WVM2009-27
Ccl Mtg NOTES Dec 7
AGENDA Dec 14
Calendar to Dec 31
by
Carolanne Reynolds, Editor
www.WestVan.org
Hope Yule have a punderful Christmas!
In this winter punderland, here's your Christmas
challenge:
What
do you call it when your Christmas tree explodes?
What's the difference between a one-winged angel and a
two-winged angel?
What
do you call a holy man bereft of change?
and
a quiet mediaeval armour-wearer?
What
does Santa Claus do with his three gardens?
IN THIS ISSUE:
= MAIN ITEMS Dec 14th: Housing Pilot Projects
(2614 Ottawa, 6801 Hycroft); 2009 Budget Amendment
Bylaw; Fees and Charges Review/Bylaw; Utility Fees -- Solid Waste ($$$
way way up!), Water, Sewer; Ccl/Cmte apptmts; Sp Ccl Mtg
8:30am Fri Dec 18; Adoption of bylaws for HBBiz and Sec Stes; DVPs:
1313 Fulton Jan 11; 4726 Woodvalley Jan 25.
= Vive le Canada (WV Map); ANIMALWATCH (Orangutan
and Dog; Tigers, etc); from the EDITOR'S DESK (Finance Cmte Dance of
the Seven Veils, Budget??? ); WVPD (Operation Red Nose); UPDATES
(AGMs for WRA and ADRA -- new boards of directors)
= CALENDAR to Dec 31st; CULTUREWATCH
= Ccl Mtg NOTES Dec 7th: Seniors' Ctr Report;
Civic Site parking; Climate Action WG; Technical Tour of Sweden
report; 2010 Preview Assessment Roll (did yours to up or down?);
Utilities Infrastructure Management (look for a big $$$ jump in
utility fees!); Dundarave Signage ($7K); Second and
third readings for HBBiz and Sec Stes (staff to report on fees);
2009 Budget Amendment (~$300K more! and staff recommend introduced and
all three readings but was deferred); DVPs to be heard Jan 11 on 6165
Gleneagles and 1313 Fulton even though apparently what required a
permit has already been built!; Correspondence -- talked about moorage
but not about adherence to the mtg requirements of the Cmnty
Charter (or rather lack of)
= Ccl Mtg Agenda Dec 14th
= BEERWATCH (Space Barley); NEWSWATCH (living with no
electricity, little water?); BOOKWATCH (Grothe and Garg/AWAD); MAIKU
(hint of snow?); Quotations and Christmas Puns
=== Vive le Canada
===
Really enjoying the torch's trip showing us all those different
parts of Canada.
Back here at home, here's map of WV:
http://www.westvancouver.ca/Residents/Level2.aspx?id=104&utm_source=redirect&utm_campaign=map
Providing access to
both static maps and WestMAP; a dynamic tool providing a window into
West Vancouver's GIS
(Geographical
Information System)
=== ANIMALWATCH ===
Videos at the tiger sanctuary, Myrtle Beach, SC
- Orangutan and Dog:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QByHat2BJLs
- The Cat family:
http://www.myrtlebeachsafari.com/
=== from the EDITOR'S DESK
===
> FINANCE CMTE -- Smoke and Mirrors.....
And the games continue!
A Finance Cmte mtg (not on FCmte webpage and NOT on DWV Calendar)
was held Wed Dec 9 at 3pm, same for FCmte mtg 1pm Fri Dec 11 -- so
not only both closed but also no notification to be held (and all mtgs
by legislation must start open and then a vote on whether or not to
close depending on topic b/c there are options re topic, not
automatically in camera).
How many voters recall the candidates' commitment to OPEN and
TRANSPARENT govt?
How many have noticed closed mtgs and asked those they supported
about this apparent lack of keeping a promise?
Is the proof of the pudding in the eating when the bowl has a
locked-down cover? Oh those tempting aromas!
> BUDGET 2010
Remember that every expenditure of about $400K represents about
1% of the budget.
=== WVPD ===
Operation Red Nose Launches This
Weekend
Date: 2009 December 11 Contact: Cst Jeff
Palmer Telephone:
604-925-7348
The Christmas Counter Attack on impaired drivers is continuing
and West Vancouver Police urge all drivers to plan safe alternatives
to get home.
Holiday revellers should consider non-drinking designated
drivers, transit, or taxis.
North Shore residents have the additional option of Operation Red
Nose beginning this weekend.
The four North Shore Rotary Clubs are providing "safe rides
home" on Dec. 11, 12, 18, 19, and 31, between 9pm and 3am.
A team of three volunteers will drive you and your car home for
free. Donations are welcome; all proceeds support North Shore youth
programs.
If you need a safe ride home this holiday season, call Operation
Red Nose at 604-619-0942.
For more details go to www.rotarywestvancouversunrise.org or
email Northshore@operationrednose.com
If you would like to volunteer, Operation Red Nose is looking for
drivers, escort drivers, or navigators. You'll help keep our streets
safe. And Operation Red Nose will enter your name in a draw to attend
the Quebec Carnaval in 2010.
Email ORNVolunteer@gmail.com or check the web site
www.rotarywestvancouversunrise.org
If you observe any vehicle being driven in a manner that makes
you suspect the driver is impaired, West Vancouver Police encourage
you to immediately call 911 for a police response.
>>> IN CASE OF EMERGENCY CALL
9-1-1
A cash reward of up to $2,000 will be paid
for any information that leads to an arrest and charge. If you have
any information please call Crime Stoppers at: 1-800-222-TIPS
(8477) or by visiting the Crime Stoppers website.
=== UPDATES ===
* Ccl Mtgs 2009 RIP?:
The Dec 14 ccl was to be the last before Jan 11 but b/c of three
readings of some budget/utility bylaws that must be passed by the end
of the year, there has to be another mtg for adoption -- that means
Dec 18 will be the last, at 8:30am, and your last opportunity to speak
to Ccl in 2009!
* AGMs / New Boards
ADRA: Prez, Gordon Ward Hall; VP, Keith Pople; Treasurer, Ray
Richards; Secretary, Carolanne Reynolds; Director, Dick O'Callaghan;
Past Prez, ex-officio, Elaine Fonseca
WRA: Co-Chairs, Aline Brown and Bruce McArthur; Treasurer, Mary
Bayes; Directors: Barb Pettit, Dave Patrick, Liz Byrd, Sue Rowan,
Jeanette Keller
== CALENDAR to Dec 31st
=====
{Pls note that ALL mtgs are at M
Hall (usually in the MFCR, Main Floor Conference Room, but
sometimes in the chamber) unless indicated otherwise.
Additions and changes can occur at any time so best to check the DWV
website calendar wrt cmtes and WGs that are of interest to you.
Often cmte/WG mtgs are not posted or confirmed until a couple of days
beforehand so this is a moving target!}
Dec 3rd CEC mtg deferred to Jan 14; Strategic Transportation
Planning WG Dec 9 added
~~~ DUNDARAVE FESTIVAL
OF LIGHTS; Nov 28 to Jan 6 ~~~
including Dundarave Nativity Sat Dec 5; Music in Dundarave
Village Dec 12; Festival Bonfire Night Dec 20. For
details, see: http://festivaloflights.weebly.com/
= Wednesday Dec 16th
~ 5pm ~
Strategic Transportation Plan WG in Mtn Room of Cmnty Ctr
~ 6pm ~
Child Care WG mtg [CANCELLED]
= Thursday Dec 17th ~ 6pm ~ NSh Family Court /
Youth Justice Cmte at DNV M Hall [CANCELLED]
= Friday Dec 18th ~ 3:15pm ~ free cmnty
concert in the atrium of the Cmnty Ctr
= Sunday Dec 20th
~
3pm ~ Angels and All That Jazz at St Francis in the Wood, 4773
Piccadilly
reVive Noelle
with Peter Vanderhorst; $15 refreshments included; ph 922
3135
~
7pm ~ West Vancouver Bonfire and Carol Ships at Dundarave
Beach
* * * no
news yet about new year's eve in WV * * *
+++ WV MEMORIAL LIBRARY
+++
- for Events and Programs: http://www.westvanlibrary.ca/index.php?page=5
- for Event Calendar: http://www.westvanlibrary.ca/event/calendar.php
= Philosophers' Cafe -- Thursday
Dec 17
How are Christmas celebrations enhanced or diminished without
Christmas presents? Join us 10:30am - 12:30pm in the Elizabeth Musto
room to discuss. No registration required. Admission $5
= My West Vancouver - A Photo
Contest
The Library's
first annual "My West Vancouver" photo contest! You are
invited to submit your photos of West Vancouver that capture the
spirit and beauty of the place we live and love.
