks in 465 languages and only sees in one ... 90% [eyes?] ... pottery studio perfect
suffered b/c not travelled to the Gleneagles pottery
abdicated resp to protect...  central ... current mammoth
Connie Little: here again, speaking for the seniors about the lack of protection of seniors' services such as pottery and weaving
Nov 2 article in NSN, WV greyer than most; looking at tremendous increase
these are the folks who have paid taxes for years and years
for 30 years seniors been able to access pottery in cmnty ctr, but not ........
understood built with prov .....  and open it up to all citizens
Ccl's decisions not to answer this legacy concerns me; haven't explored legality of this action as yet
what is Ccl entertaining to .... in this new ...     srs' ctr; seniors' needs must be considered; we'll all become seniors eventually, if we're lucky
Joan Beninger: also mbr of Pottery Studio Adv Cmte; also been asked to speak to Mr Pike's options
given we didn't know what they were
possibly delivering... in add'n to the Srs' Ctr ...
July 2007, email sent to me at direction of Ccl
he spoke of the connection at heart of this project
not sufficient money to do so; tendered $1.4M understood $1.2M
wd cost over $1.7M; building envelope prob at Srs' Ctr wch ...  presume 2008
looking at $2.7M and a repair project
our concern, what was in old cmnty ctr, weavers and parking probs
in this letter, Mr Pike indicated wdn't be a definitive decision made re pottery, connection, fabric, ofc employees, covered walkway
more modest but not who it pertains to
for progs that have existed for well over 30 years
Option One seems to have been negated in July
if you don't have a budget presently to include progs that existed in old cmnty ctr, don't know where $$ going to come from
in June we specifically asked what a pottery studio wd cost outside the ctr; you have all the equipment, all we need is space
in terms of functionality of cmnty ctr, you've replaced a 28Ksf structure, 115Ksf and functionality not M progs, space for prov services and priv industry
you do have this space, based on p6, you have not finalized the space for alternative medicine, 1600sf that wd be perfect for pottery; better than option to addition to Srs' Ctr
even building a connection wch was supposed to be part of it -- we're not optimistic it's going to happen
viable, provided we know what you're talking about; no info
been making efforts to deal with bureaucrats, we're going to media now
Appendix B shd hv been av from the beginning
Mr Pike took offence to .....but exactly what it is in this doc, but M services 56K, that's double before
use that space, or come up with a viable solution
of viable budget we can work with
Mayor: Mr Pike wd you care to respond before Ms Chuback
KP: viable solutions still require funding; we don't know if many dollars remaining from contingency and Ccl will have to decide use them or turn them back
still building and there are no dollars for this or...
Sop: at outset when space, progs being developed, was the pottery services given space at that time?
KP: in initial planning, absolutely; after when ....
Sop: so there was something?
JB:... our cmte struck in 2004 specifically to design
reports to Ccl; helped in terms of design and what needed to be contained
sure that all info needed was available; surprise to us when we were deferred; concern permanent
Josie Chuback, Parks Dept: Slides: Cmnty Ctr Highlights
project, budget, status reports; devt costs, trade contracts, project schedule
prime goal to keep project on budget and keep our costs under control
quality assurance; adhere to schedule
first slide: remain within budget, will let Basil speak to that
Basil Davis, Project Mgr: report still has all the figures
started with budget of $38.8M; then pullback factor, had to pull back $5M
Jan 07, had to get back to $38.81M that's what we're working toward; [slide] showing progress, fourth column furnishings, estimates, add to Aug 31st column get to final column; what that's showing you, the project shows $38.12M and Ccl $38.8M so hope with good luck and problem won't arise, hope to be within....
decisions wrt Srs' Ctr; won't know till then; still the risky period; look at actual contingency, last column shows unspent $.7M; feeling reasonably comfortable with where we're going
... had 60%  to the credit of construction mgrs, Scott [Mgmt/Construction]; last contract in place, 98% of trade contracts, diff from est at 60% drawings is less than half a per cent
they must hv had pretty good handle on where [economy/industry] was going
anything wrt increased scope or design change, goes to ... change and to contingencies
managed to stay within......
feel comfortable we'll be able to stay within $38.8M and actually have some change left over
next slide, Are Developers Near Capacity [graph], given to us on Friday, done by CMHC
one of the Scott mgrs went to this conference and he showed us these figures
enormous volume, house to highrise {incredible}
the next slide deals with popn growth; expecting by 2012, popn 75 and over so pressure more on multi-unit or highrise buildings, focus of where construction will go
saw it climbing, will be exacerbated in coming years; bring this up not b/c of building but pull on labour
trade can give you a price then another if they can get sufficient staff to do it
whether convention ctr or Olympics, all struggling to meet schedules -- you can read about it
wrt Project Update, labour the biggest headache but also struggling with construction costs; slippage about three months
16 - 19 mos; not from demolition but from start of construction; slide shows end in June
CMHC slide shows all the highrise construction, ev suffering about 18% behind on their schedules across the prov
the actual figure of our delay is on the same order; really does get back to labour; hope we can stay within my projection end of June, reflecting what's happening around prov
JCh: wrt pedestrian access between facilities, configured like a campus, middle; have to come from outside
new ped access to Aq Ctr from outside, a long ramp; small and gets congested, but weren't many others that wd fit in with fire needs
thank Cclr Day for suggestion re using fire access; can facilitate access with groups when we know; have to have additional staff
also in process of getting our handheld scanners so can when they come in groups
see some of those strategies in busy times; welcome all and any suggestions
Decision in last ten days, remove Atlas Cedar; primarily around accessibility to the site; also having to do with the root system of the tree, how high and how superficial
