Calendar to Dec 17?

by Carolanne Reynolds, Editor

 HERITAGE UPDATE:  Arthur Erickson's Graham House -- demolished Dec 6
see ERICKSON HOUSE UPDATE AT END.  Contact: heritage@westvan.org or 922 4400
= MAIN ITEMS Ccl Mtg Dec 10th: Public Hearing on new zoning for 24th & Marine; AMBLESIDE TOWN CTR; 2008 Preview Assessment Roll; Cmnty Ctr Non-Profit Society; Dec 17th Ccl mtg time change to 6pm
Vive le Canada; UPDATE (Hollyburn Lodge, Marine Drive Gateway  ); CALENDAR to Dec 17th
=  Dec 3 Ccl NOTES:  NSh Restorative Justice; WVMLibrary; Hollyburn Lodge; DVP 5517 Ocean Place; Cmnty Dialogue on Nbrhd Character/Housing; Ambleside Town Strategy (to public); PUBLIC AMENITY POLICY; Funding for NSh walks; Apptmts: Library Bd, CEC, Metro Vancouver Bd, Metro Labour Relations, LMTAC; Cmnty Ctr Governance Bd Nomination Cmte; Adoption of fees/charges and Five-Yr Fin Plan bylaws; DVP for WV Presbyterian Church Dec 17; Correspondence: Vinson Crk, Hollyburn Ski Lodge, death of trees.
=  Dec 10th Ccl AGENDA; ERICKSON/GRAHAM HOUSE (AEC Letter); Weather Alert; Quotationson Language
===  Vive le Canada -- www.westvan60.com
from our Legion, Branch 60, this year's Nov 11 Remembrance Day Photographs can be viewed by clicking on "Gallery" on the lefthand side menu.
===   UPDATES   ===
>>>&nb= sp; Hollyburn Lodge: Past, Present, and Future
The West Vancouver Archives has launched a new short film highlighting the history of the Hollyburn Lodge at First Lake, near Cypress Bowl. Narrated by Mayor Pamela Goldsmith-Jones with music by the West Vancouver Youth Band, the film was created using scanned historic photographs donated to the Archives by the Hollyburn Heritage Society. The film shows the significance of the Lodge to the local community, and as a WV landmark.
The restoration of the Hollyburn Lodge has been identified as one of the District of West Vancouver's 2010 Olympic Legacy projects. Through this project, the District will attempt to raise nearly 1 million dollars to upgrade and preserve the building. For further details or to make a tax-deductible donation, please contact the West Vancouver Partnership Office at 925 7095.
{Counterintuitive so I've copy and pasted the url: http://www.westvancouver.ca/article.asp?a=5450&c=629}
>>>&nb= sp; Marine Drive Gateway Project -- Update: December 2007
The Marine Drive Gateway Project, located between Pound Road and 13th Street, has started up again. We are continuing with the completion of the Wetland and the installation of the Oil/Grit Separator. This work is on the south side of Marine Drive at 11th Street.
There will be some disruption to the traffic on Marine Drive eastbound -- single lane closures. Work will continue until Dec. 21st and resume on January 04, 2008.
Project Overview  The Marine Drive Gateway Project will take place in three phases, starting with the construction of Phase 1 in summer 2007.
Phase 1         *  Extension of Sw=E0y'wey Creek. 
        *  Replacement of the storm sewer system between 10th Street and 13th Street. 
        *  Reconstruction of the north boulevard and sidewalk. 
        *  Installation of ornamental lighting and removal of the overhead utility. 
        *  Associated landscaping.
Phase 2          *  Construction of a centre median between 10th Street and 13th Street. 
                 *   Re-construction of the intersection at Pound Road. 
                 *   Associated landscaping.
Phase 3                 *   Reconstruction of the south boulevard, sidewalk and slope. 
                *   Installation of ornamental lighting 
===   MUSING   ===
        Wonder how many Christmas teddy bears will be named Mohammed.....
===   INFObits  ===
*   From a BBC story on Guinness (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7106277.stm)
1759 - Arthur Guinness signs a 9,000 year lease on a disused brewery at St. James's Gate, Dublin
*  BBC News Saturday Dec 8 had (I think you can go to their website and see these things) an absolutely adorable 12-day-old South China tiger and a clip of the off-the-wall sport from Roman times called 'nurdling'.  Only in Britain you say?  Pity.
*   It was astonishing to read that inflation in Zimbabwe was 15,000% a year -- but then a few days later it was reported that inflation was so high that they have no figure.  Life expectancy is only in the 30s.  Mugabe is still in the Commonwealth, isn't he?
Wonder what inflation and conditions were like under Ian Smith who just died this month.  Anyone willing to make a comparison? [See obits in
*    Do the Burmese ever compare life under the military junta with colonial times?
*    "Lost Treasures, Hidden Buddha" was a fascinating National Geographic program on Knowledge Network (Nov 24).  You might be able to track it down.  Description: With so much Afghan culture destroyed, we witness two modern day stories of exploration and discovery as a new Afghanistan rises from the rubble.
*    Hilarious story on BBC news Dec 7: town in Italy has replaced garbage trucks and saves lots of money!
A donkey costs $1K and a garbage truck $150K to buy; a donkey costs $3K a year to feed, a truck $10-12K to run.  BBC: Donkeys used as refuse trucks The town of Castelbuono in Sicily is using donkeys instead of dust carts for its refuse disposal which officials say is much greener..  See http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_7130000/newsid_7132000/7132030.stm?bw=nb&mp=rm&news=1&nol_storyid=7132030&bbcws= =1#
===   WEBWATCH   ===
THE BATTLE FOR HEARTS AND MINDS                                                
British diplomats are using methods employed during the Victorian era to win over tribal leaders in Afghanistan.                       
  Watch the item: http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_7120000/newsid_7126000/7126092.stm?                                                  
And if you wondered what on earth persuaded Michael Caine to remake Sleuth with Jude Law then the simple answer is Harold Pinter. In an interview with Stephen Smith, Michael Caine reveals the true pulling power behind his decision to sign up to the remake. Sleuth 2007 has got a stellar cast and crew with Kenneth Branagh directing and Mr Pinter's updated script. But can it improve on the 1972 original?
Read Steve's article on meeting the Nobel laureate
===  MANWATCH -- TWO OBITUARIES from The Economist Nov 22. one a book, one an article
*  King Hussein of Jordan: From the desert he rose
The Hashemite monarch was a brave, decent man. His efforts to end strife in the Middle East should be an inspiration for today's peacemakers
*  Ian Smith
Ian Smith, a rebellious Rhodesian, died on November 20th, aged 88

===  CALENDAR to Dec 17th  === [M Hall unless otherwise noted; confirm b/c sometimes changes]
WEST VANCOUVER  Emergency Services Toy Drive  --  November 5th - December 15
Contact:  Const. Jeff Palmer, Community Services Unit (WVPD) - 925 7348; Assistant Fire Chief Martin Ernst (WVFD) - 925 7370
==  Saturday Dec 8th -- Cmnty Heritage Workshop at Srs' Ctr
~ 9:30am - 2:30pm ~ (free, light lunch; ph 925 7056 to register)
The District of West Vancouver invites you to a Community Heritage Workshop, which will be held on Saturday, December 8th from 9:30am to 2:30pm at the WV Seniors' Centre (Marine Room).  This will be of value to anyone wishing to learn more about community heritage registers, statements of significance, and heritage conservation management tools for local government. There will also be a classroom exercise on how to identify the values and character-defining elements of a number of West Vancouver's diverse heritage resources.  The workshop presenters/facilitators are:  Bob Parliament (BC Heritage Branch) and Sue Morhun (Township of Langley).
This is a free event, and includes a light lunch.  As space will be limited, please confirm your attendance by responding to this email or calling the Planning Department at 925.7055.  If you feel that this event may be of interest to a friend or colleague, pls forward this email.  For further info, pls log onto www.westvancouver.ca/heritage.