Submission deadline: 3pm Friday Dec 18
* Nov 20 - Dec 19 -- The Ferry Building
Gallery invites you to "GREAT STUFF"
An exhibition and sale of unique crafts, fine artwork, and
distinctive gifts at affordable prices from over 40 of the best
artists and artisans, just in time for the Christmas shopper!
Special Gallery Hours: 10am -
6pm; late Friday shopping until 8pm; closed
Monday.
* FBG closed Dec 20 to Jan 4; reopening Jan 12
= December 3 - 20 -- "Seeing Red"
VISUALS, a group of
twenty-eight (28) talented Squamish and North Shore artists offering a
unique Christmas exhibit of art work in all mediums and all sizes,
with prices that will make each piece easily accessible for purchase
for that special friend or family member. Join us for the Holiday
season and buy a piece of original Canadian art! Happy
Holidays!
Opening
Reception: SAT Dec 5th from 2:30 - 4:30pm
November 10 to December
23
Greetings from Friends: Mid-Century
Art Cards 1945 - 1975
showcases a collection of greeting cards, drawings, and prints
designed by prominent regional artists and architects, including B.C.
Binning, Gordon Smith, Alistair Bell, Don Jarvis, Jack Shadbolt,
Arthur Erickson, and others. The cards reveal an interconnected social
network among artists and architects who were the vanguard of the
region's art and design scene. The intimate and compact format of a
limited-edition artist greeting lends itself well to experimentation
and humour.
BC Binning: Works from the
Collection
features artwork donated to the Museum by the Estate of Jessie Binning
in 2008. Bertram Charles Binning was a central figure in the
development of regional mid-century art and design; in 1971 he was
honoured with the Order of Canada. BC Binning, born in Medicine Hat,
Alberta, grew up in Vancouver. He taught at the Vancouver School of
Art and the School of Architecture at the University of British
Columbia where he also founded the Department of Fine Arts. The
tectonics of the North Shore topography became the primary element
driving Binning's graphic style. Early in his career Binning chose
drawing as primary mode of expression, with a simple and precise line
as its driving force. The majority of the works in BC Binning:
Works from the Collection come from this exciting period in
Binning's practice.
+++ KAY MEEK CENTRE
+++
o To get onto the mail list: the
simplest method is to call the box office (913 3634) or email
tickets@kaymeekcentre.com
Vancouver Youth Symphony Orchestra - Sun
Dec 13 at 7:30pm
Aliqua presents 'All I Want' Christmas
album release) - Mon Dec 14 at 7:30pm
Fusion Orchestra with Fereshteh Farmand, Fri Dec
18 at 8pm
VSO, A Traditional Christmas with
Christopher Gaze and UBC Opera Ensemble, Sat Dec 19 at 4 &
7:30pm
+++ ROYAL CANADIAN LEGION BRANCH 60, West
Vancouver +++
The Winter Issue of "The Torch"
is now available.
To view the newsletter, just click the
following link for direct access:
Best regards,
Janice Mackay-Smith, The Torch
>>>
Hi Everyone!
Soon it will be New
Year's Eve, and if you do not already have plans, maybe you will
consider coming down to Branch 60 to ring in 2010! We had a sellout
crowd of 70 people last year, and a good time was had by
all!
At 8pm
on Thursday, December 31st, the party begins! (Please note the lounge will be closed between 7 and
8pm for setting up).
For $25 there will
be party favours, appetizers, dancing to the music of Ray O'Toole, and
a champagne toast at midnight. Tickets are now on sale
behind the lounge bar.
Merry
Christmas to you all, and a healthy, happy, prosperous, New
Year!
+++ WV CHAMBER OF COMMERCE
+++ http://www.westvanchamber.com
Join us for this Special
Olympic Breakfast with Mayor Pamela Goldsmith-Jones who will share
plans for the Games and beyond. Also included in this discussion
will be new Chief of Police Peter Lepine who will discuss security
during the Games.
~ 7:30 - 9am
~ Wednesday January 20th, 2010 -- The Capilano Golf and Country
Club
Sponsored by the West
Vancouver Community Foundation.
Come Celebrate West Vancouver as an Olympic Venue City!
We will have special Olympic give-a-ways and a door
prize!
Please RSVP by Thursday January 14th,
5:00pm on our secure website www.westvanchamber.com or call 604
926-6614. Our host, Capilano Golf and Country Club, requires advance
number for preparation.
Please also note that we are
unable to give a refund without 48 hours' notification; however a
delegate substitution is welcome at any time.
=== CULTUREWATCH
===
*
THEATRE
+ PRESENTATION
HOUSE -- Panto Wars,
May the Farce be With You to Dec 20, tix 990 3474
+ HENDRY HALL
-- Snow White and the Seven
Dwarfs on weekends to Dec 20; tix 983 2633
+ THE ARTS CLUB (687
1644)
Irving Berlin's White Christmas at the
Stanley until Dec 27
It's a Wonderful
Life on Granville Island until Jan 2
+ VANCOUVER
PLAYHOUSE -- Dirty
Rotten Scoundrels until Dec 27; tix 873
3311
*
MUSIC + VSO
-- See www.vancouversymphony.ca and their visit to KMC Dec
19
===== CCL MTG NOTES Dec
7th =====
[7:10] Mayor: Call to order
1. APPROVAL OF AGENDA
=85 adding to item 4 a report regarding Civic Site
Parking Study;
=85 adding to item 5 a report re Status Report on the
Progress of the Climate Action Working Group;
=85 moving Item 7 to be considered immediately following
Item 4;
=85 withdrawing Items 15, 19, and 20;
=85 withdrawing Item 24 on the Consent
Agenda;
=85 adding to Correspondence List items (8.1), (20.1),
(24.1), and (27.1)
2. ADOPTION OF MINUTES
DELEGATIONS
3. West Vancouver Seniors' Activity Centre
(File: 0115-20-SACA1) PowerPoint presentation to be
provided.
Sop: Ed Collins, Chair, welcome
EC: I need a few minutes to update my agenda
[chuckles]
13K are 60 or over; 3,100 mbrs, did have more
last year 607 volunteered 50,164 hours -- over half our
budget, quarter million dollars
oldest active volunteer celebrated her 99th birthday
plsd to help with Cmnty Day; shuttle service going and does more
now than Srs' Ctr, also to doctor, shopping, great success, 80 ppl a
day; raised funds from donations and partnership
had a strategic planning workshop in June with a facilitator,
came up with ideas for growth
Challenges included seemed to be closed (b/c of construction),
been told cladding finished by Christmas, hope this Christmas
Decline in mbrship due to access barriers, lack of parking,
construction (perception [SAC] closed); economy (some come to me
hoping we'll keep the costs down -- for some $50 a lot of money) myth
that we are an 'old folks' home' (heard, oh I'm not old enough) but
it's an activity ctr.
Wanna be the best activity ctr, to be No. 1: visible, accessible,
vibrant, busy active where emphasis on ACTIVITY not senior;
hope to deal with shut-ins; links prog with Silver Harbour
Thank all of you for the help you've given to the ctr
personally want to thank the board, working with them the past
year, and mbrs; Anne and her crew, cdn't be better
Adv Bd, four are concluding their three-year term; going to miss
some of the action but will find something to do.