consult with many other officials, notices are up, and expect new landscape design and three new big trees
{I comment on this in PQP and intend to work toward retention of the tree as in plans from the beginning.}
keep running as much as possible, some days have to shut down for various reasons
parking: challenges around closure of front, need for that for construction steel and granit rocks for the fountain; extra lot on 22nd has 50 stalls and have full underground
worked closely with Srs, proving a shuttle bus; pleased to announce Blue Bus runs from PkR to Ctr, and up to ...
just been asked be part of demonstration of a .... bus, with silver; pleased about that
green initiatives
encourage ppl to walk as much as possible, bicycle, new racks; pref parking for shared vehicles
a number of other initiatives; LEED accreditation, high silver;; geothermal field; air quality
last point in LEED accreditation -- setting up a green house ... cleaning plan
educational signage around green sites, public app benefits of project
Partners' Leases: cafe and VGH completed; still working with Youth Band and Wellness & complementary medicine services
{when do we get to know how much has been raised to date or what we're on the hook for?}
public art
Cmnty Ctr Qtrly Report -- possibility of setting up a non-profit society
getting feedback from staff and users; report to Ccl with recommendation on Nov 26
wrt Pottery: was one of the core components; one of programmed spaces
sometimes quite limiting so looked if cd provide for other needs
technical space and a number of requirements
originally had studio on second floor, worked with adv group they advised on ground floor so looked at Srs' Ctr; as we went along, value engg and cost of proj was one an item deferred
not done lightly
difficult decision to make; not resources to move ahead
looking for other partners we can work with; look at options western, .....
got a design that needs to be more detailed so it can be costed; to be connected to Srs' Ctr, still in process of working that out
Mayor: questions?
MS: why the costs are as of the end of Aug rather than end of Sept
BD: to get Sept's figs in place, Sept's was done in Oct so by the time all the figs, cdn't do that at same time and do for this; same prob came up re Qtrly Report; purely acctg
RD: understand our project the only main on in Lower Mainland
BD: $61M up at Sq, university on budget; set about April of 05; a lot of this is a bit of luck, a lot of credit to Scott, the estimators; no brilliance about Basil or anybody else
what's so crazy fixed sum
mgrs not putting goldleaf, you're going to--
Mayor: maybe a bad example
BD: esp in .....; Italian tiles in bathroom, can use the ones in Sask
only by that eventually able to wrestle back to $38.8M by cutting back ..... cut back foot prints....
done six projects with these guys and they're coming through
RD: only have to look at conv ctr downtown and see how good you are
BD: was approached by conv ctr and said time out
RD: sympathize with pottery ppl, needs to be said being a bit neglected
money; Ccl does take pottery seriously....
know Gleneagles too far, srs live here but ...
JCh: a number transferred out to Gleneagles, and a ...
smaller, diff configuration limited space for storing
is able to provide an opp for chn's, and ppl staying ...
RD: we are looking for a way near the ctr; we're trying to do that; not that we don't value pottery; somehow got cut b/c nec; do best to find
JF, perceptively: when you completed the Sq U, did you have to make some cutbacks to be within budget?
BD: definitely areas revisited, finishes; great architects have great ideas but can't spend them
I made sure   ...  quality and flexibility not sacrificed
designed for 1200 students and at present only have 71
library and canteen; had to cut back on the 1200 concept; didn't cut back on the $61M
JF: want to thank Basil, and Josie; know ppl disappointed not 3D, I was.
Ccl recognizes its commitment to cmnty to be on budget; doesn't mean won't be other opps for pottery; not a decision made lightly
commend staff for their flexibility meeting needs; know it's caused inconvenience, parking; also impressed with staff, inconvenience to them to; ask cmnty to bear with us for a few months
next year who can rembr how diff to walk in rain, maybe have pottery; matter of working together, continue to communicate with each other; great ab to work together productively
communicate better with pottery group, have to do that
too bad tree has to come back -- in public art, public
thrilled we are on budget; complete in best of all possible times
Sop: in our go-around with you there was some glazing to be done; June's pushing it, Sept more likely
BD: still working on June
Sop: all that roofing  ... , still a contingency of $.69M
BD: I've tried to put in, furniture and equipment needs have come along, have tried to drop contingency and that was the .69
Sop: on allotment of space, that wch is leased and that set; any feasibility of space being found that cd be let out to pottery and others?
JCh: if any of the current rec spaces were going to be used for pottery it wd be a loss of function of the space there; have to be structurally fitted
haven't looked at  ...  if we were to look at the ...
load or activity on that floor
cdn't be in a leased space b/c pay from that required
Sop: find space for pottery in future in that ctr?
KP: as Josie outlined, we'd have to displace something
if no one was wanting to use it for, we'd have to say what can we convert this to
as you know we planned 3D studio on second floor
costly, but possible
Sop: finally, in this picture, shows magnificent atlas cedar tree, wch has been stated to be kept
know session with staff that said through one thing or another, and I wd assume some was root cutting, told now it has to be out of there;
reminds me of an apt block that took their tree down, now is the bylaw ofcr going to pinch this one [punish?], the M, for not following the bylaws on this tree?
{Sop's referring to one of the conditions of upzoning at 2142 Argyle, preserve a tree 120yrs old and 80ft tall (or vv), that the devpr, Quigg, got a second opinion and had removed but the second letter of explanation from staff was that it was done illegally, without permission.}
KP: not an issue of bylaw; we've fought hard for this tree all along; an Atlas cedar, not a native species, been there for 50 years and it's magnificent; b/c of proximity to building and height it is,