==  Tuesday Dec 11th ~  4:30pm ~ Finance/Audit Cmte, hoping for budget info (increase at least 3%)
==  Wednesday Dec 12th ~ 5:30pm ~ Library Board at Library
==  Thursday Dec 13th
        ~ 5pm ~ N Sh Substance Abuse WG
        ~ 5:30pm ~ RODGERS CRK WG (probably briefing from Open House on 4th)
*** Dec 7th RSVP for party Dec 12th
Please RSVP on-line by Friday, December 7th, 2007.  Our host, Capilano Golf and Country Club, requires advance numbers for preparation.   To rsvp, please go to the events calendar at our website: www.westvanchamber.com
==  Saturday Dec 15th ~ 7:30pm at Kay Meek Ctr
The Canadian Tenors: A Christmas to Remember
The Canadian Tenors, with guests the Celtic Divas, bring their Christmas show "A Christmas to Remember" from coast to coast with unforgettable moments of charm and songs, choosing from the standard seasonal repertoire and popular ballads.  They will warm you with your best-loved favourites and surprise you with some soon-to-be-favourites with all the special touches that the season brings.  Call the Kay Meek Centre Box Office for event details and to reserve your tickets. 913 3634.
==  Sunday Dec 16th ~ 3:30pm at Ambleside Beach
BC Boys Choir SongWave on the Beach
Come Join us for SongWave on the Beach and be part of the carol sing-along.  The British Columbia Boys Choir and the SongWave 2007 Boys Honour Choir will perform at this free community event.  The audience is invited to sing along with the choirs.
+++ FERRY BUILDING GALLERY --  "Great Stuff"  -- Nov 30 - Dec 21
An exhibition and sale of unique crafts, fine artwork, and distinctive gifts at affordable prices from over 40 of the best artists and artisans, just in time for the Christmas shopper!
Special Gallery Hours: 10am - 6pm; Late Friday shopping until 8pm; Closed Mondays

+++  WV MEMORIAL LIBRARY +++ see www.westvanlib.ca

+++  WV MUSEUM +++   BEHIND THE WIRE -- Nov 7 to Feb 9 
THE WARTIME DIARY AND ART OF ROBERT BUCKHAM. [Full description in earlier issue of WVM]

+++ Don't forget to check out www.silkpurse.ca and www.kaymeekcentre.com for their events

==========  CCL MTG NOTES= Dec 3rd  =========== 
1.  APPROVAL OF AGENDA: Item 6 withdrawn by applicant; added info for Items 4 and 8, and added letter from ADRA, plus two other letters
2.  ADOPTION OF MINUTES: November 19, 2007 Regular Council Meeting.
Wish happy birthday to former mayor Peter Jones on his 90th birthday; was mayor 1975 - 78 and alderman 1971 - 73; revered, his contribution.
GRAHAM HOUSE occupied a lot of my time and staff
met face-to-face with Mr Lalji; not interested in preserving or replicating
cd support recycling of materials, not unusual when a house being demolished
I began a series of discussions with the Arthur Erickson Conservancy [AEC] for guidance on this matter, plsed working collaboratively; they're v v impressed with our Heritage Strategy and our Heritage Planner, Stephen Mikicich.  They look forward to working with us to protect the legacy in WV of Erickson homes.
A big step forward.
I have agreed to participate in a documentary by a WV filmmaker, called Death of a House about creating awareness in Vancouver and the region for the benefit of the country about the many pieces of important architecture that are with us that we may not recognize as pieces of art and works of art.
I'll read one paragraph from a letter released late this afternoon from the AEC wch is the body that looks after his intellectual property and legacy.
It's lengthy, sorry let me find the page.....
{See full letter in Erickson section at end; I've bolded part of what the Mayor read out.  When you read it however, keep in mind the additions were made by the owner and in the minds of many do not disqualify heritage status, and the house had been lived in until about three months ago so was not rundown, but some dismantling had been done.  Previous WVM issues cite other architects' views but one might understand that the original designer wd not be as happy at any change, sympathetic or not.  Then she went on:}
We're v pleased to be working with the Conservancy to make a better future for the conservation, preservation, replication, and restoration  -- it's a big business and a serious one.
For my part as mayor, it's really important to understand that we are credible, that we have a dedicated Planning Dept dedicated to heritage, and that we are going to be deliberative about the preservation of Arthur Erickson homes in the cmnty in the future, and we are well on our way in spite of what will be the loss of the Graham House.
We have a delegation--
Sop: as a point of information.  What is it in our laws that gives a right of an individual to privacy in relationship to say, purchasing a home, and then suddenly it comes into the limelight?
Mayor: may I refer that to Reports if that's all right with you?  I'd like to get a move on with the agenda and our guests, and we'll come back to that.
3.  North Shore Restorative Justice Society, regarding North Shore Restorative Justice Society Expansion
[Alanna Ibrahamson and Alexan Rowley (sp???)]
Speaker: we both have master's degrees in criminology
held as an example, 70 in prov
conflict resolution and peacemaking; meet with all parties; hearing how event has affected them
addressed in meaningful way: financial restitution, apologies, etc
feedback positive, less repeat than justice system, victims feel better
talk to cmnty groups and schools
we partner with Victim Services; adult abuse and neglect: seniors, brain injuries
turned down for funding; will apply again; volunteer; residents we've worked with grateful
Sop: funds?
Ans: have had matched; asked for $15K
Sop: restorative justice, make amends in some way to victim? what's end result?
Ans: restore what's been broken; kick down fence, now fix it we hear as example
restore young person in cmnty; repair the harm caused
five diff ppl homes broken into and each a different response, so look at that
Sop: maybe all when young regret what we did; is penalty phase absolved?
Ans: an agreement everybody has input into; financial, apology, etc; then check to see if followed counselling, etc.  The young person gets input into what, so not imposed by a judge
MS: when you requested the delegation the letter says we don't require Ccl to take any action then I hear $15K, so are we being asked?
Ans: understand we apply to a board
MS: did we fund this Society for $15K last year?
CAO: no, it will be up to--
Mayor: of great interest to cmnty to learn how that heals the offender
proactive way
Ans: agree; if a young person is coming to attention to police, something is not going well
opp to meet with young person, put services in place, drug counselling, etc
what needs have to be fulfilled so not happens again.
we know we, police, schools, want to be proactive
we work in prisons and often hear them say if they'd had [this service/approach] they wdn't be there.
Mayor: we look forward to your application and thank you for the work you do.
4.  Update regarding West Vancouver Memorial Library Board (File: 1905-04)
     Presentation to be provided.  {This was v interesting and I paid attention but alas did not get down as much as I wd hv liked.  It started about 7:27 if you wish to watch it on the DWV website.  apologies, probably not all names cited nor spelled correctly.}
Paul Tutsch, Sheryl MacGregor, ... Harry Greenwood, chair of trustees, Colleen Brown, board of trustees
... Bergen, etc, etc,... from Fdn Board, Elizabeth Dunbar; unfortunately Ann Goodhart, Chief Librarian not able to attend, also sorry Ian Petrie, treasurer, a v imp person
basis of all our planning