Want to thank volunteers again.
Sop: Incredible journey over past year, raising of funds for the
shuttle
attended opening with you Madam Mayor at Amica re shuttle, one of
the sponsors
re shut-ins -- ability to pick up and deliver
step up to the plate; have serious look, TransLink; more emphasis
on sponsorships
fundraising, to be congratulated; start to open eyes, how much
demand -- these ppl have paid taxes for years; gotta be some
relaxation of the pressures
Mayor: partnership with Amica, way of facing new challenge; good
for that initiative, the shuttle bus wch we put on a temporary basis
but so well-received continuing
ME: I'm concerned about the declining mbrship -- wonder if we
have done as much as we can
have we offered facilities in Tidings? some stones not turned
ver?
EC: am sure ways to explore some ideas, can talk with you
later
we've received a lot of support from this Ccl, reluctant to ask
b/c you've done a lot
The shuttle bus is an interesting example. Came in b/c no
parking but now even if parking resolved, can't let go b/c still
needed
13,000 out there, needed, we're getting them
Sop: congratulations, great year, thank you for your report
EC: don't know who will be sitting here next year in my place but
same things.
Mayor: stick around for next item on parking at the civic
site!
REPORTS
4. Civic Site Parking (File: 2100-01) --
Information to be provided.
Anne Mooi, Dir/Parks: Leanne and Sue will tell you about the
changes
Sue Ketler: Civic Site Improvements
312 parking stalls Feb 2009
draft parking plan presented to cmnty through a consultation
process
Key Principles [slide]
efficiency, functionality, safe and effective access, needs of
specialized user groups, identified opps and evaluated options,
etc
Key Improvements [slide]
add 19 new stalls; more coordinated approach; in past only those
with disabilities addressed; add families with strollers, etc
North Plaza Surface Lot slide [pointing with explanations];
Underground North and South Parkades; East Surface Lot, Seniors' Ctr
Surface lot; Gordon Avenue add'l stalls (four to six)
Underway shortly, will monitor, maybe add'l on 21st St
Sop: thank you for the presentation
a citizen asked me a question at Transportation re WG -- how many
stalls for Vanc Coastal Health
Ans: 20
Sop: for 20 years then; any staff?
Ans: only if start early or go late b/c of safety.
MS: have we ever looked into possibility of parallel parking on
north side of Marine Drive, in front of srs' and cmnty ctrs?
RF, Dir/Engg: has come up look at north curb or configurations,
also opps to improve pedestrian environment; costs; looking at
aligning before incurring capital dollars
MS: what capital dollars if parking along Marine 21st to
22nd?
RF: Maybe Mr Brent Dozzi can answer
BD: believe suggestion wd require decommissioning of one lane and
wd have to look at traffic flow in that area. Had thought
widening and add sidewalk so wdn't lose a lane. Wd have to look
at capacity of Marine Dr.
Mayor: this does require monitoring; we look forward to being
kept abreast
now moving to Item 7
7:41
RECOMMENDED:
THAT the report dated November 16, 2009 from the
Director, Engineering & Transportation entitled, "SymbioCity
Learning Exchange and Technical Tour of Sweden" be received for
information.
TP: this is very fun [sic]; you guys look nice from here!
We have CAWG and Bill 27 tonight
SLIDES -- Sweden understands
Slide #1 [Hammarby] Sjolstad ferry
Sweden views waste as a valuable
resource; they understand the synergies between the economy and the
environment and use this knowledge in their urban developments. In
fact, one of the key differences between Canada and Sweden is [that]
waste streams and energy are an integral part of urban planning, this
saves money and resources over the long term and creates livable urban
communities.
Slide #2
We are one planet and moving [toward
nine] billion passengers, for the first time in history we are more
urban than rural. The
circles demonstrate the environmental challenges we face as our urban
areas grow. Traffic congestion, soil depletion, wasted resources to
landfills, air pollution to name a few; clearly we cannot sustain this
type of growth without a new approach.
The Swedish solution to urban growth
and resource depletion is holistic and sustainable, finding synergies
in urban functions that unlock their efficiency and are profitable.
Many of the solutions are scalable to suit a single home, small
developments, and beyond. The [Swedes'] approach is both
{?} practical, entrepreneurial, collaborative, and quietly
determined.
Slide #3 Historical context
In the seventies, Sweden was the
most oil dependent country in the industrial world.
The oil crisis of the early
seventies forced Sweden to step back and see the big picture.
Crisis turned out to be an opportunity that in reflection has made
them a more resilient country and certainly leaders in the new
economy.
So after three decades of effort
devoted to expanding district energy systems, implementing aggressive
conservation programs, and making a commitment to turn waste into
energy Sweden is within striking distance of oil
independence.
(70% in 1970 to 32% today)
For example, Stockholm is
aiming for a long term target to become fossil fuel free by
2050.
Slide #4
So does strong environmental
legislation kill the economy? The Swedes would say no. In fact
this graph demonstrates the decoupling of economic growth to GHG
emissions.
GHG emissions fell by 9% as the
economy grew by 48%, exceeding Kyoto targets.
When Sweden introduced a carbon tax
in 1991 they started a power shift that has been very effective [and]
impressive. They get 40% of [their] energy from renewable and
aim to reach 50% in ten years.
The Swedish innovation that has come
from treating waste as resources is very impressive as well as very
profitable.
...
carbon tax started oil shift; 40% from renewables
incredible cooperation at all political levels
pass on to Dir of Engg for more technical
RF: The Hammarby model
Stockholm's bid for Games in 2002; weren't successful but
continued with
[slides with explanation] biofuel; water; energy; waste
SymbioCity principle: transit, sewage, garbage colln, brought
together in integrated way
engaged both public and private stakeholders to participate
and facilitate.
The Framtiden Group
commended for entrepreneurial approach -- it's entirely owned
by municipalities and gotten into devt, parkades, etc
Fun things of the time Cclr Panz and I spent there -- slides of
alternative transportation, cycles, tricycles so front for a couple of
kids, one parking space = four bicycles; hybrid plug-ins; slide of
massing, green court areas; green buildings with external cladding of
voltaic cells and triple glazing; recycling -- put down pipes that
have sensors that transport to where sorted; bin collects brown waste
and food scraps that breaks down in about a month then residents can
use on their gardens; Energy -- sewage to plant to biofuel and
provided for whole fleet of buses; energy recovery; refuse burned --
hot with scrubbers, showing turbine; Wind Turbines income plus
heating.
Wanted to show some of what we learned in our trip.
Slide of Ambleside Town Ctr -- cd be integrated, inspired to take
action here
Mayor: cd you say something about the workshop this
week?
RF: Stephen Jenkins here and he's organizing it
SJ: hope you can make; shd be exciting; ties together
foreshore work, seawall adaptation work, infrastructure work
large scale energy exchange loops
17th, redevt around Safeway; Wetmore site up for devt; blue sky
work; life style
going to be well-attended from prov
Mayor: Ccl Lewis wd like to know date
SJ: Wed 8am to 3pm; nuts and bolts in first two hours; Cmnty
Ctr Music Room
7:59
{So glad the Mayor asked about this workshop otherwise
who'd have known about it? It's not on the CAWG webpage and it's
not on the DWV Calendar!}
THEN
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. The report from the Manager of Sustainability
titled "Status Report on the Progress of the Climate Action Working
Group", dated November 22, 2009 be received for
information.
2. The greenhouse gas reduction targets of, at
least a 33% reduction below 2007 levels by 2020 and at least an 80%
reduction by 2050, as proposed by the province be considered by the
Climate Action Working Group to determine how they can be achieved in
West Vancouver; and
3. Staff, in consultation with the CAWG, consult
with the community on these proposed targets prior to preparing and
present a proposed Official Community Plan amendment on targets for
the reduction of greenhouse gas emissions, and policies and actions
proposed with respect to achieving the targets, as required under the
Local Government Act, Section 877(3), known as Bill 27.