{er, um; if there for 50 years this shd not hv come as a surprise for anyone planning or designing the cmnty ctr!}

it has clearly compromised the way we can use outdoor spaces beyond the multipurpose room, and how the fountain will work on that site; we also know we have cut roots well within what was recommended,

{why when it was plain it was there in full glory all along and from the beginning?
Was this lack of planning or lack of foreknowledge or expertise of an arborist?
or wasn't an arborist consulted???}

and going to further measures, we don't really know how long that tree will survive, cd be five years or 25 years, but it compromises the outside usage and that was a v tough decision for us
We were faced with it in summer time, and decided not to do it, and the issue just became too overwhelming this fall.
Sop: sad to see it go, that's for sure; am sure others are
KP: so are we

{then try harder!!!  just a minute; the Mayor's all for openness and transparency, cmnty engagement, public participation -- why not throw this out for resident input -- we have many forestry experts in WV.  The plans always included retention of this rare tree.  Why not involve citizens in devising a way to keep?  So often staff make decisions and Ccl/public informed after the fact -- at least with this it has been brought to our attention -- now PLEASE give us time to find a remedy! hm?}

MS: wd think we need a staff report attached to the next Qtrly report for the bills that are going to have to be paid
our Endowment Fund $29M and $7M a windfall from exprop from Eagleridge; Ccl opposed that wd be used for hwy
well over $30M of bills to be paid as of Dec 31st 2006
wd like to see a report from Mr Laing and what the plan is to meet our obligations as they fall due
CAO: planning to bring forward a report by end of month
Sop: ...
CAO: exprop; prov what it's worth, then up to us to appeal; if signif diff will be approaching prov about that
Mayor: want to congratulate you; pleased not sitting here making excuses
obviously the experience throughout prov
had to cut srs......   look to see how we can accommodate pottery in future; diff decisions...
I remember we ..... cdn't get a fixed price; daily basis, has served cmnty v well
Sop: report?
Mayor: Nov 19
CAO: Nov 26
8.         Civic Centre Parking
RECOMMENDED: ...report from the Deputy Director of Parks and Community Services be received.
JCh: [slides] Bunt & Assns analysis 2001; 2005 NDLea a supplemental study, along with Gordon Ave
... 307 cars, future 363; so went fwd
when Aq Ctr opened the participation increased significantly, much more than anticipated; so reviewed by NDLea; Aq Ctr more, VCHA more and already using the location
sq ftg increase 12K from 2001
parking changes; possible reduction, lawn used temporarily during construction; planned north plaza wd not continue to be used for parking but used for turnaround, dropoff
2005 study changed to 430, anticipated for two periods on Tuesdays (one hour morning and afternoon not able to meet demand; prog overlap; dropped to 400 in Wednesday for a half hour period
Estimated future demand 568 cars on site
we have 488 planned on site: on surface keeping SAC, east side of Cmnty Ctr, north plaza, 128 underground + add'l 100 underground and 74 stall on street
We're 80 spaces short if 568 and remember it's peak time
the VCHA use already factored in; they've already modified what they asked from adjusted numbers down; aids not parking there for v long; churches in the area have more activities during the week rather than just on Sundays now
health and fitness studios, progs at PJ, etc, all using that parking area
senior shuttle, Blue Bus, now hydrogen ... going on
Recommended Future Actions: working with seniors managing sites; keep as many on site; time limits adjustments to be made; if can't be met will look at other options
MS: wrt 488 parking spaces on site, report says 314, the others offsite; are all those spaces around the ctr going to have signs for cmnty ctr users only?
JCh: presently being used
MS: Bank of Mtl came before Ccl and were two spaces short
so we're saying a devpr has to provide a certain number but when we do we can count spaces around
other question
28Ksf to 48Ksf; the consultant did a study when ctr closed 10am and 2pm 358 and 444 and that was with the old ctr not even operating
so the consultant has said future demand 568 and this does not include Health Facility b/c doesn't know, and doesn't count clients and medicine
you want to have ctr as a drop-in for coffee -- how are ppl going to use it if they can't park?
not good enough to look at parking options explored after built -- all my uni profs were wrong? when you look at demand you look at supply
think we shd return the front great lawn to parking now, b/c I don't buy into needed to get construction equipment on site -- has to become by road so as before
urge parking on front; until we can determine has enough parking
two churches there, Aq Ctr,....... know Srs' Ctr use increasing all the time
remind Ccl, major devt on Wetmore b/c need it to pay for cmnty ctr
don't care how you slice it, clearly not enough -- says 568 but then says not counting, this , that, A + B does not equal C
time to address prob before big prob, best before opening
CAO: we reviewed the whole parking ...
v little green space; by design elected to keep that; didn't want add'l underground spots at $35K a stall; these are projections that we don't manage; there are opps to manage demand
let's use those options, manage demand, then look at other options
take away green space, design contemplated keeping that green space
VV: this great lawn, how many spots max cd we put there?
JCh: don't have figs depends on how close to bldgs, fountain, dropoffs; had about 80 during construction, just on gravel
VV: Cclr Smith possibly underestimated; 500 new units in Upper Lands, anticipate more and more
not happy with parking on street, then friends can't find parking; wdn't let anyone else do this
as MMgr reminded us, underground $35K per stall, we shd hv estimated $5M more for parking on this site
consideration of parking meters for on-site parking?
don't think we have a satisfactory answer; there are cost implications; do want to see some solutions
Sop: being on the Facilities Group, we looked for spaces to find parking; always there include perimeter where ppl wd park
quadrant at middle of back; underground -- wonder if it's completely full
understand wrt Health component going to be out a lot; they'd have an allotment for sure
disagree taking a beautiful lawn area and cover it up with asphalt
takes away from premise; ev has to be about parking; gone through this for six or seven years
maybe once open we might have to make some adjustments; one of them speedway between 21st and 22nd, and put in angle parking; still leave great lawn; lots of alternatives there, not a major issue
has to do with demand and how successful
JF: personally support staff's recommendations; getting ppl out of their cars
trying to change the mindset of ppl in this cmnty, to exercise, participate in arts, crafts, have a cup of coffee and visit wellness ctr; later will have better idea
prov govt gave us a whole bunch of money for the civic spirit square; envisioned
no interest in paving paradise to ut up a parking lot
if not able to control, either by scheduling at diff times wch wd hv been peak; alts to transportation to and from site; better things to do
RD: I agree with Cclrs Sop and Ferguson; invested a lot of money in good architecture; beautiful bldgs, always planned green space and fountain
eight months before civic ctr opens; so think we shd wait as colleagues said
civic ctr plaza to north question -- close to Aq ctr was to be open but cars quickly used them
perhaps civic plaza too ambitious -- does that include...
JCh: does not include the 24 stalls on the north plaza
RD: that shd be continued as parking whereas grass left green; think you cd get 30 stalls in there
if short 80 one hour a week, cd reduce that to 50; better leaving south green
eight months to go; used for parking leave it that way
previous item, when we cut the budget to accommodate from Srs' Ctr, we didn't cut the cover and seniors will be able to go under cover to Aq Ctr -- talked to seniors and they think no roof but there will be a roof, but not as elaborate
VV: I don't agree with my esteemed colleague, plant lawn then have to dig it up, waste
JC: agree with Cclr Smith, we're looking at a tremendous traffic problem
wrt dig up the lawn and pave it, I understand there's a thermal so can't be paved, has to be gravel and don't know if we want to see that
relying on old information, as Cclr Smith said a lot of the info gathered when no traffic around the area whatsoever
concerned fiasco
Sop: knew from the outset perimeter, some underground, knew another section underground
knew looking at 420 spots
increased, with usage; success at Aq Ctr and may have with Civic Ctr
do we ... or wait and see how it goes
back as Cclr Day says, cd provide 30 spots easily
don't buy it; filling up underneath, may need...  without filling up front lawn with cars
CAO: we will continue to look at this and provide options, not just the front lawn; there are a number of options we can take; a little like TransLink -- build more roads or .....
RD: we've still got eight months; I'm in favour of planting the grass and keeping it; hope we do; I want the grass
have a civic plaza, plus angle along Marine Dr cd get to 80; better than paving gravelling over
got eight months let's watch it; get better idea, and make more informed decisions
Mayor: senior shuttle we had to put in place, been a big success
... Blue Bus... b/c of the magnet; application for Spirit Trail, connection to Spirit Sq
resp to cmnty .... those goals
related to Gordon Ave, walking down 21st and 22nd preferred way to go; drop off
wonder how Library functions wch has the worst [parking and highest circulation]
slaves to pavement; provincial funding around cycling and we have ...