[slides] why are we here: update on library activities, show renovation, seek support
about 260 volunteers, 70 full and part-time staff
WVML Fdn, 20th anniversary last year; raised millions of dollars one of best in Canada and in NAm
statistics: 45K residents; 970050 items...
ran 800 progs last year; increase without increasing staff...
Guiding Documents: OCP Cmnty Devt; Arts & Culture Strategy; WVML strategic plan; archival storage; multicultural/multipurpose;
"in a progressive country change is constant, nothing endures but change"
Cheryl MacGregor; plan RFID; reasons why we must install
Mayor: think you shd explain
Ans: Radio Frequency Identification; self-checkout
explanation; we can have questions later
slide: multi-purpose venue - not hv enough mtg rooms; no soundproof rooms
doc visits
150 seats, can be divided into smaller units
central service desk; near front entrance better than three
new computer ctr; makes more sense to centralize; have an assistant to look over
Library Reorg: room for District Archives if District decides to make that change
increase dept and breadth; bringing up the ref collns; open area with comfortable chairs as reading
difficult to accomplish these in isolation
Paul: all of this comes at a cost; don't expect taxpayers to pay for all
total $1.7M; the Fdn will provide 60% of the total bill
Fdn will accept full responsibility for any overruns, shown here
$670K from you, wch is 10% less than what orig; if in coop with NV, provided commit by Feb 2008
exchange rate has swung in our favour
you've already committed to $400K in 2008 so seeking an addition $200K+
suggest P3 Partnerships...
Mayor: Cclr Day wd you like to speak as the liaison
RD: thanks, maybe cd answer questions
Sop: I went on a little tour with the chairman, interesting plans for efficiencies
what's the true saving to the taxpayer? service? not dollar value?
Paul: not willing to commit to a dollar value; in US where they've installed this technology don't think change to staffing, don't plan ...
based on experience of other libraries, (less) repetitive strain injuries, young ppl not so much
wonderful if I cd come to say in 2.5 years cd say covered cost but I don't think
Sop: wd you clarify 'concert hall'?
Paul: that's a multipurpose room, as we presently use Peters room now
may have to use main hall as we do now, if more than 250
this room will be much larger than Peters room so can hold more
we have two mtg rooms, the Peters room and the Musto room; we have to turn ppl away
this large will be larger and dividable so a number of mtgs; accordion-type wall; will be used
Sop: Mr Stuart, in our process in cmnty we look at diff venues
KMC, Silk Purse, other venues, Cmnty Ctr
where is the logic in dispersing all this energy in sev areas, est more spaces for concerts, don't mind mtg space; seems to me funnelling out in many areas; wonder if by plan
CAO: one of the initiatives of Art & Cult Services is to get list and coordinate them so we don't have competition, so more by better using facilities
suspect this facility not only mtgs, authors coming to speak, more than a concert room
Paul: your eagle eye saw that the total cost of that room being borne by the Fdn
Sop: you seemed to blend mtg with concert space
MS: saying space for what we currently have in Cmnty Archives bldg?
Paul: yes; if, as, and when, decide to move Archives will be room
MS: no impediments to moving archives?
Paul: no
JF: when we get together to talk about budgets
if Ccl found cdn't find all the requested funds, how wd that impact?
what if Ccl only half? allow majority to take place? stage some?
Paul: not a simple answer to that
one slide had RFID in ctr; v integrated plan
goes back a couple of years, amazing to see how pieces fit together
all seemed to fit together, RFID; does free up staff
just like having all of the computers in one place
really a good way to spend some of the taxpayers' money
JC: timeline?
Paul: for entire project; hope to be finished in first quarter of 2009
contingent on approval from TechLogic, the systems provider for 2008
need commitment from staff in that same timeframe
ev done in first quarter of 2009
RD: thank Mr Tutsch and entire Library Bd plus staff and reps from Library Fdn
think your proposal is a sound one
process almost a million items a year and half a million persons when a cmnty of 45K
downstairs concert and mtg rooms and archives; serious proposal
Fdn funding about 60%; thank you for coming here
Mayor: thanks for track record you have
Mayor: a Christmas card... cottage...thanking us... can learn
5.  Hollyburn Lodge: Past, Present, and Future
    Presentation to be provided.
Lois Enns: from WV archives and Cmnty Archives
launch of our film; landmark; narrated by WV Mayor, music by Youth Band ...
staff, many contributors here for the launch so we can acknowledge them
unusual for the Archives; focus on preservation of materials
Elspeth Bradbury, coming book by Francis  Mansbridge
thx Ch 8, LGA; thank Mark for his contribution...
[see: http://www.westvancouver.ca/article.asp?a=5450&c=629]
... new curator started in Sept; will make av to public
Hollyburn Lodge opened Jan 26, 1927, former cookhouse of old Naismith mill
box flume that carried logs down; 300 cabins
Friday night, Vancouverites wd race to WV -- after full day of skiing, dancing
Catherine Rockandel memories
thousands of ppl came to watch
1936 represented Canada in Berlin Olympics; home base Hollyburn Ridge
privatize; 1984 Cypress Bowl recreation
shifted to cross country skiing; second highest in NAm
Gordon Knight comments; currently about 100 cabins remaining
trails used winter and summer; often events on Saturday nights
2010 will have half-pipe
Hollyburn Lodge link [see: http://www.hollyburnheritagesociety.ca/]
years have taken a toll, cost $1M to preserve
ten projects legacies of 2010 Hollyburn Lodge one
opp to rediscover our history; continue to experience this unique WV institution
for more information on your tax deductible donation contact our cmnty office, call 925 7095
RD: how's the fundraising going?
Ans: know $100K through Legacy project; society has applied for grants and gave film as part of submission
RD: Cypress Bowl Enterprises now the owner, they do extremely well, wonder why not putting up money to restore?
Josie: we're in negotiations, interested; and after to be used by cmnty
RD: thought as owners they'd be interested
Sop: we're going to, b/c of heritage wch I support, owned by someone other than WV and they're not putting any money into it?
Ans: unfortunately in 1944, the District traded the land to the prov to create a park
HHS has been tireless;
Sop: no prob on heritage part, just land owned by someone else
who will run it in future
CAO: the $100K is a result of consultation that VANOC went through and Cypress was part of that
they're trying to wrestle with this facility or build something else
confident they'll participate
Sop: ready for Olympics?
Josie: object of everyone working on the project
Sop: how long to raise that money? Olympics in a blink of an eye
Ans: time to jump on the bandwagon
Sop: excited in 1954 when Commonwealth Games and waved to Queen
coming quickly, want to get excited here?
RD: HHS, supported by M, plus negotiations with the owner
on the way to raising the money; when will we hear about grants and size?
Josie: a variety of applications, from Mar to later next year; cd be $200K or more
RD: so cd be tight; end of 2008; able to move quickly with this excellent society, working hard getting word out
Mayor: imp to recognize how many can be of help
2010 shd serve as a catalyst
by identifying this as a legacy project; will need to be sustained