Mayor: Mr Leigh, have you [remarks/presentation]?
BL: no, just
Malcolm Metcalfe: have never been on a cmte before and thank you
for opp
retired ten years ago intending to relax and hobby biz and turned
out to be more
now largest donor of credits to VANOC
thanks for CAWG; v important; one of the biggest threats facing
mankind
most in WV want to do the right thing, but has to be
explained
setting targets; has to be managed and reported
turn over to Matt Alexander
MA: WV resident for 25 years; here to give you an update; eight
mbrs
[NAMED; supported by staff]
{So I thought I'd put in the info from the WG's
webpage:
Membership
Council Member
- Councillor Trish Panz
Citizen Members -
Matt Alexander; Nora Gambioli, (Co-Chair); Malcolm Metcalfe; Freda
Pagani, (Co-Chair); Michael Rosen; Adrian Rowland; Stephen Sheppard;
Walter Thorneloe
Staff Liaison
- Brent
Leigh,
Deputy CAO; Stephen Jenkins, Manager Environment &
Sustainability
Purpose
The purpose of the
Climate Action Working Group is to prepare and implement a Climate
Action Plan for the community and the commercial and municipal
operations in West Vancouver.
For all their info, go to:
http://www.westvancouver.ca/Government/Level3.aspx?id=16928 }
SLIDES: The Model for Change is Shifting
local, prov mandating gas emissions
ppl looking to how can I make a difference
The Mandate of CAWG [slide]
intended to be done by Dec but think we're going to continue to
March
programs to help move this forward
nurture and measure to see if accomplishing -- see
flowchart
GHG Emissions Inventories - 2007 [slide]
98.7% from us, you and me
let's target in on the buildings; let's adopt the GHG standards
as put out by the prov
80% reduction by 2050 wait to 2049 is what we call the
hockey-stick effect
concept: "backcasting" -- got us to a lot of things
have to be done in near future to reach these goals
Houses: the average WV house emits about nine tons of carbon, the
majority from gas
Malcolm has educated me -- changing light bulbs to CF but no
difference b/c electricity in BC is clean
{Your editor has received further information on this b/c
it's not quite correct: although most of BC's electrical power comes
from hydro, the Burrard Thermal Generating Plant is used to top-up the
supply during peak usage periods or outages at other facilities. It
burns natural gas and can have a significant GHG footprint if running
at capacity (which, fortunately, it rarely does).}
so doesn't really affect GHG
have to look at things in a local context
[EXAMPLE here on slide]
need to migrate away from gas so down to two tons by 2050
magnitude of challenge
16,000 dwellings in WV, almost 10,000 sgl-fam homes, growth
adding about 2-300 homes per year for next 20 years or so
need to get 10% of our homes upgraded per year so they
save 30% of their emissions
significant change
80% of the bldgs that are going to be here in 2050 are here
today; so new not going to solve the problem
Vehicle Emissions; focused less in WV -- smaller cars, walk, bus,
cycle
Next Steps for CAWG: report by March, link up with prov; 80% by
2050
link up with other cmnties easier
key deliverables: measurable, manageable, and
reportable
now want to introduce Wendy LeBreton
WLB: here to explain what Bill 27 is; BC legislation
43% of emissions under Ms so all must identify by May of
2010
OCP Policies contribute to Climate Action
Four Examples [slide]
District's OCP relatively new, adopted 2004
OCP "Gap Analysis"
Rodgers Creek is a leading edge devt but there are some gaps so
we urge a gap analysis, edits and new OCP policies
Proposed OCP Amendment Process [slide]: timeline from now to
March with two cmnty mtgs
Mayor: presentation from WG and presentation on Bill 27; if you
have a question on Bill 27 fine, but we are going to deal with Item 5
first
Sop: I'm on positive side, re Bill 17
Mayor: Bill 27
Sop: Bill 27; all on board with vehicles etc, but we're past, did
pesticide
as you evolve you'll come to your destination
want to stay positive but going into a 'requirement' under OCP
and costs re education and demand to follow the rule
Mayor: have a question?
Sop: what if we don't meet it in May?
re creeks and top of bank, needed a year, as Mr Jenkins
knows
do we have to meet the deadline and if not, are they going to
fine us?
Mayor: many of us can answer that.
Sokol: Bill 27 requires us to meet by May 2010
revise OCP ... try to meet deadline ... adopt when ready
Mayor: thank you for your presentation; put Item no 5 on the
floor
TP made motion above then said:
Sop: first of all
Mayor: first ask Cclr Panz
TP: wd like to add; take back to last Ccl
signed, work done when we understood, one of the last to
sign
this is complicated
cd easily incorporate into plan, others have done that, but the
WG is trying to come up with policies and they want to come up with
something that is viable and achievable
to answer, Cclr Sop, we are v concerned about that and why we are
waiting
Sop: from where I'm sitting there's a companion WG,
Transportation, and you've been to some of the mtg
We have Item 5 and it's followed up by Item 6 and basically the
same thing
Mayor: Item 5 from WG and Item 6 from staff on how we're going to
meet
Sop: so basically being asked how to do process and that's a
public consultation, then .....
Mayor: had thought WG wd be completed by March and now ...
Rodgers Crk is held up as an example so we're ahead
Sop: we're already doing what's in there
getting nervous about demands to ppl and their homes; public
aware of costs of what they have to do in their homes
Mayor: Bill 27 requires us to set targets; WG ...
ML: a bit concerned about time, WG report March then May bylaw
adoption
January is a difficult month to solicit public input
think I raised this at the last WG presentation
you need to come up with specific items, a, b, or c, for how to
make more efficient
TP: and that's what we're trying to achieve
when a WG comes with a recommendation, up to Ccl; same as sec
stes tonight
Sokol: important to note the OCP process and WG will be working
together
not as if OCP begins after the WG report... will be
informed and leading into ...
ML: remain concerned between reporting out and statutory
process v short
reflection and and debate time
Sokol: when we get there see if ready and if not, push back
OCP amendments; as long as we show making progress, prov will view
favourably ...
RECOMMENDED:
THAT the process for including greenhouse gas
reduction targets and policies in the Official Community Plan,
including a proposed public consultation program, as set out in the
November 27, 2009 report from the Community Planner be
approved.
TP: [made motion]
Mayor, looking at Sop: any further discussion, Ccl? are you
absolutely certain?
Sop: yes, well, just want to query the recommendation, whether it
has a double meaning, if in fact we're going to solicit change in
the OCP, the way this is written. Two questions being asked
here. One is that we're going to go through the process and the
other is that we're going to include the reductions, targets, and
policies in the OCP; wonder, no problem with due diligence.
As we focus on this and move along, asking for two specific
things here; my first wd be have a problem process, out of that,
receive the information, as you're stating it, wd come sometime in
June.
Why are we doing that?
Mayor: think this motion is about recommending a process
Sokol: yes
Mayor: that's intent; then outcome will come to Ccl
CARRIES
Already dealt with No 7 so No 8
8:30
RECOMMENDED:
THAT the report dated Nov 30 from the Dir/Finance
re "2010 Preview Assessment Roll" be received for
information.
RL: written review with impact
Ccl may recall prov froze assessment values for 2009 at 2008
rates
so this 2010 reflects two years of changes
residential prop value overall decreased by 8.68% on average,
between 2008 and 2010, and I hasten to note that decrease in value
will not result in a 8.68% reduction in prop taxes for 2010
we'll be going through an exercise to eliminate the effects of
the 2010 average market reduction; how we do that, as a first step
we'll recalculate the 2009 mill rate and we're doing that so that the
revised tax rate, multiplied by the new 2010 assessed value, will
equal the same tax amount as in 2009.
I'm sure I'm going to get questions on this.