{no reference to the elephant in the room; the NE corner is occupied by a (private) tennis club but it has been there for years and is a powerful lobby.  Nor did I hear anything about why the second level of underground parking was cancelled -- b/c of soil conditions and high cost I think -- so there had been plans for more.}

9.         Consent Agenda Items - Reports and Correspondence List
Item 10 - Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-037 (866 20th Street) (to set date for consideration); and Item 11 - Correspondence List.
Removal: MS 3 27 31; VV 6 10; RD 16 27 31 34; Sop: pretty well same
10.       Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-037 (866 20th Street)
        RECOMMENDED: ... for consideration on Monday, November 19, 2007.
11.       Correspondence List  [complete list in prev issue]
(3)       October 13, 2007, regarding Helicopter Noise
Referred to the Director of Administrative Services for consideration and response.
Mayor: I have received various complaints about this and followed up in various ways
followup report; hwy; wd like to understand what we're to expect
Sop: at one time over Stanley Park and xxx someone gave permission
CAO: may have to do with False Crk, will follow up with Transport Canada
(6)       R. Barr, Hugo Ray Park Area Residents Group, October 19, 2007, regarding Meeting with Mayor Goldsmith-Jones and Hugo Ray Park Residents
Referred to the Director of Parks & Community Services for consideration and response.
        {this provides clear documentation of their issues by category as they see it}
Sop (after 10): on p 141; they have roughly 30 questions
given the length of time, even the questions Ccl don't fully understand; havesome sort of public mtg with Ccl
yes we need info from prov, and
but this relates to a lot more, to the taxpayers and nbrs we're impinging on
proud investing in chn and sports
until we sit down and face each other not going to come to an end
sit down in Jan? have a good go around; good soln we haven't talked for months
KP: waiting and waiting, dragged on, without money don't know if 2008 or ? will depend on when funding confirmed; we're in that limbo; depends on fundraising and they're not finished fundraising
wrt Cricket, mtg with them next week and we hear from Cricket saying they support
hearing from Min of Transport wrt exiting, so a variety of unknowns
Sop: hear what you said; one side is given the right to go ahead and fundraise and in their enthusiasm many decisions made, what's going to be there, expanded, something else, whereas all the residents (?), beg and beg and don't get anything
Mayor: do have a letter...
Mr PIke has spent hours; not putting any barriers
fact of the matter is we don't know scale until we know about prov funding; doing ev we can
Sop: xxx
Mayor: efforts to meet; knew what one another looking for
CAO: Mr Pike has answered queries to get more back and to suggest ...
(10)     4 Emails regarding Hugo Ray Park
VV: combine; continue to receive email; hundreds
email from Treasurer of Cricket; the Cricket Assn is not a supporter of current proposal or request for grant
been referring ppl to answer end of Oct and ... now end of Nov? need an answer
KP: we've been waiting for confirmation from HRPSociety re funding, informed Friday last after discussing with Victoria, at least Dec before any answer wrt grant -- and it was Aug 15 -- so quite a delay
letter drafted; have also provided the Hugo Ray Pk Society, informed them
(16)     B.A. Dozzi, Manager - Roads & Transportation, October 11, 2007, regarding General Letter to Residents/Business Owners re Dundarave Parking and Traffic Plan - Implementation
        {The outline of the final plan and implementation}
RD: know we talked about this last week and postponed; know .... Mr Dozzi's report
mtg July 2006 report didn't seem to come to Ccl
several letters from Biz Assn and letter from D Hawkins
think this is a mistake; no evidence of accidents from backing out from 24th an Bellevue
a lot of medical clinics, a lot of seniors living there; think it is a mistake, warning; shd postpone this
if evidence think we shd do something
Mayor: in disc with Mr Dozzi
BDozzi: have decided to hold off for now; though literature 'back in' is safer than 'nose in'
hold off and collect some local data; in New Westminster they use back in method
will see if we can collect local data so holding off on implementation
MS: couple of items off what I was going to
Dund parking had teething problems, seem to be working well
maybe reverse ... maybe used to doing it; I've been trying to find [place in WV], can't find where to do it; ppl are used [to 'nose in']
to make Dund Lane two ways is suicidal; letter from Prez of Dund BAssn, leave well enough alone
Mayor: so that's 27 and 31
(18)     M. Southerst, Dundarave Business Association, October 26, 2007, regarding Request for Funding - Christmas in Dundarave, Festival of Lights
        Referred to Mayor and Council for consideration and response.
[after (34) at 9:38]
MS: will keep it short in view of the extremely late hour
wonder if we cd ask for a staff report whether efficacious for us to have our staff install the lights for DBA as requested.  They're fundraising to buy the lights.  Letter here says they wd like our staff with our equipment to install the lights.  They point out that losing Capers is a bit of a body blow to the village and they want to have it looking smart for Christmas, so if there's any way that we can accommodate their request, I wd like to think we wd do so
Mayor: who'd like to reply to that?
CAO: request is to look at it so will get back to Ccl.
Mayor: thank you