6.   Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-042 (5517 Ocean Place) (File: 1010-20-07-042)
WITHDRAWN by Applicant

7.  Status Report on the Community Dialogue on Neighbourhood Character and Housing
Mayor: to public
Ans: suggest presentation first and then we'll speak
Christine Banham/SMikicich/(who else?); Status Report SLIDES
CBanham: our second status report; info on what we've got so far
last time phase one; we have four phases
Background; purpose & objectives; defining WG's role
met nine times since April; reviewing bkgrd docs
have also identified individuals; online forum, newsletter, survey, nbrhd fair, presentation to groups
www.westvancouver.ca/community dialogue
Andy will tell you about some of the presentations we've had around town
Andy: v interesting and rewarding experience; brought a lot of issues to front
so far: WV Sch Dist (Geoff Jopson), initiative with Cedardale also at Nbrhd Fair, our Mayor returned the artwork; further work with WV Secondary; SMik met with WV Historical Society; met with Srs Ctr, WRA, NSh Adv Cmte on Disab; Lionsview Ctr
Christine: slide of newsletter, first of four to be distributed; can be picked up
outline process and timelines; opps for public to get involved
next issue in early January
Nbrhds Fair, Oct 13/14; successful ~ 400 ppl attend; background on housing and nbrhd character issues
what they value, talk about future needs
SLIDE of sample artwork -- Grade Three Art Project from Ecole Cedardale
engaging cmnty through students, encourages parents and relatives to talk about these issues
a technique we're going to use again
sample of info av for residents to view; demographic profiles
Housing Issues: this display was from NShCmte on Disability Issues
We had a "Housing Therapist"; Barb was successful in this; "Therapist was in" -- they often spent half an hour; complicated and you need to spend time
Ideas for New Housing Types: what do you cherish most in your nbrhd? future needs?
had a professional designer who cd illustrate designs -- I want something else
RESULTS from online forum, district survey
Online Forum: over 2000 hits, can participate easily; always on; key issues on trees, views, impact on properties, mix between preservation and restrictions; what will change in my nbrhd look like?
SMik: over 2000 hits does not include discussion of dogs
Questionnaire: go on line and fill it out, still there; v large house replacing modest ones, disruption from construction, increased traffic, excessive blasting
Is your housing suitable for you now? 96% said yes
look five years out 76%, and ten years 57%
satisfaction with status quo -- if you have blinders on you don't think about change until you get to that demographic
SMik: based on 80 completed surveys to date
CBanham: desire for smaller house in same nbrhd; two dwellings on same lot, duplexes, townhouses with yards; looking for same dwelling to yard; close to amenities
Cmnty Survey, diff from questionnaire wch was 80
81% concerned about future affordability; 80% future housing choice; secondary suites 75%
71% for X 65% for Y 56% for Z [see slide and report]
concern about options, greater capacity in nbrhds
polarized views:
68% house construction 54% on size; alteration 51%
tree removal; size of decks
action to manage change
not wanting to be managed any further than we're already managed
difficult to say clear one view or another
Next Steps
we're emerging into Step Two; next few months will have more opp to get involved
workshop prob in Feb; panel disc in March
focus in depth on some issues that have already been highlighted
what they seem that they want Ccl to do
Andy: What we're working on; some have already been mentioned
Newsletter #2; Panel Discussion (folks in field talking); Cmnty Workshops (what they wd see); WVSS Student Project (valuable to involve youth at this stage, look to 20 - 30 years)
CBanham: what we will get out of the Dialogue
be able to report to you wrt cmnty's views re policies, regulations, possible zoning changes, heritage conservation
SMik: re house size, will be tag-teaming with reg reviews; see feeding back and forth
Mayor: questions then mbrs of public waiting to speak
Sop: call for new housing options, affordability
imp to have a sense of perspective of what affordability is; we've danced around it
had ppl in this Ccl stand up say we need affordable housing and everything is way up there -- what is that?
CBanham: we can't put a dollar value
Sop: are you going to address that issue?
Andy (WG mbr): through the dialogue be able to provide some sort of base line as to what is affordable
talk about future needs; will try to dig at and under it
Wendy Carter (from audience to speak): important issue, just learned about this yesterday
lived here three years, family longer; didn't get newsletter
now that here make sure I will be [involved]
ppl not opposed but want to keep character
we just built an expensive house, built in character to fit but house behind us, 1160 Kings Ave -- look at bylaws -- house not supposed to be 25ft above grade but peak can go higher, something about clerestory windows
issue around basements 1000sf, apparently above grade so not counted; house dominates whole nbrhd
LGA you have no control over character; can say how big and how high it can go
major issue, wd hope you wd take beyond
number of ppl thought it was above rules, many asked, finally someone came by last week, apparently overheight but they're still continuing to build
at quarter to 7, as we left, still hammering; do you have any control? stop order? we have a peekaboo view of water, a house can be built like this in front of us
ppl can cheat
mixed comm/resid will be required for form and character -- can you do in nbrhd otherwise why talking about it
return on investment tearing it down...
many years ago nbrhd looking a bit like something they were living
our nbrs didn't know about this mtg tonight or they'd have been here tonight
drive by that house, it's too high -- one storey too high, another a bit too high
Mayor: Mr Nicholls
Ms Armstrong: 1150 Kings -- the lots are 50 x 120; this house is massive; looks like a rocket launcher; design does not fit in with the nbrhd; the ht is well over 25ft
2500 sf plus basement and do think over the 2 ft above grade; garage ...
my prop value will probably be going down
Mayor: we're not going to comment
Armstrong: last week at M; they said complying and I said NO
phoned inspector, and he said it was overheight
so guess we have to wait for a survey
Mayor: yes I talked to Dir/Permits and will have to have a survey
not a major over and that's why no stop order; fairly simple to correct it; normally survey at framing
doesn't happen often b/c ppl know survey at framing stage
something will be done , not diff for owner to do that
do we have control over form and character? mandatory DP area; says you cannot have form and character for sgl fam homes...
we are exploring that; Lower Caulfeild; proposals to control met with opposition
still remains scale and impact on adjacent nbrs, not just view
certainly amt of activity on a street; those sorts of things shd be looked at
we've been innovative in WV in past and willing to be again
RD: I went out and saw
Gibbses and Nobles, and next to house on Wed
what we can do by legislation is increasing sideyards, height; can't control design but we do have design control for duplexes
resistance, reduce size/value; half don't want us to and half do
still think Ccl wd like to see some legislation, hope WG and staff provide some
bldgs 6-8Ksf for two ppl and you cd have two or three fams
huge great bldgs housing virtually nobody
want to be increasingly green; nbrs object to big houses
if construction crews hammering at 7:30 they're violating think it's 7:30 to 5:30, call Bylaw ofcr
MS: I too drove by the house and agree completely out of character, one side like a drive-in theatre screen
keeps coming up and Ccl doesn't do anything
loopholes around covered decks, porticos, 2ft above grade
if I were to buy, if 25ft bylaw -- how can you have a bylaw if it allows above 25ft
for the two years I've sat on this Ccl heard about that and done nothing
JF: thank WG and staff and all ppl for those who have attended, answered surveys, in online forum, think most important we'll have
spurred by review of OCP; been an issue -- form, density, size, impact -- for a long time
hoping we'll come to some resolution, become more aware, bldgs more aware impacting in a neg way
ppl going to be nbrs; don't even talk about it
buy prop, pay a lot, hire an architect
it's the impact they have, it's the design; has to belong within the nbrhd and that's what I think will happen
hope WG will come back with the wisdom of Job;
so if ppl thinking about coming in; something that can work more effectively, better; more continuing dialogue
going to have to involve ratepayer groups
get nbrhds together and come to some consensus
hope they'll come back with sensitive solutions; see what we can do
don't think it will be easy either for them or Ccl
VV: do find it quite easy
we can choose what sq ft what FAR; we can choose to include the basement
full floor, ceiling, covered decks cd be covered
cd do that straight away, straight from interpreting it
apparently we do have design control in multifam but not sgl fam
can we make distinction between rebuilds in nbrs vs Upper lands
FAR for rebuilds in established nbrhds more tightly controlled
SJN: yes
VV: so we cd
getting a handle on it
always been enthusiastic about this; damage and many say by the time you get to it too late
pragmatic, eager to get at it immediately
Sop: hope is that through this WG and infill scenario; think we're in a dilemma
what has been established here, certain interpretations, massing that has not occurred before
occurred in some areas, two: interpretation of bylaws as today vs rewriting of these bylaws; once that starts take years; until then we're going to see explosion of that massing
don't see how will change
what's staff's recommendations to curb this?
keeping in mind, rights for your house applies to nbrhd
last person who builds in nbrhd has the view
wondering if interpretation of lot size, FAR, same for acre as 50 - 100
Mayor: Mr Nicholls will answer
SJN: sequentially; size vs size of lot
mtg in Altamont area about size and house was 10K
no one found it large b/c it had context
house max ht with basements don't consider high and neither do nbrs
in sloping nbrd, shd they be able to build a two-storey house
existing regs after extensive review; with residents, same concerns
a cmnty's culture and economic conditions change so worth going through
you will be affecting prop value; worth the debate
RD: Cclr Smith is right; we keep debating this issue; we wring our hands
not quite right, established WG and working on it
we shd do something about it; some can be done
call on Planning Dept recommendations as to how we can deal with worst abuses, hope to pass in spring, wrt ht, sideyards, blasting
hope ask staff to come up with report by March, suggest what we can do
wd like to see something happen, talk about forever, nothing happen and in the meantime nbrhds being destroyed
bungalows of past; excesses
wd suggest, move that Ccl ask staff to report by mid-March kind of legislation Ccl might pass to deal with this excessive side
VV: second
Mayor: we've done this; parallel process
we have one of the most outdated zoning bylaws perhaps in prov
don't think soln easy but getting it so not going over and over
maybe we can deal with some of these things right away...
pity Cclr V didn't support........ designing with nature; young ppl talk about as well
not easy; we're just looking for a way to begin
big priority for the last big piece of policy ppl want Ccl to address
survey keep character; options, we are losing character if we do nothing; requires an open mind what kind
Mr Nicholls wd like to get to this; we even tried to hire somebody
CAO: defer the motion to next week; staff will talk about what we can do
SJN: we anticipated coming in spring with more than this
Mayor: offer some hope m, some steps
Mayor: underscores motion of a few weeks ago
RD: maybe we can rephrase it for next week
wd like to see staff work with WG, provide a series of recommendations whereby Ccl can revise its bylaws to make reasonable alterations
can't go back to age of bungalows
provide legislation so we can get rid of worst abuses; this is the intent
Mayor: diff from what you've already got?
SJN: wd try to avoid word 'abuses' wch implies building contrary to [regulations]
early action in dealing with nbrhd issues
considered to be key factors;
here are the  pros and cons; we can come back with a report for next week flesh out
RD: withdraw word 'abuses'
Mayor: had explored the idea of a technical WG
SJN: technicalities of drafting bylaws; sometimes draft and have no idea doing terrible thing
Tech group of those who builds houses plus residents
MS: builders have found a way to circumvent our bylaws
Mayor: --
MS: I think they have
when Mr Nicholls brought in bylaw, one style
now drive down and huge covered decks; go from here to half way across the room and they don't count in the sq ft calculation; didn't see them years ago; need to get back to original intent of 35%...
CAO: maybe not circumvent but being opportunistic
Mayor: this motion with
RD: willing to withdraw for next week, need better wording, more clearly
Mayor: Cclr V agrees to withdraw
JC: as my Grade 5 teacher used to say, glad we've had this little chat
As you see, the info out of the WG surveys,
was going to make a motion v similar to the one Cclr Day has referred to next week; don't think we can avoid this
July came to Ccl first time, shared info with cmte
any hotspots, Ccl wd like an early ref to those; this is it; this is the hotspot in WV; incumbent on us to get at it; cmte will work to June, election year so not much will happen over summer
This issue we can address separately and beforehand
take out of realm of this cmte; wd like to see it as a lightning rod; not this cmte's responsibility to do anything, Ccl's, and shd get on with it

8.         Ambleside Town Centre Strategy (File: 0117-20-ATCS)  Report to be provided.
{Hope this means out for public input.  All that talk about how many biz/whatever days before mtg for agenda and ccl mtg pkg and wd still get reports on-table or at the mtg -- why not defer the report to the next mtg instead of tantalizing us with what's on but no info???}
report av to public; on agenda next week