It's what we call neutralizing the impact of the market value
change
Step Two, after that notional calculation is made, wd be to
increase that tax rate by whatever the percentage increase is that Ccl
announces that is required to balance the 2010 Budget, and that will
then establish a final tax rate for the 2010 Budget.
The final result shd be a 2010 prop tax bill that reflects
directly the tax rate increase driven by the the requirements of the
2010 budget so there shd be no impact at all from the market changes
on prop assessed values
having said that, there is an unfortunate complication in
these calculations, and that's referred to as assessment
skewing
Refers to fact market changes not constant throughout the
District, vary widely depending on type of housing, nbrhd, those kinds
of things. In WV, there are 35 nbrhds for assessment purposes,
and each one has its own average market change
Range of values, my report has a bar chart for each of the
assessment areas what that change has been
[eg] Eagleridge and Gleneagles had a market value reduction of
15.36%. OTOH, Wentworth, Cypress Bowl experienced an increase of
4.67%
An outlier, in the particular range of data, Brit Pacific
Highlands, Capilano Golf, had an extreme decrease in value of some
54.43% market change
Calculations I use to neutralize market impact, I only get to use
one number, one calculation, and that's to neutralize the effect of
8.68% reduction in market value, so any props either signif higher or
lower market change from 8.68% will have an add'l impact on their tax
bill, in addn to whatever Ccl decides is required to balance the 2010
Budget.
There are no mechanisms to deal with that skewing; the only
consolation, tend to even out over the longer term, just question is
if this is your year to have a signif impact
Indiv residential assessments will be mailed by Assessment
Auth first week of Jan
See notices; residents wd be interested -- see if notice not
in excess of what they think, may want to check, see if nbrs on their
street not out of line and if they think theirs is, consider appealing
b/c that will make up their taxes in May
that number drives what their taxes are
BC Assessment Authority website and you can appeal your
assessment on-line so wd encourage residents to view on-line
a lot of info, visit once get notice
MS: excellent report, Mr Laing, and everybody now shd be
crystal clear as to how their taxes going to be set; only small
criticism is that I think we shd mention the amt of the residents' tax
bill will be the amt of the tax increase or decrease that Ccl sets to
balance the budget for 2010.
Is that not correct?
{NOD}
There we go.
CARRIED 8:37
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Council acknowledge the preliminary
conclusions arising from infrastructure management studies on the
District's Utilities systems;
2. Council [support] an approach to 2010
Sewer and Water Utility rates that defers planned increases to
capital renewal budgets until 2011, in order to engage the public
with respect to long term infrastructure issues during the coming
year;
3. Staff be instructed to prepare
utility rate bylaws that incorporate increases in Metro Vancouver
regional sewer and water expenditures, allow for the municipal cost
share of sewer and water infrastructure stimulus projects, and reflect
increases in the contracts for garbage collection and recycling
services; and
4. The report from the Manager, Utilities
entitled "Utilities Infrastructure Management" be received for
information.
Mayor: our long-term thinking
RF: presentation; I'll be joined by John Madden
JM: Infrastructure -- what is it? [slide]
We're still in draft but results signif enough imp to bring forth
at this time
Infrastructure is the backbone of modern society: roads,
bridges,
this report is related about the utilities
WV unique from was laid out, topography, geology
Slide of 1960s, 1970s, 1980s; 2000s
most of the sanitary system built in 20 years; a lot will need to
be replaced in 20 years' time
a lot of infrastructure for few ppl --only 44K
in Vancouver 2 metres of watermain per resident, WV has 7
metres per
so utilities shd be 3.5 times all things being equal
Asset Mgmt in General
Infraguide devpd by fed govt
the six whats: what do we own, how much; ev replaced today what
cost; what's its condition, how much remaining; then develop when you
have to act on something, and last is how much is it going to cost and
when do you need to do it
We've been going through this inventory work, so bit of heads up
[slide]
roughly $300M in the three areas
Water Replacement Budget Projection [Slide]
wd need $4M a year over 100 years but right now we budget
$1M
Sanitary Replacement Budget Projection [slide]
similar but diff life span, spikes; use progs distribute by
probability; 50-year curve;
have $1M in our program, av over 100 years is $4M, more like
an av of $8 to $9M needed
Storm Drainage / Replacement Budget Project
smaller budget! we have about $400K in budget per year; and
looking about $4M per year ball park, and it's in the $7-8M per year
at its peak as well
lot of work to be done, results preliminary but in ball park
-- makes sense -- if you have $1B of infrastructure you have to
replace it once ev 100 years, that means 1% of $1B is $10M (per
year)
Our current budget is a little over $2M year, project need in
the range of $12ishM
will go up and down, a lot of work to try to ameliorate that to
do it as efficiently as possible but we're still in that ball park,
$10-14M per year, every year up to 100 years then you have to
repeat
Key Observations [slide] -- summary
water system installed over a longer range of time so it spreads
out
sewer in short period of time so spike will be
significant
storm and sewer a bit more time to prepare but for every year
we delay, will increase annual cost, that $8-9M gets higher
advantage to pay now vs later
do need more work on drainage inventory, condition
assessments
Asset Mgmt is a process not a project, will continue to do
forever from this point now
all our current capital budgets are insufficient for what
we're looking at right now
biggest gap is in water utility; that one is already in a
deficit point
sanitary and storm will quickly move into
deficit
Factors contributing to Utility Rate Increases
RF: considering in light of 2010 utility rate increases,
rate-setting exercise
looking at implications, recognized other factors contributing;
for 2010 already been summarized fore you
MetroV: indication for us regional sewer allocation, going to
go up 11%, that represents half a million dollars; the bulk treated
water rate is going up by 12%
although we haven't talked about it, garbage and recycling
another utility, service charge
Garbage and tipping -- been advised by MetroV going up 15%;
another our fees have to absorb
were successful with infrastructure grant applications but at
the same time there are M matching obligations and did not expect to
be so successful; fed govt desire to stimualate the economy, tight
deadline to complete -- within two years, and that means we have to
fund the M portion within two years
sewer project in Amb and water treatment project for residents
in Montizambert those represent $800K chunks for each, and wd hv to be
considered in sewer and water 2010 rates
solid waste, garbage, and recycling another charge
Ccl is aware the last of our contracts for these services
expired, and new contract with an open tendering process, we found
the rates for contracts for garbage and the yard trimmings colln have
gone up 75%, and recycling also gone up exponentially,
225%; was a correction in the market as well as the
market for recyclables went down
Implications to 2010 Utility Rates
Grouped Water, Sewer, and Solid Waste
If we .... SLIDE
20% water, 22% sewer, and 53% solid waste
we feel we need some time .... Public
second column, not wrapping up for this year and start in 2011
instead then:
water 14%, sewer 13%, solid waste 53% (b/c
contractual)
then looked at MetroV, part BCF (Build Canada/Infrastructure
Stimulus Fund projects); as John mentioned, water greatest need so
maybe some cut back in sewer side, so dampen that from 13% to 11%; Ccl
new contract for garbage/recycling, draw down reserve 35% but not
recommended by staff
Resident Bill Impacts
not easy to say; moved to metered water; how does it
translate?
impact to median sgl-fam home, so here's the slide for the three
scenarios (increase rates)
$103 if 31%; $117 if 29%; $73 if 53% /or/ $81 25%; $84 21%; $73
53% /or/ 81 25%, 77 19%, 49 35%
[middle one] $153 of that is to reflect the MetroV
increases
Success Stories
Ccl suggested staff bring forth bylaws; not all doom and gloom --
here's story in water
have seen dramatic drop in water consumption (Eagle Lake); see
graphs [slide]
Recommendations:
prepare 2010 utility rates to pass along MetroV rate increases,
include District's share of infra; neg solid waste and recycling
contracts
Defer acceleration of capital renewal budgets until 2011
use 2010 for educating, engaging public when reports
finalized
final state of the infrastructure report in spring
ME: for all the gloom, worthwhile take some credit for benefits
through Eagle Lake; wd you take that opp to say how we've
benefited
RF: next week's rate bylaw, we'll give a more
detailed
as a teaser, by devping Eagle Lake source there's been a net
benefit
cost-produced water lower than we wd be buying it from MetroV,
40-50% ourselves not having to be purchased as before
SW: wrt replacing and vast amts of money, have you looked to
other levels of govt?