(27)     October 22, 2007, regarding Proposed "Back In" Angle Parking - 2400 Block Bellevue Avenue -
(31)     M. Southerst, Dundarave Business Association, October 26, regarding Dundarave Traffic and Parking Plan
>>>  Vinson Creek Flooding; of STREAMKEEPER AND ENV'TAL INTEREST:
(34)     R. Fung, Manager, Utilities, October 22, 2007, reply regarding Flood Damage due to Overflow of Vinson Creek at Kings Avenue - January 2007
RF: as stated in letter; looked at recommendations made by nbrs and reviewed all the items
actually implemented those recommendations
engineer a safe-fail rather than fail-safe, there's a dip in the road there so if blocked, water wd overflow over the road and back into the creek avoiding going further down
Sop: grate large enough for 100-yr flood?
RF: size not so dependent on magnitude of flow; looked at spacing and material; made it stronger
wrt windstorms last year; windstorms brought a signif amt of debris Nov, carried a lot of branches into that location; other situation was that residents believe some illegal dumping along creekbanks so we hv to be more diligent about looking for that so make sure not in creek
Sop: for those water down driveway; have you increased lip?
RF: that portion/lip exists
Roads Dept giving consideration to extending that up to Inglewood
at this point probably not doing it; when we have signif amt of lift causes probs with snowclearing equipment
by having safe-fail situation and the dip put back into creek, will avoid long long travel way down to Fulton with any overflows
Sop: not satisfied, with culvert goes over the banks, down the road now, the fail-safe is something you've done at Kings, but the water will reverse back and go back into the creek?  none downhill and into any of the driveways as we had?
RF: what we prefer to do instead of trying to prevent overflow situation occurring over debris screen is to provide a method by wch water can get back into the creek, so safe-fail type of mechanism; get the water back into the creek where it belongs instead of continuing down the road overland
Mayor: I think we shd move on with the agenda; if you'd like to pursue that more/later, welcome to
Sop: I will pursue it
Mayor: I know a lot of work has gone into it, and it's good to hear
need motion to  receive items
MS: haven't discussed 18 yet.
Mayor: oh, did we miss that? sorry -- 18
Responses to Questions in Question Period  --  No items presented.