9.         Public Amenity Contribution Policy (File: 1008-00/0282-20-303)
            RECOMMENDED:  THAT the Public Amenity Contribution Policy be adopted.
{ADRA's letter has already been sent but not the required 11 days before mtg for it to be on this agenda.  We knew it was coming soon but not that it wd be Dec 3rd.  ADRA's recommendation is that the cmnty share be approximately 75% and as to what benefits/amenities, that to be decided after public consultation.  Letter was part of ccl mtg package 'on-table'.}
Elaine Fonseca: I'm President of the Ambleside and Dundarave Ratepayers' Assn (ADRA).  As you know ADRA has been in existence for approximately 30+ years.  We're a cmnty-based organization.  Our ratepayers' assn wishes to ensure that any change or development will also enhance or improve our community and quality of life re cmnty benefits and public amenities.
We believe increased value, that is Uplift, that accrues from changes in zoning should be shared by the community.  The difference between the present value of existing zoning and the future value of the changed zoning represents the Uplift, the increase in value.
ADRA recommends that the Community's share be approximately 75% of the Uplift, and we'd also like to comment that this shd not be cast in stone.
{"cast in stone" was not in the letter circulated to the board so I'm not quite sure what it means.  For example, saying approximately does not make it a fixed, or cast in stone, amount.  The public naturally wd be pleased to receive a higher share but this shd not be viewed as an invitation to lower proportions!}
The increased value and the decision on the Community Benefits and Public Amenities shd be made by Council after full public consultation.
We believe that this policy should be applied equally to the whole District and we believe that we shd get our fair share.
Thank you.
{"fair share" was also not in the letter; guess ppl wd debate what's fair.}
Mayor: I'm going in the order, b/c I have multiple sheets.
CR: Editor, West Van Matters.  I want to echo those comments of course.
What I've heard back from ppl, to the newsletter too, ppl who've called, and I am going to put some sort of question; but as you know, personally I've been asking for 20 years that the uplift be calculated and that the cmnty get a share.
75% I think is a good ideal figure, there are cmnties and there are instances in wch other cmnties get more than that, so I think 75% shd be our guideline.
I think it shd be absolutely clear how the uplift is calculated so we all know what the amt is and it's easy to calculate the 75% and then b/c there are various ways of getting cmnty benefits (CB), that's why the full cmnty consultation.
Earlier this year I had recommended that there be some sort of survey of what CBs and public amenities the public wanted.  IOW, what, with specific reference to a particular place that's been zoned, but if there cd be a list of CBs and PAs that the cmnty wd like you know whether -- some silly examples, say, a water fountain here, a park there, a cmnty mtg space there or whatever it is
Have a list of those [CBs/PAs] broken down into under $10K, under $50K, and then instead of suddenly having to ask for a lot of them, although you will each time you have uplift, you'll already have in front of you some CBs and PAs already there for you to consider; you have like a menu list
I think that might help speed up the process rather than having to go out for a long--
you cd hv a shorter process if ppl hv already said these are some of the things that we wd like to see in our cmnty to make it better.
Keith Pople: ADRA director and with Preserve WV but speaking personally
read over policy; hasn't taken over other costs
say 1%, as soon as concluded, immed requirement
immed impact on traffic usage; rec facilities, traffic, ... ; will lose quality of life
cost of this impact shd be taken into consideration when looking at CBs
shdn't be too diff to calculate
looking at Wetmore Motors, shd be money equal to uplift, as Elaine and Carolanne have pointed out but also
if ppl going in there, if accommodation for older ppl, need assisted living, there isn't too big of a demand on, not big cost to cmnty
if condos, ppl active, have cars, shd be some consideration of this, bigger rec facility, need beaches
wdn't be hard to est this; est of replacement costs
1% increase of usage of all the infrastructure
catch up
increased taxes will catch up over 20 years
my thought just before dinner
{the only ppl left in chamber were NSNews reporter, Keith, Elaine, a couple, and me -- but a lot of ppl watch these mtgs on TV or on the Web.}
Mayor: for adoption
CAO: came before summer; decided not to put details
put framework,
sure we're taking into consideration concept of Uplift
Mayor: diff to put a motion on the floor when it says adoption; but will have discussion
MS: so move adoption?
Sop: find it strange, 5.1.4 wd say we introduce for securing CBs and amenities
Mayor: CBs and Amenities two different things
Sop: look at diff things wrt FAR
look at Mr Pople's
reasonable to have this policy after establish what
CAO: if nothing in Amb
all this does is ensure capture Cmnty Amenity
Sop: page X it states may fall in broad range of categories
don't see a biz-case scenario as to what it means to a particular area
to give us a description of a particular bldg or site that wd
this is poetry, not a fact...
and we say there have to be dollars and cents, how that is a true bldg block for quality of life
just words, no facts
next week that's what I want to get to
what are the facts, this doesn't do it
I wd ask this be deferred
CAO: the policy is designed so that when Devt Permit comes to Ccl, have something presented to Ccl that's fair and adequate
with no policy no direction to collect any; this says staff can negotiate
VV: I too wd like to defer to
I understand submissions wrt Uplift
wanted a defined percentage but the advice I've discovered in meantime, is illegal
the fed and prov govts want to tax, and they don't want removing that to tax
not going to be allowed; haven't an easy way
gone back to the LGA, provision for some special cases
all couched in refer to LGA; we've never got our minds around that; not v meaningful
one that I thought wd be illegal but it's not; if multifamily as zoned at time, then we cd upzone it and then can apply any covenants
then we'd have it, sell it back and have 100%; have that, in US
rather than tedious, LGA for special housing
get as much as up front
I, like Cclr Smith, ...  Ccl more of a formula; love to see on biz basis
like to see this deferred to make it more clear, to see how we can get benefit
calculate percentage and law says we can't do it
SJN: some recent legal cases have clarified the matter
this and next week: you have the ability to collect and require public amenities
when dealing with devts, expect it to pay own way wrt services; some impact remedial, traffic light required over and above
only real estate taxes and utilities
court order Ms to pay back over and above; but there are ways of doing it legally
this policy has been gone over; creates a framework
always been collecting public amenities just without a framework
next week; methods for Amb, use this framework, put it into zoning bylaw, not just affordable housing but have to use that tool
there is no rezoning application to base uplift on
with exception of the three major sites wch wd be part of the discussion

{this cd be the major problem.  Some properties in Amb are only .4FAR but if the new bylaw makes 1.75FAR the base then there's little chance to argue any uplift to get any cmnty benefits/amenities at all!!!  And then it makes provision for an additional .5 for things considered a benefit such as rental so that it goes to 2.75 and we get nothing (except for example rental, considered a benefit)!  If this isn't a give-away to developers and biz owners it is at the very least missed opportunities for the cmnty to get something back for increasing the value of some properties!!!}

if you want to collect cmnty amenities, put two densities into, XXX and put XXXX
it's a technique of implementing
doesn't increase densities in Amb
if you don't adopt this doesn't change what we'll do in future but it does provide a policy whether Rodgers, HBay, public amenities, and will be based on change of value of prop
MS: I too think shd be deferred, not b/c not in favour but b/c must be clear what we're doing
Both NVs have two, 1% art, 2%, [for a total of 3%,] and then negotiated benefits
in ours says secured through one of several methods, as recommended by the M solicitor
think we have to have ....
have to be crystal clear what we can do
say have 3% and landowner knows that in advance, can build into his
capital reserve for Cmnty Ctr
need new Police Bldg, to buy Argyle props; Library
demand for capital will always be there need to rebuild our cap reserves
upzone Amb and intent to have more ppl in the area, acquiring Argyle lands, imperative, more ppl need more public space
this policy is not quite there, don't know what we can charge
need two, %age on al,l and then project by project basis
over and above fixed percentage
CAO: Ccl has been advised re this matter; a straight percentage is not legal, cd not successfully implement that; can look at that again
defer, bring solicitor in again in camera mtg to look at it

{Comment: Isn't there something wrong with having secret, closed door mtgs with a solicitor who advises Ccl on how to structure public policy, advice that is not made public, but that influences the legislation?  How democratic or transparent is that process?}