JM: we'll make sure of any monies we can get; still need a lot of
our own funding
DWV is one, but this is common across Canada, US, and the world;
$133B in Canada alone
much as we'd like to have our govt pay (?) that's a lot of
money
Sop: if these astonishing figures we have to protect, where is
this going to come from fed? prov? tax? from residents of
WV?
still hear residents say bill wd be higher so...
where in the life of this Ccl -- where's the money coming
from?
lay out to 2050, pricing it out, we're still going to be
behind
onerous task and you to find ways and means ...
RF: same conclusions as
Sop: I knew you'd find it
RF: approach through utilities; had pay-as-you-go, perhaps
through a debt arrangement to smooth out the impacts
we as local govt need to be more entrepreneurial as other rev
sources, such as Sweden
staff is cognisant of big burden
ML: we shd be setting aside $10M a year and we're not; all
right things, 33.3 cents taking advantage of other levels
govt
if there's anything that's at the core is that residents expect
water and toilets will flush
credit to you guys
now that we know have to address it
may mean we have to prioritize nice-to-have and
must-do
CAO: the costs we're going to be facing with MetroV and their
utility costs, staggering; will force us to use, as in the Swedish
example, ...
going to force us to be more entrepreneurial
congratulate staff, looking at this now so we can adopt
strategies, look at being more entrepreneurial and new
technologies
we have to come forward with new formulas for
MS: don't know whether we're asking questions or debating
this--
Mayor: --exactly, motion?
[ML made]
MS: reality is this, what we're doing tonight, represents
extra $238 per householder and it's going to get worse
no point digging our heads in sand; will have to deal with it
and will; forced garbage maybe every second week
point I've made, I'll make, keep making, the demand for capital
is always endless and no Ccl can spend signif capital reserves without
a price being paid down the road
reality is for the last ten years in WV we've been on a wild
spending spree and it's really depleted our cap reserves and we have
all kinds of projects, including water, sewer, and infrastructure,
that need capital funding and we're not in the position that we need
to be in to fund those projects
We need, this Ccl, and ev Ccl for next 500 years, must make
sure that whatever capital we spend, we find a way to replace --
another revenue source, real estate devts, or whatever it is
if it doesn't happen, we just keep passing the problems down
the road
had my say, will shut up
Sop: same old story, isn't it
TP: sgl-fam nbrhds cost more in service, am I hearing that?
Maybe we have an argument here for looking at increased
density in certain parts of the cmnty; and also, looking at Rodgers
Creek, it's stepping in a different direction -- no longer a sgl-fam
nbrhd, it's multi-fam, and I think that is a good shift b/c stresses
on our infrastructure are going to be contained
looking further, to developing the rest of the
mountainside,
{BPP must be basking in the glow of these comments!}
this is a perfect little graph to keep in mind when we look to
the future, how we put infrastructure in, type of, cost implications
of the life cycle of that nbrhd; old nbrhds and new nbrhds
Mayor: feel compelled to respond, and I think it's really good,
Ccl, that you have the courage to take the long view, and we've
invited staff to be v public about the challenges we all face.
in terms of recent spending on our infrastructure, for instance
with artif turf field that I can't imagine WV not having/wanting,
hugely benefiting by, we've set up a model so that capital is filling
in to replace it
wrt Cmnty Ctr, a third of funding from Coastal Health and we've
set up a non-profit society so it becomes hived off from govt
What we are doing as a Ccl is preparing ourselves to be smaller
on the hard things and develop the cmnty to take responsibility for
what makes living here worthwhile beyond basic
infrastructure
not easy; always the cmnty's prerogative to choose what to
spend
challenge is, and excitement, is that the assumptions of the 20th
century no longer apply in same way, and we are looking as to how do
we make our infrastructure work harder for us, how can we create
energy from our liquid waste mgmt system, we're piloting that for the
region b/c of working cohesively with NV in anticipation of replacing
our sewage treatment plant in a way that will be better
This compels us to take that seriously, not just for the
interest's sake {misheard?}, it's real.
As well, empowering households to take charge of their costs --
becoming energy efficient and using less water
I think we shd all be outraged about the price of the garbage
contract. It's absolutely ridiculous and ppl need to know that
those companies have a lock on our behaviour, and so it's a challenge
for us to change that behaviour or to accept that. So that's the
point that we're at, and I wd like to congratulate Ccl for having the
courage to put that in front of the public and take
responsibility.
Call the question.
CARRIES
RECOMMENDED:
THAT Council approve the expenditure of
$7,000 from the 2009 Road Capital Budget for the construction
and installation of four highway service and attraction signs for
Dundarave Village.
Brent Dozzi: main reason b/c considerable
construction
service and traction signs on 21st and 22nd St
only recently Ministry a bit more accommodating -- one is 2010,
wants WV to succeed and to take advantage of this opp
the second, and reason for the report, relax their policy --
we're v v close to meeting their reqmt, allow WV to proceed with signs
and long as WV pays
~ $9K discussion with CAO and DBA donation of about $3K
ME: Mr Dozzi mentions the authorities as being stringent, had
some difficulties getting signs for our stores along the hwy, achieved
in HBay, in Amb, and now Dund; I wd encourage we complete with fourth,
Caulfeild struggling a sign a few years ago taking down. All the
biz in Caulfeild constantly as, so when we ask for Dund we ask
Caulfeild signs be replaced
Mayor: all right with seconder?
Sop: adds to cost?
ME: was there, taken down, and never replaced
BD: that is part of the broader discussion
CARRIED
Mayor: congratulations, Brent and Dundarave
This item was deferred from the November 16,
2009 Regular Council Meeting.
RECOMMENDED:
THAT Council approve the establishment of a
District of West Vancouver Awards Committee that will ensure community
recognition in Heritage, Youth, Environment, and other program areas
deemed appropriate are effectively administered and celebrated year
over year.
BL, Dep CAO: to ensure recognition and not languish; this cmte
will maintain that
Mayor: always done a proper job, but just coordinating so it's
one evening
This item was deferred from the November 16,
2009 Regular Council Meeting. Council is not permitted to
receive any further submissions on this bylaw until after the bylaw is
adopted. This bylaw was the subject of a Public Hearing
held on October 5, and reconvened and closed on November 2,
2009.
RECOMMENDED: be read a second, and third
time.
Mayor: anything?
Sop: I've exhausted myself; ...visitations, [etc] but I think it
will flow as it goes
CARRIED
Council is not permitted to receive any
further submissions on this bylaw until after the bylaw is adopted.
This bylaw was the subject of a Public Hearing held and closed on
November 16, 2009.
RECOMMENDED: be read a second, and third
time.
MS: think everyone in cmnty has concern about sec stes but no one
is building rental apts but there are a lot of ppl who want to live
here and want to rent, a lot want to rent, a lot of older ppl want to
rent
a lot of suites, when in-law stes empty want to rent
ensuring stes safe and proper to live in; pass this and trust
staff will ...
SW: completely concur; they're here, they're necessary; for ppl
to be able to afford a mortgage; to legitimize and make them
secure/safe ...
ML: we also have the bylaws and charges so part of 14 or
13?
Mayor: 14 fees and 13 policy; this does not concern fees
themselves, shd I come back to you?