> MS: plsd attended on your behalf, Soroptimists fundraising dinner dance event
> Sop: with Mayor G-J, attended in Sq the Howe Sound Forum/mtg; invitation of Lions Bay mayor
Port Mellon using coal so faster burn; particulates that wd come from mill, effects on Howe Sound; Min of Envmt staff was there; broad discussion; test period; then some facts and figs
one thing kind of curious; didn't think the Min of the Envmt had a lot of power
they'll do/take test and maybe make statements, but wd they ever say outright you can't burn coal
what I understand from going to Gibsons, is that the economic work base is that mill so challenge
> RD: with you, attended reception celebration for Elspeth Bradbury on publication of beautiful book, [WV] A View Through the Trees; want to draw to attention of public can be purchased from the author, get info from M hall; reception attended by 100 ppl at the Library; deals with history of WV in terms of trees, logging, parks, trails, she's a landscape architect, was mbr of HAC, and has been involved in various cmnty activities.
Mayor: thank you Cclr Day; and I do apologize to Cclr Smith that I had to get up and find you your book; I do appreciate that you were able to fill in for me on Saturday night.
> MS: Just wanted to quickly say I did attend the dinner-dance for the Soroptimist Club and the proceeds; they had had a silent and a live auction, that's why I had to wait for you to return; b/c proceeds going to the Lookout Shelter, a cause I'm sure you'd want to support.  I just have to inform you that I was bidding v aggressively on your behalf, so they'll be contacting you shortly.
>Mayor: thank you, and also thank you Cclr V who's been attending events all over the place on my behalf as well.  Seems to be a v busy month
quick update: two public mtgs on dogs -- fees, ways to improve
Doug Leavers putting together a mountain of input of feedback we'ver rec'd and what other Ms are doing; status report Nov 19
understand Halloween quieter than usual, didn't seem so to me; talked to both Fire and Police and they report [fewer] incidents; good compliance
main msg: parents shd not buy fireworks for chn and send them out into street; educ working
congratulate ev involved in opening the Cmnty Partner Ctr last week: Coho Society, WV Cmnty Fdn,Chamber of Commerce, the Spirit Cmte, our staff have collaborated in an exciting new home across from West Van Florist; just a beginning of many cmnty events to be held down there, already partnerships forming that didn't exist before amongst cmnty groups that are already established; that was another wonderful event.
~ 9:45
Joan Beninger: a couple of comments wrt report by Josie Chuback
a lot of talk about staying within budget, done so at the expense of what was a core component of the prev cmnty ctr
secondly, Ccl shd take heed of why add'l three-month delay; demographics of seniors, here's a situation where you have a substantial number of seniors
had for over 30 years; postponed, whatever, not in this ctr
our cmte was involved; concern about on second floor, concern was accessibility, a lot of ... going back and forth
if problem accessibility, that rather than not having space
[potters lug their equipment; put studios in their homes; used to it]
technical place, we were assured by mayor that those costs wd be given to us by Josie last June; don't think beyond capability, some put pottery studios in their homes
you indicated might be a status report; potentially what do in future
nevertheless shd be some planning given, it appears not going to be able to provide facility despite...
Ccl consider some way of doing so in this budget ... in add'n to Srs' Ctr... $2.7M tying it into repair budget, not feasible
all we're asking is some thought be given to it and some time frame
great deal of rhetoric; offered our services as far back as 2004; no answer other than wait and see
want some sort of commitment toward the delivery of services that hv bn available for decades
Mayor: thank you; Mr Pike's going to be costing those options at some point
KP: as Ms Chuback said, we've been delayed on that; we can speed up that process
*******************************  ERICKSON HOUSE ISSUES  *********************************************
Aline Brown: here mostly to bring to your attention that the Planning Dept has received a request for a demolition permit for the Graham residence on Isleview road
don't know if you're aware of the Graham residence and its importance to architectural history of WV
it appears in the pubn West Vancouver Survey of Significant Architecture; one of the primary buildings designated in this outline
an Erickson design, 1964; one of the oldest Erickson designs in WV
I really wonder wonder if the local person who applied for the demo permit is aware of the history of this residence; I wonder if they did understand that, whether they'd be so keen to demolish it
It's really irreplaceable; we have a book and ev year goes by, more and more pages are ripped out of this book -- we're going to end up with nothing
Some effort shd be made to explain to the new owners of this property exactly what the history is and if we can possibly delay demolish the permit until we see the plans, or we adopt the Heritage Register ... on board
I'm fairly certain this residence wd be listed in the Heritage Registry
Mayor: Ccl is aware. Mr Nicholls, wd you like to describe
SJN: We are aware of that; we have advisers going to the Heritage WG as well

{that's how I found out at the end of last week that it was endangered -- but at that time a staff mbr said it was an off-shore Cantonese owner and the architect was Poskitt -- both were wrong and we had to do research, but at least this time we were warned -- wdn't want to lose a third heritage house/asset in six months!!!}

We're holding off on the demolition permit, although they are legally entitled to a demolition permit
there is no building permit application
the owner is, I believe, certainly not living in that residence, and I'm not aware of [its] being a new owner. 
The property records and ppl we're trying to contact are the old owners
AB: wondering if the demo permit can be held until the plans for the replacement are available
SJN: we wd not legally be able to do that; we are trying to assess what the situation is right now, and what the intent is.
We have had staff out at the site.  The bldg does not appear to be in particularly good condition so we're trying to figure out ... what are the circumstances that have allowed it
AB: b/c a local resident... there is a Stevens Drive Erickson home that was older and it [Graham House] cd not be in as bad a condition as the one on Stevens Drive is, and the individual with an architect has done an absolutely incredible job of preserving this one
renovating it completely, it's now a wonderful modern home; it's just a beautiful home; I had the privilege of being there during a Home Tour.
All I can say is, that if someone suggested in the US that they were going to pull down the Falling Water House

{probably about the most famous 20th century residence, designed by Frank Lloyd Wright}

there'd be a riot and this is reasonably comparable in Arthur Erickson's list of accomplishments; tyvm

Mayor: thank you.  Next, Carolanne Reynolds.  Is this the one-two punch?
CR (warning to Readers: I do seem to be stumbling over my words and disjointed phrases so pls bear with this): Well, I just--  I was otherwise involved....  just got an email just before I came that Aline Brown was going to say something.
I got some further information since then, but what I was going to speak about we can speak about later after the...[too fast to decipher]
the tree that was somewhat prominent in those plans
I think we shd ask for a delay on that and put the word out to some of the plant/garden places/whatever b/c that was central
somebody who knew about the tree was going to be kept