JF: puzzled, this policy Ccl has been kicking around for years; one step forward two back
never seem to
pleased with it; not too specific but specific enough
most of the devt in this cmnty is sgl fam and don't get DCCs ...
even commercial area not significant ...
need to have in place, ev encouraged  ....   will be supporting it
JC: agree with Cclr Ferguson, been bandying this about far too long
if nothing in place can't take advantage; support
RD: I agree with Cclrs Cl and Ferg, policy, we've given it three readings
nothing stops us from expanding
represents number of years of work; I'm going to vote for it
Mayor: I'm going to speak in favour ...
gone specific to general to specific and back to general; can't be as specific other
of course this fits with LGA
greater housing choice, will debate phase two of Kiwanis, greater density supported for $650/mo
Childcare group
worked hard to get Childcare  into this policy
maybe at a price .... can afford
to Cclr V's point, many Ms are in the real estate biz; they have a lot of money
we may gently move in that direction...
this policy more than long overdue
particularly for ppl who make speeches about biz and getting things done
Sop: I don't buy that at all; p 3 says shall reflect a percentage of value; what about 100% as they do in Vancouver?
will have a profound impact on this Cmnty
let's take value; let's see what amenities will be
Broadbrush and not get
JC: extend till close of biz
{Wow! passed again!}
MS: wdn't speak again but respond to getting on with things,
wd argue not in biz-like manner
shall reflect size; how well responds; project
extraordinary risk, diff of land assembly
who interprets, .....    show assesses value, risk
what does difficult of land assembly...
not opposed to policy but just want it to be clear
CAO: comes back to framework
Ccl to decide if .......  each site is diff...  what has been negotiated
Mayor: so case-by-case basis; vote?
Sop: called for deferral
Mayor: call question on motion
Sop: wdn't it be nice if all together
Mayor: I'd called, if I hadn't I'd do deferral
tied; I'm in favour so passes
Sop: ask for a polled vote
Mayor: ?
SSch: read out: ...
Sop: no, polled vote each called out
Mayor: who's voting in negative?
[SSch said]
Mayor: not what you're looking for?
Sop: no
Mayor: not familiar with polled vote
Sop: call and each vote
SSch: .... to record; each mbr of ccl
Mayor: particular order
JF: do we have to have a motion on this?
yay, nays
[Passes with VV, MS, and Sop against]
10.       UBCM Grant - 2008 Community Health Promotion Funding for North Shore Walks
RECOMMENDED:  THAT the District's application to the Union of British Columbia Municipalities (UBCM) Community Health Promotion Fund for a grant of $35,000 be endorsed to support the Active North Shore Network in 2008, and staff be directed to provide any required grant and financial management support for the associated North Shore Walks program.
Sop: may I ask a question?
Mayor: not if it's a polled vote
JC: a pole dance?
Sop: grant and financial mgmt support; say keen endorsement?
Mayor: think achieves that
Sop: looks like something staff will negotiate
Mayor: it's been v successful; we've been shortlisted for an award
CAO: ... v minimal
11.       Appointments to Library Board (File: 1905-04)
RECOMMENDED:  THAT the following Trustees be appointed to the West Vancouver Memorial Library Board for a term ending December 31, 2008 in order to fill the three vacancies on the Board: Nicole Brown, Paul Tutsch, and Bruce Carter.
12.       Appointments to the Community Engagement Committee for 2008 (File: 0116-20-CEC)
RECOMMENDED: THAT the following reappointments to the Community Engagement Committee for a term ending December 31, 2008 be approved: Patricia Bolton, Carolanne Reynolds, and Alex Tunner.
13.       Appointments to Metro Vancouver Board of Directors, Metro Vancouver Labour Relations Board and Lower Mainland Treaty Advisory Committee (LMTAC)
RECOMMENDED: THAT the following appointments be approved for 2008:
Metro Vancouver Board of Directors:  Mayor Goldsmith-Jones; Alternate:  Councillor Clark
Metro Vancouver Labour Relations Board: Councillor Day;  Alternate:  Councillor Soprovich
Lower Mainland Treaty Advisory Committee (LMTAC):
Councillor Ferguson, Alternate: Councillor Day; Staff Rep:  R. Beauchamp, Director/Administrative Services.
14.       Nominating Committee for Community Centre Governance Board (File: 0117-20-CCG)
            Report to be provided.
Mayor: defer or withdraw?
deferred to next week
15.       Fees and Charges Bylaw No. 4414, 2005, Amendment Bylaw No. 4532, 2007 - Business Licence Fees
16.       [Five-]Year Financial Plan Bylaw No. 4510, 2007, Amendment Bylaw No. 4529, 2007
CAO: through a series of misunderstanding in NSN, correction this Sunday and in Tidings
anyone want info
Mayor: thank you or your work with NSN
Sop: ask if third reading cd be rescinded; most had to do with fire and wind; near end Cclr Smith pointed out increases we'll see over next five years
maybe down list cd see percentages that wd leave us more hamstrung than we are now
think we shd hv some dialogue
in Fiscal Task Force; one we're using is ways and means of raising extra money and we're in a jam
a qualified 3%
what I'm asking is where and when are the efficiencies going to be found not looking at this 2008, 2009, etc
CAO: probably best asked, debated when we go through 2008 budget estimates
some of the very issues Cclr Sop is asking about
Mayor: the five-year budget is always rolling and changing; we know there is a gap; want to make sure public knows
Sop: maybe rolling is a problem
CAO & Mayor: that's the legislation
Sop: my point; know difficult to forecast, when are we ever going to come to terms
this obligation is for 3% [annual increase]; how do we work backwards
doesn't seem to [offer?] looking for efficiencies
CAO: the budget bylaw you have before you is past; Jan is about future, proper place to look
VV: hope we cd rescind to discuss
if discussing now
can't ... recently ...  the indexing for COL is 1%
don't see that, it's all 3%, 2.8%, having to look back to see
and we're looking at prop taxes, at least 3%
this is our last year, when I was concerned a year or two ago had time to fix it
now we don't have time to fix it
I really don't want us to pass this now, need to rescind and come to grips with it
I don't think ppl have translated this into [increase in taxes?]
we don't have ability to do this
Fiscal Task Force says ......  but this just says go on over and over
Mayor: it is critical that we must amend 2007 budget, in order to deal
the five-year financial plan begins in a month
you're quite right; purpose of this is to put the 2007 changes to bed
CAO: 2007, projections same but ...
Mayor: I hear Ccl's concern; have to deal with what's before us
[Adopted; Sop and VV opposed]
17.      Consent Agenda Items - Reports and Correspondence
=B7         Item 18 - Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-046 (2893 Marine   Drive - West Vancouver Presbyterian Church) (to set date for consideration on December 17, 2007); and
=B7        Item 19 - Correspondence List.
18.       Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-046 (2893 Marine Drive - West Vancouver Presbyterian Church): received for consideration on Monday, December 17, 2007.
19.       Correspondence List (File:  0120?24) [complete list in previous issue]
Sop: incredible fun Fire Rescue; Mayors Mussatto and Walton may be saying show me the money
JF: last Friday morning neither you nor Ccl Smith available so I accompanied Anne Mooi [staff], mtg with Minister Linda Reid and Superintendent and Sch Bd; interesting mtg
discussed applications for funding to devp a childcare house, like Gordon house
encouraging, suggested applying for more than one.... allocation of rooms
infant and toddler care, school care
three applications for the same location and if not successful in all applics, another opp in July if not granted in this go round
extremely impressed with the partnership between Sch Dist and M
was looking for championships; working well to see these realized; hope make it easier
Mayor: power of good policy
RD: reminder of Rodgers Crk 7pm Dec 4
Mayor: quickly, thank you
CR: thank you -- just v quickly
I want to thank you v much for all the efforts you went to, Mayor Goldsmith-Jones, wrt the Graham House, that was v much appreciated by everyone.  It's really great that we'll have more focus on this in future so we have to look at it as going forward, and I hope the new house, wch is supposed to be 7000sf, is not going to [require] blasting but that's what I've heard...  whatever we can do about that...    anyway it's v good, and your efforts are v much appreciated
the next thing is
when we're talking about ppl building these houses in the nbrhds, saying they have to consider nbrs, but what you have to remember is what came out of the Dundarave Nbrhd Assn -- Cclr Smith and Sop know about [the group/mtg] too -- is I don't think it's so much a problem with someone coming in to build (most ppl normally are v considerate and we have instances of that with nbrs), the problem we have now is new and hard to deal with, is that a lot of the houses being built are being built on spec, so their whole reason for building is to maximize what they're building and that's v hard to deal with, but that's what many of those differences are
and that's what the presentation in Sept [was about, to have the] Planning Dept look to interpreting the bylaws in such as way that it wd minimize the size.  There was some wording [in the bylaws] I understand that cd be interpreted in several ways; that cd be done
What they [DNA] asked for in September is that any interpretations that can be done be done in such a way to lower the height and the size, that that shd be the choice rather than giving them more decks and things
{See transcript of DNA's presentation to Ccl Sept 17; right now a deck that is open on one of the fours sides is not included in the FAR.}
the next thing
a lot of ppl conflate Community Benefits and Public/Cmnty Amenities and so I think in the context of listening to that, just think that those ppl mean one or the other... 
Already we had the Child Care group wch made excellent recommendations [ask] that that be included in Rodgers Crk and Ev Drive [devts]
I too will say that I'm v glad -- I know there might be problems, and you wanted to defer it to make it clearer, but this has been so long for the CBs -- at least if you might not think it's what you want in a step forward at least it was a step forward
I do know of the City of Vancouver getting 98% when it was a really huge one, I don't know of one getting 100%, but I do know they have a rule of thumb and we have to remember there's already a policy of negotiating something.  I don't know how you get through it but a lot of cmnties do it
there is a way of having in mind how much you're going to get
{I can't understand how it can be said to be illegal to ask for CBs but still to negotiate for them; many devprs have had pretty well a free ride so there will be great resistance to CBs but the cmnty deserves them!  maybe it's having a specific proportion that's the problem.}
thank you Cclr Day for mentioning the Rodgers Creek Open House is on tomorrow night; we appreciate that.  One of things I've been suggesting for some time is that you not have cmnty and WG mtgs on at the same time.  B/c tomorrow night is also the Nbrhd Character/Housing WG -- excellent presentation tonight -- but they meet tomorrow night at 6:30 as well, so if ppl wanted to go to see the nbrhd policy wch is v important and they wanted to go to the Rodgers Creek devt, they cdn't go to both so I hope you will look at making sure these things are maybe staggered, maybe the same night; [find] some way ppl can go to these important things
Mayor; thank you
JC: tomorrow night 5:30 Dund lights up and Ambleside at 6:30 at 13th & Marine.