ML: 14
TP: new, go back to policy; on p 42, residents think
key concerns, housing affordability and choices and last two
cclrs ...
with sec stes in discussing this with ppl in my nbrhd there are a
lot and I wdn't have guessed b/c it hasn't affected the
character
good work out of Housing Dialogue, fully support
clarification re parking; frustration b/c of inflexibility; my
concern with these parking reqmts
mom, dad, kid, four cars; one car home with one car for sec
stes
bus stop 200ft, I cdn't get down my stairs with 200ft!
looking for some flexibility, transportation strategy and climate
action, putting cars before ppl
Sokol: one of the big issues; parking may not be an issue in all
nbrs but many
tend to be blunt instruments
maybe you can apply for a DVP, cannot provide or doesn't make
sense, Ccl can say do not have to proved parking space
Staff will commit to reporting back to Ccl on a quarterly basis,
registering stes, situations that don't make sense; can be
flexible
can guarantee 100s of stories and each different
we'll find some situations where it make sense to come back to Cc
and if to amend we'll do that as well
Sop: staff have told us between 3 and 6000 stes; what has been
the impact?
{I've even been told it's more than 6000 and virtually no
houses are being built without a secondary ste.}
we've said maintain boulevard; say provide a surface not hard;
you can have two lodgers today and no problem
..... send out for safety, Fire Dept, for any individ; so to
encourage those folks coming forth, No 1, an addn and an increase b/c
it can be anywhere in the cmnty
Second, what wd be the impacts of that in relationship to having
an area that wd be a no-go zone?
are we indirectly allowing other things livability and change
selling ourselves short and the impact on WV
if 50K ppl by 2021, if we go beyond it; scenarios affecting our
cmnty
what about impact of taxation, assessment
when we look at all the things coming down there will be an
impact, shortsighted changes in our cmnty
ME: the suite shall have a sep front entrance wch shall not face
the street
many houses have basement entrances that fact the street and sec
stes ...
any opp for flexibility there?
will existing houses be grandfathered where legal or illegal or
in-law ste where door faces the street; a bit difficult chopping
up
Sokol: the way the bylaw is written now, the sec must be an
exterior entrance we wd not have flexibility; easier to enforce on a
new ste but reason put in was to make sure house appear a sgl-fam
home
Ccl can delete this
Mayor: say shd not; say for those that exist
Sokol: shd is {too vague???}
Mayor: 6B under Schedule 4 be taken out
ML: if you take out the reqmt then are we defaulting to a sgl
entrance .....
Sokol: still have provision must be a sep exterior entrance
Mayor: amendment carries
Sokol: there are two amendments staff wd like to recommend
Mayor: speaking order first
ML: similar question about an existing non-conforming ste
some leeway there? situations, such as parking becoming an
issue
don't want it to become an admin issue but it already is
fees, coming, ? like what's the fine, how enforced, will talk to
next item
part of the rev is the assessment revision
not sure if I was putting in a sec ste I wd be running to
Assessment Auth saying look at me
Sokol: BC Assessment is aware of new addns and we'll make them
aware; up to them to change assessment
ML: fine?
Sokol: first try to get them to come in a legalize; but for
any noncompliance, Staff can fire up to $300 a day
Mayor: think we're just discussing stes themselves and
reqmts?
ML: looking at 14 I see 300 and one 50th ???
Sokol: fine $300 a day is already in the bylaw
ML: not on p 17 so I don't know
philosophically, we have something that's non-conforming; how do
we address that?
asking them to come into program? two years from now? giving
period to own up?
I go to park and ride, see fine for dumping garbage is
$10K--
Mayor: getting off topic, right on, how we successfully implement
this prog; but now policy and deal with that in Item 14
touch on those? cd ask for staff report to come back so leave
that
anything else on issue of stes themselves
Sop: I asked several questions in my delivery and didn't get an
answer to any one of them
Mayor: about indirectly allowing a negative impact?
Sop: that and--
Mayor: from a rental position?
Sop: fees to cover costs, hire fulltime employee?
Mayor: that's Item 14
Sokol: a few questions you alluded to
no 1: wd allow sec stes throughout the M, there already are
no 2: building on other Ms that have tried to locate in some
nbrhds, generally, lesson clearer and better throughout M
re recovery of costs, better discussed in Fees and Charges
Mayor: totally in favour, priority of last Ccl, but cdn't get
to it without Housing WG
don't know if Ccl is aware but the FCM has published a policy
paper, seven success stories across Canada for cmnty involvement in
housing issues, WV's Cmnty Dialogue on Nbrhd Character was one of
them, in particular b/c residents supported the need to legitimize
after a v thorough process
that's pretty good, not an easy issue, congratulate WG for doing
such a great job in such an important way, being recognized
We also won a BC Planning award for that work
My concern is some of these parking things. I cdn't park in
my own house according to these guidelines, and Cclr Panz makes a good
point, some of the places that have the most character needn't be
carved up into add'l parking places, if it's not needed -- I
understand if it is.
It cd be, families, whose chn have moved out, have much fewer
{?} cars and maybe want to have a ste.
I don't understand why it isn't my prerogative if I have a
three-car garage, to have one of those spots for a tenant, why not
allowed to do that?
and why wd the govt regulate whether or not I need to manoeuvre
cars in my driveway?
wondering how you can create zoning bylaw with some policy
suggestions that aren't so hard and fast, or is that just not
possible?
Sokol: general if zoning bylaw, it's hard and fast, black and
white
what we really tried to look at, tried to err on side of
ensuring sufficient parking
felt if homeowner had car parked in garage and tenant parked
in driveway, pretty quickly owner wd say, want you parking on the
street
that's how it evolved; park so not block other
{Right on, Sokol and Planners. No doubt owners wd not
want tenants to park on their own property if they can avoid it b/c wd
cut into their yard space, no? Then the problem is shoved onto
the other sgl-fam owners who have provided for cars to be parked on
their property and with tenants parking on streets, many streets in WV
have become single-lane streets with cars parked on both sides of the
street -- a great inconvenience and impediment, particularly to fire
engines!
It's not our, other residents', problem, it's a situation
the prop owner earning income from a sec ste shd
resolve.}
for most who have a two or three-car garage, wdn't share
Mayor: can share my house but not my garage?
Sokol: that's where it came from
Mayor: wd be a shame to have something not workable ...
I'd like to suggest taking out 8D
{TP seconded}
MS: with house and ste shd hv a second
eliminate all ... from three down
garage, one for
Mayor: stays in, two for homeowner, and one for tenant
Amendment?
PASSES
Mayor: and 200ft?
Sokol: when you move from 400 to 200, no other M has a limitation
on from bus stop
reluctant to go to 400 exemption b/c reluctant
might recommend start with 200ft and come back in first quarterly
recommend expanding it maybe
Sokol: re parking in Section C; must be constructed of pervious
materials; way this is already wd have to; add clause except MUST,
unless parking space already on lot
CARRIED
Sokol: new section, Part 7, we're recommending 7.1 effective date
of Feb 1st 2010 so staff can get the word out
Mayor: this is getting into discussion Cclr Lewis getting
into
ML: ambitious doing over Christmas
you lumped us with the oil tanks so
{referring to the backlash}
Mayor: do it at third reading; we're kind of getting caught
up
Sokol: date is not that have to drop off that day and start
enforcement
that's when we start getting the info out starting that day;
having a six-month window for ppl to start bringing in their
applications
at the end of the six months start ratcheting up the
enforcement
{having breather good}
SW: Feb; Olympics starting, schools out, ppl distracted; gives
you more time as well
to be effective, strategy so ...
Mayor: you're saying Dec 31st too soon
Ms Scholes cd we come back? need that in
SSch: there is not a section of effective date, then becomes
effective at adoption
can be added at fourth reading...
Sop: if things not quite right in a year or so, presumptuous of
me to look at sec stes, report to Ccl, what is wrong shd be amended,
or always done by complaint?
Sokol: staff's intention hope not much wrong, but cd be things
that we improve the bylaw and we'll bring forward information to Ccl
suggesting to support those improvements
Mayor: Second reading; Passed
SSch: That wd be: Carried as amended
Mayor: thank you
MS moves third reading: ...as amended
Mayor corrects number he read: 4617
MS: okay, whatever it is, as amended
Mayor: do we say amended?