{translation, to decipher: I'd just learned in the Quarterly Report on the Cmnty Ctr, as Cclr Sop referred to it above, that although the Atlas cedar figured prominently in all the plans for the new ctr, and was in all the plans and models, the report says it must be removed.  I've now followed this after the mtg and Dir/Parks has given me a week.  More on this later.  In the meantime, though, since KPike's reply was that with the construction it wd only last between five to 20 years, it is my opinion that we shd leave it -- take care not to damage while construction and landscaping goes on -- plants are remarkably resilient and adaptable.  It cd very well survive.  Besides, what sort of example does that give devprs when DWV itself makes a commitment to retain a significant landscape feature or tree, and then later says it has to be removed.  We shd do all we can to keep that tree.  Lead by example.}

back to the Erickson house
when it was reported the end of last week that it was an offshore owner or something and it was going to be done, I've been trying to find out more about it ever since
and the quotation I have in my newsletter
{holding up WVM  of which I'm editor -- West Van Matters 2007 - 34; am also chair of Heritage West Van}
it's right at the front, this Heritage Alert, we've got to find out what we can do, and the quotation I have from Arthur Erickson in his book says:
"The David Graham house in 1963 launched my reputation as the architect you went to when you had an impossible site."
That was considered an unbuildable site; he built on it and it is well-known and featured nationally if not internationally
I did phone, and as a result of the information I have this afternoon is that the application for demolition was placed by Mr Lalji, and I'm sure someone of his stature probably is not aware or he wdn't be doing this and so I think... and I've also had a whole list, wch I can give to you later, Mayor Goldsmith-Jones, of ppl who had a list of things that we can do
as Chair of the [HWG} subcmte on Incentives, it wd be up to Ccl of course, but we have to--
heritage is really important; but it doesn't mean it's going to be cemented into place and no changes
if somebody wants to modernize the bathroom or kitchen, even if Mr Lalji wants to add to this, I'm sure that wd not be upsetting to anybody interested in heritage, as long as it was kept to the same design
I think, Geoffrey Massey was also involved
it's considered Erickson's house, it's a gem, it's on our primary list that we have... and so I think with the information to the ppl who are involved, to find out what they want, um, if they think it's beyond repair
I'm sure if we went to Mr Erickson, he'd be able to help
if they wanted an addition, I think that wdn't be--
if they wanted even to go so far--
there are so many things we can do if we want to keep it
if he buys another property somewhere else, give him something extra there to make up for it
There are lots of things that we can do
Mayor: all of the ideas you have wd be welcomed by Mr Nicholls and Stephen Mikicich on this
I had asked if we had greater levels of protection, cd someone still get a demolition permit
SJN: yes, Madam Mayor.  If you designate a bldg as a heritage bldg then you're subject to compensation in doing that, so the designations we have have been voluntary.  The one private one and the public ones have been voluntary.

{will check into the compensation part; that is debatable AFAIK.  Obviously depends on a lot of things.}

If you establish a registry of heritage bldgs it allows you to delay the issuance of a demolition permit but only to the point where Ccl is, holds, in other words, it comes to the next ccl mtg after that and that's the length of time you're allowed to withhold it.
Hope through the strategies we're developing, we'll have a number of different incentives to provide to ppl; if there's any will on their part to act to preserve those, we'll provide them with all the information required to do that, and will provide them with the incentives to do that.   Ccl right now is, as Ms Reynolds has mentioned, is quite capable of providing variances for the building and any number of other considerations--
Mayor: we're just trying to preserve it.  I just have to say for a moment--
JC: point of order, Madam Mayor
SJN:--the Laljis. I don't believe the Lalji is one of the Lalji family mbrs that are in Vancouver
JC: extension for ten minutes
Mayor: is there a seconder? in favour?  fails; we are adjourned, however this is being taken up by staff
CR: moral suasion in the meantime; and there's someone else who wants to speak as well
but moral suasion I think we can help
MS: Madam Mayor, I did not vote against that so--
Mayor: Cclr Sop did
MS: well, I think there's a gentleman who's been sitting here all night
Mayor: is our procedure bylaw still unanimous?
SSch: it is
Mayor: we need to pass our procedure bylaw and update it, but that's the Ccl rules
I do think mbrs of Ccl will be av
Sop: I'll change my vote for five minutes, if there's someone else to speak

{gee thanks, Sop!}

Mayor: the ... procedure bylaw, is the moral of the story
is that all right? reopen the mtgs for five minutes
SSch: don't know if question was called, so that wd be fine, Madam Mayor
Mayor: I did call the question
{more mumblings}
Ssch: once the question was called?
SSch: then it cannot extend at this point
{even more mumblings}
Mayor: I know.  Ccl Sop didn't mean to vote against that; sorry about that but mbrs of Ccl who wish to pursue this will stay and will talk to you and make sure it's at next ccl mtg
CR: I'm madly impressed Cclr Smith didn't vote it down, but surprised by Cclr Sop
Mayor: motion to adjourn; motion carries

{Peter Miller, also a heritage advocate, had come to speak as well and it was a pity that the mtg wasn't allowed to continue for five more minutes.
Frankly, I was astonished that Cclr Sop voted against continuing a few more minutes; the current ccl procedures require a unanimous vote to go past 10pm.
Glad Cclr Smith has seen the light and no longer votes against short extensions when public still waiting to speak.
In speaking with Cclr Sop much later, he did apologize to me and said he thought I'd finished.
Well, Dear Readers, I hadn't but the essential was out.
It was time to make another public plea for a process to save our heritage.  This is the third heritage asset in about six months threatened.  We lost the first two with lack of notification of the heritage cmnty in time and I'm determined we do all we can for this third one, one that has not just WV significance but arguably significance in Canada and beyond.
It is my hope there is the will, the time, and the opportunity this time to honour this gem (and Arthur Erickson) in our midst.
In my plea for PROCESS that I was about to make I was going to decry the fact that the staff giving me information about demolition said he had no idea there was a heritage inventory and had no copy.  THIS MUST BE ADDRESSED ASAP.  By the time it gets to the application for demolition stage it's rather late.  We have to have an 'early warning' system.
Yes, we'll be able to do more once we have the Heritage Registry that the HWG is embarked on, but that doesn't mean we do nothing in the meantime.
We must let Planning, Building, Engg Dept know immediately that we have an inventory -- and to refer to it, flag the properties, trees, landscape/whatever features so that they are given the attention they deserve.   Clearly not everything can be retained in pristine conditions but some can be retained, maintained, and acknowledged in some way.}