=========  CCL AGENDA Dec= 10th (PH then Ccl Mtg)  ======== 

PUBLIC HEARING/MTG  (24th & Marine)
1.                  CALL TO ORDER
2.                  PUBLIC HEARING
            OFFICIAL COMMUNITY PLAN BYLAW NO. 4360, 2004, AMENDMENT BYLAW NO. 4534, 2007; AND ZONING BYLAW NO. 2200, 1968, AMENDMENT BYLAW NO. 4533, 2007 (both bylaws regarding 2396 and  2388 Marine Drive) (File: 1610-20-4533)
DEVELOPMENT PERMIT APPLICATION NO. 07-015 (re 2396 and 2388 Marine Drive)
The Director of Planning, Lands and Permits will describe the subject application with respect to the proposed bylaws and development permit application as listed above:
Applicant:  Karl Gustavson, Architect
Subject Lands:  2396 Marine Drive (Lot 1, Block A, District Lot 54, Plan 5442);  AND 2388 Marine Drive (Lot 1, Block G, District Lot 554, Plan 6699)
Purpose:  To provide for a low-rise building comprised of 15 residential units including 4 live work units fronting Marine Drive.  Parking would be provided under the building and accessed from the lane.
Proposed Official Community Plan Amendment: To remove 2388 Marine Drive from the Duplex Area and include it in the Dundarave Village Neighbourhood Centre.
Proposed Zoning Bylaw Amendment:  To rezone the subject lands from C1 (Commercial Zone) and R.T.1 (Two Family Zone) to a new CD2 Zone (Comprehensive Development Zone 2).
Proposed Development Permit:  To regulate form and character of development to build upon the local village character of Dundarave Village Neighbourhood Centre.
1)         Reports to Council received up to December 6, 2007: four from J Bailey, Cmnty Planner
2)         Correspondence received up to December 6, 2007: one from A McManamon
 On November 19, 2007 Council set the date for the Public Hearing and Public Meeting.  On November 23, 2007, 847 Notices were mailed to owners/occupiers within 100 metres of the subject site.  The statutory notice of Public Hearing and Public Meeting was published in the North Shore News on December 2 and 5, 2007.  The Municipal Clerk will note written submissions received for the December 10, 2007 Public Hearing/Public Meeting.
The applicant will be provided an opportunity to make a presentation on the subject application.
7.         PUBLIC INPUT 
If there is no further public input,
THAT all written and verbal submissions regarding Official Community Plan Bylaw No. 4360, 2004, Amendment Bylaw No. 4534, 2007 and Zoning Bylaw No. 2200, 1968, Amendment Bylaw No. 4533, 2007 and Development Permit Application No. 07-015 (all regarding 2396 and 2388 Marine Drive) up to and including December 10, 2007 be received and that the Public Hearing and Public Meeting be closed.
If Council wishes a further staff report, then:
THAT Staff report back to Council regarding the December 10, 2007 Public Hearing and Public Meeting re Official Community Plan Bylaw No. 4360, 2004, Amendment Bylaw No. 4534, 2007 and Zoning Bylaw No. 2200, 1968, Amendment Bylaw No. 4533, 2007 and Development Permit Application No. 07-015 (all regarding 2396 and 2388 Marine Drive); and that the Public Hearing and Public Meeting be adjourned to ________________.

3.         K. Pople, regarding Redevelopment Plans for Ambleside Business District
4.         Ambleside Town Centre Strategy - Policy Recommendations
            1.         Staff prepare implementation bylaws and documents in accordance with Appendix A of the November 19, 2007 report of the Urban Design Planner entitled "Ambleside Town Centre Strategy - Policy Recommendations"; and
            2.         These draft bylaws be presented to Council for public consideration prior                               to finalization and proceeding to a formal public hearing process.
5.         Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-039 (4102 Burkehill Road)
At the Nov 26 meeting, Council received the report dated Nov 16, 2007 from the Community Planner
RECOMMENDED: THAT all written and verbal submissions ... be received.
If Council wishes a further staff report, then:
RECOMMENDED: THAT Staff report back to Council regarding submissions
THAT Development Variance Permit Application No. 07-039 (4102 Burkehill Road), which would allow for an addition with a variance to the required Front Yards, be approved.
{why not say what the variance is? why do we have to dig to see how much of a variance is being asked???}
6.         District of West Vancouver Emergency Plan
        RECOMMENDED: receive and endorse the Municipal Emergency Plan
7.         2008 Preview Assessment Roll... received for information.
8.         Community Centre Non-Profit Society
1.                 The following members be appointed for the nominating committee representing the Community Centre Governance Working Group: Patti Bolton and Susan Evans;
2.                 The following members be appointed for the nominating committee representing Council: Bill Soprovich and John Clark;
3.                 The nominating committee arrange to meet in December to plan the nominating process including communications and notification.
9.         Motion to change start time for December 17, 2007 meeting: TO 6pm
10.      Consent Agenda Items - Reports and Correspondence
11.       Correspondence List
*  Requests for Delegation -- No items presented.
*  Action Required
(1)       S.E. Dowey, City Clerk - City of North Vancouver, November 22, 2007, regarding Funding Request from the North Shore Tourism Committee
Referred to Mayor and Council for consideration.
*  No Action Required (receipt only)
(2)       Committee and Board Meeting Minutes
(a)       West Vancouver Memorial Library Board - October 17, 2007
(3)       J. McIntyre, MLA - West Vancouver-Garibaldi, November 06, 2007, regarding Official Report of Debates of the Legislative Assembly - West Vancouver Spirit Square
(4)       (1) Email, November 26, 2007, regarding Please Save Hugo Ray Park
(5)       J.R. Cave, D. Zeitler and J. Burnett - Ambleside Business Association, November 27, 2007, regarding Invitation to Attend: Annual Lighting of the Holiday Tree, December 04, 2007
Previously distributed due to timing of event.
(6)       undated, 2007, regarding Parking Space Shortage at the New Community Centre
(7)       J. Cummins, MP Delta-Richmond East, November 27, 2007, regarding News Release: Report on the Implications of the Salmon Allocations in the Tsawwassen Treaty
(8)       A. Hazlewood, Provincial Ministry of Health, November 27, 2007, regarding Tobacco Control Regulation, British Columbia Reg 232/2007
(9)       L. Such, November 28, 2007, regarding Water Bills
(10)     C. Doucet, Councillor - City of Ottawa, undated, 2007, regarding Transfer of One [Per Cent] of the GST to Municipalities
(11)     November 29, 2007, regarding Erickson Shame, West Vancouver Rejects Pleas to Spare Erickson Home
(12)     J. Cummins, MP Delta-Richmond East, November 30, 2007, regarding News Release: Follow the Money - Report on Taxation and the Tsawwassen Treaty
(13)     December 02, 2007, regarding Erickson Follow up - Demolition a Cultural Disasters
(14)     December 02, 2007, regarding Firefighters - Reduction in Staff
*   Responses to Correspondence
(15)     B.A. Dozzi, Mgr, Roads/Transportation, Nov 28, 2007, re Reply regarding Water Pooling on Highway 1
(16)     B.A. Dozzi, Manager, Roads and Transportation, November 29, 2007, re Reply regarding Gordon Avenue and Neighbourhood Area Traffic and Streetscape Study
*   Responses to Questions in Question Period  --  No items presented.


Arthur Erickson Conservancy: Statement
                Subject:  Graham House  3 December 2007

The Arthur Erickson Conservancy (AEC) is the sole artist-authorized agency for the work of Arthur Erickson. The AEC is the only society authorized to represent Mr. Erickson  and we do that with due care.  Among its tasks as a non-profit organization, the Conservancy facilitates the conservation and stewardship of buildings and landscapes designed by Arthur Erickson through documentation, advocacy and education.  As part of our mandate, the AEC acts as advocates for the preservation of the integrity of Erickson buildings and landscapes, public and private; the AEC also encourages and  advises on the ongoing use, management, and stewardship of Erickson buildings and landscapes, public and private.  Our initials, A E C also stand for our mission: Advocacy, Education, and Conservation.

Arthur Erickson designed the Graham House in 1963. Like many Erickson houses of the 1960s, it experiments with form and material, meeting the challenge of the site, the rock cliffs of West Vancouver. Arthur Erickson has commented: "The David Graham house in 1963 launched my reputation as the architect you went to when you had an impossible site." Like the Baldwin House of the same period, or the Smith House, the house is an integral part of its site, to quote Erickson, "not a barrier to the landscape, but an invitation to it." The Graham house is also about balance -- balance in materials, the rough board and batten siding contrasting with the smooth beams, the balance of horizontal beams on a rocky ledge, the balance between up and down, horizontal and vertical, inside and outside, nature and design.  As one of the new ideas and expressions of the 1960s, it has also come to represent a particular moment in architectural design specific to the West Coast and to West Vancouver, which is home to many of the most significant of these thoughtful, innovative houses designed for the site, the climate, the quality of light, and the way one might actually live in a house. The Graham House was among the first to use roofs to extend living areas -- in 1963!