==  More on ERICKSON: The Graham Residence
here is the website for views of the house: http://www.arthurerickson.com/H_grah.html ).
UPDATES -- Events starting to move:
~  Both the Arthur Erickson Conservancy and the Arthur Erickson Foundation have been informed and become involved.
~  Book has just been published (a year or two ago; photo taken then) in Chinese on Arthur Erickson's architecture, and it has a photo of the Graham residence.
~  The house has had tenants until recently.
~  Demolition permit has not yet been issued.
~  Still trying to contact owner (see PQP above).  Owner lives in London.  Lalji family forced out of Uganda so that wd mean probably Ismaili.  Understand may be some connection with Larco who own Park Royal -- if so, hope able to convey the significance of this architectural jewel, and once informed there will be avenues and opportunities for dialogue.
~  Architect is Paul Fedusiak we think -- I googled, here's his site: http://www.goldwoodhomes.com/
~  You have many of my comments in WVM 34, here's another notable quotation for you:
Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson
Speech on the Occasion of the International Woman in the Arts Award
Vancouver, Tuesday, June 18, 2002
I am deeply moved by this tribute and the International Woman in the Arts Award.  It's exciting to me, because Vancouver is a place with such an interest in the arts and as the birthplace of so many wonderful artists; a place with its own distinct vision and its own distinct way of doing things.
I had never come to Vancouver until I was over 30 and I was very interested in it right away. The very first night I got here, I went to something called the Graham House, which was the house on Horseshoe Bay built by Arthur Erickson for David Graham. David was the brother of a friend of mine from university. So I was really thrilled to see that house. To me, it expressed a great deal about what this kind of landscape and this kind of place does for its artists. It was only subsequently that I met Arthur Erickson, when I did a whole television program on much of his domestic architecture - both in Canada and in the United States.
I think it's wonderful to be part of that special Vancouver arts life, which I feel I am becoming just by getting this award.
===  BOOK REVIEW  === from The Economist 2007 Oct 11
Books & Arts  -- Israel's settlers
One reason for the absence of peace
How religious ideologues bent the Israeli state to their purpose
TWO months ago Heftsiba, an Israeli construction firm, went bust. One reason for its woes was a court order last year to freeze work on a big housing project on an Israeli settlement just inside the West Bank. The land, it turned out, had in effect been stolen from private owners in a neighbouring Palestinian village, Bilin. Yet after the bankruptcy, the same court ruled that the apartment blocks-and their prospective buyers, who had broken in and occupied them at the news of Heftsiba's impending collapse-could stay.
And thus it has always been. Never mind that Israel has flouted international law by settling its citizens in occupied foreign territory; what is remarkable is how consistently the settlers have thwarted Israel's own laws, in pursuit of what to them are biblical lands inhabited by Palestinian interlopers.
[The rest of the review can be found at http://www.economist.com/books/displayStory.cfm?story_id=9941757&fsrc=nwlehfree ]

===  BOOK REPORT  ===
Students at a local school were assigned to read two books, 'Titanic' & 'My Life' by Bill Clinton.
One student turned in the following book report, with the proposition that they were nearly identical stories!  His cool professor gave him an A+ for this report.
        Titanic:..... cost - $29.99
        Clinton:..... cost - $29.99
                Titanic:..... Over three hours to read
                Clinton:..... Over three hours to read
        Titanic:..... The story of Jack and Rose, their forbidden love, and subsequent catastrophe.
        Clinton:..... The story of Bill and Monica, their forbidden love, and subsequent catastrophe.
                        Titanic:..... Jack is a starving artist.
                        Clinton :..... Bill is a bullsh*t artist.
                Titanic:..... In one scene, Jack enjoys a good cigar.
                Clinton:..... Ditto for Bill.
        Titanic:..... During the ordeal, Rose's dress gets ruined.
        Clinton:..... Ditto for Monica.
                        Titanic:..... Jack teaches Rose to spit.
                        Clinton:..... Let's not go there.
        Titanic:..... Rose gets to keep her jewelry
        Clinton:..... Monica's forced to return her gifts.
                        Titanic:..... Rose remembers Jack for the rest of her life.
                        Clinton:..... Clinton doesn't remember Jack.
                                Titanic:..... Rose goes down on a vessel full of seamen.
                                Clinton:..... Monica...ooh, let's not go there, either.
                Titanic:..... Jack surrenders to an icy death.
                Clinton:..... Bill goes home to Hilary -- basically the same thing.

        ADRA  =   Ambleside and Dundarave Ratepayers' Association (Assn)
        BPAHA  =   British Properties Area Homeowners' Assn (newsletter: HillTop News}
        DNA  =  Dundarave Neighbourhood Assn
        WRA  =   Western Residents' Assn
        WVHS  =   West Vancouver Historical Society
        K = 1000; m - meter; M = million; sq ft/sf = square foot/feet; sftg = square footage

Whatever people in general do not understand, they are always prepared to dislike; the incomprehensible is always the obnoxious.                -- Letitia E. Landon, author (1802 - 1838)
The mind is its own place, and in itself / Can make a heaven of hell, a hell of heaven.
                        -- John Milton (1608 - 1674) [Paradise Lost]
Since we are destined to live out our lives in the prison of our minds, our one duty is to furnish it well.
                        -- Peter Ustinov, actor, writer, and director (1921 - 2004)
Those who build beneath the stars build too low.        -- Edward Young, English poet (1683 - 1765)