As part of the Erickson legacy, the Graham House is important as an example of a new kind of thinking about the domestic house and its relationship to site conceived as an integral part of the design, a boldness, freshness and sympathy with the natural environment for which Erickson has become known throughout the world.  It is the only Vancouver house featured in LIFE magazine (in a four-page article titled "Stack of Wood Crystals" in 1968).  In Erickson's oeuvre, its experimentation with an holistic, natural,rugged, and transparent expression anticipates more sophisticated works such as the Helmut and Hildegard Eppich House and the Smith House II, the latter of which recently received the RAIC 2007 Prix du XXe siecle recognizing its "enduring excellence and national significance to Canadian architecture," an award recently celebrated by a November reception hosted by the AEC.  As part of our architectural heritage, particularly the mid-modern residential architecture that gives West Vancouver its distinct character, the Graham House plays a pivotal role and offers lessons to generations of architects.  It contributes to the heritage of place as well as our architectural heritage, which we are learning to value as part of a Canadian history and identity.

Naturally, the AEC is concerned with the preservation and conservation of Erickson houses, in this instance the Graham House.  If the Graham House could be "saved", then saving it also means conserving its integrity as an Erickson house.  In other words, if the house is to bear the Erickson name as its architect, then it must be true to the original design. Over the years, the Graham House has changed significantly through major alterations and additions, expanding from its original 3500 square feet to 6000 square feet, additions all made independently of Arthur Erickson. The house of 2007 is not the house of 1963 that is seen in the often-published Ezra Stoller photograph. That house has not existed for many years. While some of the elements of the original house are still visible, especially the living room and master bedroom, which project the furthest over the cliff edge and therefore were the most difficult to alter, the integrity of the building as an Erickson house has been compromised.  Made of temporal materials and on an exposed site, after 45 years its condition has also suffered. Finally, the house is in pre-demolition condition.  The owners have reviewed options for conservation but for a variety of reasons have chosen to replace it to meet their future needs.

Any loss of an Erickson composition is a loss, keenly felt. "Demolition is forever".  The AEC understands that the Graham House has been altered over the years to meet the changing needs of its owners, whose rights we must respect.  As with all Erickson homeowners, we look for sensitivity to the architecture and encourage thoughtful, informed stewardship.  Erickson homes have largely enjoyed that care. This is a period of transition for many of Erickson's works, public and private.  Recently, the AEC's founder successfully campaigned to save the Evergreen Building from possible demolition, working with the Vancouver Heritage Commission and the City of Vancouver, making the Evergreen the first Vancouver building designated in the architect's lifetime.  It is currently being restored under a Heritage Revitalization Agreement, following a detailed Conservation Plan.  We have contributed to a number of Statements of Significance and Conservation Plans on Erickson buildings, adding them to the National Historic Register, including the Baldwin House on Deer Lake in Burnaby (designated) and the Home Lumber building in Saanich.  Recently, we helped to prepare the Statements of Significance on the Macmillan Bloedel Building for the City of Vancouver and Simon Fraser University for the City of Burnaby.  We are working on heritage recognition and protection for Robson Square and the Museum of Anthropology, both also in transitional periods.

Three Erickson homes have also recently changed ownership, passing to those whose passion for the work makes them caring stewards. The AEC is working with Erickson homeowners, long-term patrons and new owners alike, providing advice, documentation, and support.  An Erickson client and homeowner is a founding member of the Board of Directors and another is an advisor. Working with the AEC, Doug Field, owner/restorer of the Filberg House in Comox, BC is taking a hard look at ways to protect the structure and integrity of this building and its grounds for generations to follow. We strive for respectful, supportive, and collaborative relationships with Erickson homeowners, while respecting their individual needs. We also advocate for federal, provincial, and municipal programs that recognize the value of our cultural heritage and which provide incentives and support for heritage conservation.

The AEC has consulted with the Mayor and District of West Vancouver and the owner's representative, offering documentation and advice, while reviewing options for the Graham House, including finally, in the interests of sustainability, the recycling of any materials.  We have accepted that this expanded house has lost much of its primary integrity as an Erickson house; that its condition is beyond what could be professionally accepted as "restoration" under the Standards and Guidelines for the Preservation of Historic Sites in Canada, since the original house would require a degree of "replication" rather than restoration and even this would depend upon a deeply committed owner; and, finally, that it does not meet its current family's needs.  We also do not believe that the spirit of experimentation and delight, and the respect for place, that are integral to an Erickson design can be duplicated elsewhere - that would be artificial and anathematic to its raison d'etre and spirit.  Moving the house is also  counter to the spirit of place.  First, we find that there is not enough left integral to the original house that could be moved; secondly, it would no longer be the house that Erickson designed but something else entirely.  While we appreciate the sentiment, we have concluded that moving the house is not a viable option.  Similarly, we have respectfully declined any option to create any type of "memorial" on the site.

 In losing the Graham House, we will have lost an important part of the Erickson legacy  that we believe some 20 or 30 years from now people will want to see intact. As citizens, we are coming to value this legacy and to develop programs that will help to protect and celebrate our unique architectural heritage.  That is the bigger picture.  The Graham House may be a cautionary tale for the District of West Vancouver. The AEC has lent its support to the District in establishing its Community Heritage Register and developing a strong, viable heritage management program. The AEC looks forward to working with the District of West Vancouver with respect to its inventory of Erickson- designed homes and can offer practical, informative support to the District and Erickson homeowners alike.

Canada is a young country and Canadians are just learning to value its architectural and cultural heritage, designing conservation policies and programs. The desire for cultural awareness arises from specific, real places that have found their way into [people's] hearts and minds.  The Graham House is obviously one of those places.  It may be a galvanizing moment in our history on the West Coast.  The AEC is encouraged to see so many citizens interested in Erickson's work, even a private family home that can only be glimpsed from the end of a secluded road or by boat.  Indeed, it is this passionate belief in the value of the Erickson legacy that has created the AEC itself.

[While we regret] its loss, the Graham House will live now in memory and in documentation for others to study in the future.  The AEC is striving to document all of Erickson's works and encourages stewardship of Erickson buildings and landscapes, public and private. We invite anyone who wishes to contribute to these efforts or join our mailing list to contact us at info@arthurericksonconversancy.com.
Cheryl Cooper
Founder + Chair, Arthur Erickson Conservancy  / cheryl@arthurericksonconservancy.com
Dear Readers:
Keep in mind that alterations and changes were made to the house by the current owner and that tenants were in the house until about three months ago (by now four months, I suppose).  Any change was on this owner's watch.  Apparently also, dismantling was done without either a building or demolition permit.
Owners, with much less money than this one (reportedly of the 30th wealthiest family in Canada) have maintained and restored heritage homes, homes not even designated, in WV.
Profound disappointment given the options and incentives offered.  The AEC obviously acquiesced and now are trying to salvage the rest of Erickson's legacy in WV.
Ccl: pls act.
Also, wd give some satisfaction if they cd at least prohibit any blasting on this site Erickson developed following 'design with nature', a key element of our recent OCP.

>>>  Remember Dec 1st? Weather Alert for Vancouver!
Chilled Vancouver commuters faced their second day of winter hell today, as an additional =BC centimetre of the peculiar white stuff fell, bringing the Lower Mainland to its knees and causing millions of dollars' worth of damage to the marijuana crops.
Scientists suspect that the substance is some form of frozen water particles and experts from Saskatchewan are being flown in.
With temperatures dipping to the almost but not quite near zero mark, Vancouverites were warned to double insulate their lattes before venturing out.
Vancouver police recommended that people stay inside except for emergencies, such as running out of espresso or biscotti to see them through Vancouver's most terrible storm to date.
The local Canadian Tire reported that they had completely sold out of fur lined sandals.
Drivers were cautioned to put their convertible tops up, and several have been shocked to learn that their SUV's actually have four-wheel drive, although most have no idea how to use it.
Weary commuters faced soggy sushi, and the threat of frozen breast implants.
Dr. John Blatherwick, of the Coastal Health Authority reassured everyone that most breast implants were perfectly safe to 25 below.
"The government has to do something," snarled an angry Trevor Warburton. "I didn't pay $850,000 for my bachelor condo in the West End so I could sit around and be treated like someone from Toronto."

===  QUOTATIONS on Language  ===

A mass of Latin words falls upon the facts like soft snow, blurring the outline and covering up all the details. The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. When there is a gap between one's real and one's declared aims, one turns as it were instinctively to long words and exhausted idioms, like a cuttlefish spurting out ink. In our age there is no such thing as "keeping out of politics". All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer.
                        -- George Orwell, writer (1903-1950)

(1908 - 1999) Quentin Crisp's observations about euphemisms:
Euphemisms are not, as many young people think, useless verbiage for that which can and should be said bluntly; they are like secret agents on a delicate mission, they must airily pass by a stinking mess with barely so much as a nod of the head, make their point of constructive criticism and continue on in calm forbearance.  Euphemisms are unpleasant truths wearing diplomatic cologne.

Words are timeless. You should utter them or write them with a knowledge of their timelessness.
                        -- Khalil Gibran, mystic, poet, and artist (1883-1931)