SSch: it was amended at second reading
PASSED
[9:56 -- ML moved; till end of biz or we fall asleep]
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. ... as attached to the report from the
Director of Planning Lands and Permits dated October 23, 2009, and as
attached to this report dated November 30, 2009 be amended to include
a First Licence Fee of $615 for a secondary suite and a renewal fee
of $465; and
2. ... be read a second, and third
time.
Sokol: ... by reviewing Rodgers Crk, possible to
estimate
comes up to $440 per resident, total cost is approx $660
basically able to do analysis, a sec ste wd result in $395 of
add'l rev due to increased assessment, participation in rec progs,
licences and fees
this sets a range of fees in order to cover costs, up to
$660
fee wd be set to balancing costs and public govt
rental and housing variety
$150 first and $300 annual
staff was recommending WV shd subsidize, many Ms don't charge
anything
recovering full costs wd be a fee up to $660, question of
balancing
discussion Ccl shd have
Mayor: this a substantial discussion, wd like to hear from Ccl,
late;maybe leave to next week
SW: move this be referred back to staff for
recommendations
Mayor: fill in the blanks
SW: in the hopes of bringing ppl out to register the
grandfathered stes, think the $615 is too high, intimidating that high
a fee; think the renewal fee of $465; again you don't want to
discourage ppl from coming forward
{first, will $600+ be too high compared with the
fine?
shdn't they want to come forward to make it legal (in the
best of all possible worlds)?
They've been making the extra moolah for years so of course
they're reluctant to come forward and gather in less
moolah.
Our taxes paid for their services -- next to safety, that's
why at the PH, most spoke in favour of regulating.}
shd be cost recovery, not rev generator, goes against social
benefit sec stes offer, and it's like a double tax on ppl
{but they're paying nothing now so pls
explain!!!}
a lot of more interesting ways to create revenues for the
District rather than going after the homeowner.
one of the biggest questions I have is the wages for the three
staff; think they're exorbitant -- $62K plus benefits for clerical is
ridiculous, $85K for inspector; far too much
this is a new opp to legitimize stes, do wisely
ppl staying in these homes to help with mortgage, think of
them, not as a cash grab
Sop: hardly a tax grab, 12 into $600+ it's ~$50 a
month
av income $16K to $20K a year for indiv who has those
stes
for any biz there are costs, certainly going to be other
costs -- insurance, safety, liability... fee to upgrade
maybe that first year's going to be a little heavy but successive
years then not heavy outlay of cash
I think this will catch on, with other things will have quite an
impact on this cmnty
better start doing our due diligence
back to assessment; yes probably an increase in assessment, part
and parcel, will be increase in their value
{one of the problems -- sec ste prop goes up and owner's
making money, sgl-fam home goes down with quality of life (traffic,
parking, use of services, etc)}
when you look at overall costs we wd provide, fee and taxation,
is that truly going to give us full coverage of expectation, in
strategic planning?
you heard costs of infra we heard tonight
what portion if landlord foots bill, that $1500 a month [rent]
what portion wd be for infrastructure
Sokol: think most prop owners wd pass whole fee on to
tenant; it's the cost of running a biz
earlier hearing about infra costs, WV spread out, cost of
utilities higher, this is a way of gentle density, getting infill,
adding residents where water, utilities etc, already are
that's why ppl surprised cost attributed for each sec stes so
low, we're not adding maintenance
in Rodgers Crk there were costs attributable, increasing kms of
roads, of park
we're just looking at adding 1.5 residents -- $660 per ste -- is
that 100% on target? no, but it's ball park
Mayor: referred to staff, but you're in favour?
Sop: yes, more from last suggested
ML: important we have that discussion now, will come up with
laneway and coach housing; any if it doesn't have a second
address
when I look at costs to run our M, our general services $75M and
our gen capital of $24M
it's roughly $100M, well 44K or 16K tax folios pay for that
..that's why we have roads, infrastructure, etc
works out roughly $6K a tax folio a year, that's what it costs
to live here!
don't understand rationale and justification adding housing
stock, an apartment within a home, without that entity making its
contribution to the cmnty? -- why shd 44k residents or 16K tax
folios carry the burden for that?
This Rodgers Crk study, real interesting but obviously
written by a real estate devpr
everything incremental, don't have to build another cmnty
ctr then it has no cost, well, that's not reality -- support this,
great idea, alternative we need, but I don't believe we have the right
to burden every other resident in this cmnty simply so someone can
pull in market-based rent for a ste in their home
don't know the answer, been mulling it over, but somewhere
between nothing, wch is basically the fee structure, b/c with any
sensitivity analysis if we don't get the sign-up rate you're looking
at, we blow that, and don't even recover our cost for the added
staff
but somewhere between what I pay as a sgl-fam resident tax folio,
what a commercial person pays for his biz, and what an apartment owner
pays for an aptmt building, seems to me to be where we shd be
looking
Otherwise I see this as a drag financially on every other
resident in the cmnty, the only one benefiting from a fiscal
perspective is prop with a sec ste in his house
wd like more analysis; sorry, don't accept argument that if Bby
or NV doesn't do it, that's the right answer
don't think it's going to go away, and the more and more
non-contributing residential units you have is going make burden on
the remaining tax folios that much greater
not in favour, like to see them reviewed with more realistic
analysis of what costs are
TP: trying to develop a good housing policy
my concern is that putting this on, no one's going to come
forward, back where we started
{ridiculous -- they'd give up the income or risk a fine?
ruddy unlikely!
Not only that, I'd like to think most WV residents want to
do things safely and legally.
Maybe that's not what the ppl who've talked to her
want........}
we subsidize lots of things; don't view this as
subsidizing
{but it is! Several have said sgl-fam homeowners are
fed up with landlords getting income and not paying their fair
share!}
this is adding richness to our cmnty
{well, those collecting the rents, not the rest of us
paying for their services.....}
and social capacity to our cmnty, and yes, if want to look at
it, in the dollars, sure, but I think if we're looking at it in a
sustainable way, we can't just cherrypick that out of it, piece of the
puzzle
{yes, it can do that too but that doesn't negate
subsidizing}
sure, if ppl come forward and have legal ste, the assessment will
go up -- not going to be enough for some cclrs -- they'll have to
declare this as revenue so they will be paying taxes at the prov and
fed level. It's not like ppl are off the hook here, I know that
doesn't satisfy some ppl around the table, but I think our intent here
is to get affordable housing, maintaining nbrhd character, add some
social capacity, and if we charge too much, my concern is no one's
going to come, so we won't be needing to hire anybody to look after
it
{but the fees are way below what monthly rent is!
Just look at Craig's list!}
MS: even though time I shd be in bed
I agree philosophically with what Cclr Lewis said
fees, if staff come up to Joe Blow or Helen you've got a ste
here, first of all get rid of tenant, immediately close ste down and
there goes fees
practically speaking basically $9 a week based on $465 annual
fee; nobody can argue not a reasonable fee; want ppl to come
forward
we hire staff, pay them fairly, and run the District -- staff
has wrestled with this, came forward with a sound report,
sensible, and now seven ppl throwing darts
why not start off and do something novel, follow the staff
report?
we hire professional advice, suggest take it, leave as
presented
Mayor: motion on floor to go back to staff
how to move forward -- maybe in a year I might not have an issue
with this
I know when we did it in NV, we took that first year; said pls
allow Fire Dept, clean bill; a shame to say just forget it
always an ongoing system; can see all points of view
my concern is defeated, then we're nowhere, so don't think
there's any harm even in bringing back the same motion.
good discussion, questions
a little late to come up with as sophisticated an approach as we
wish
think we want a bit of information on implementing this -- have
you enough to bring back next week
Sokol: next week a bit diff
Mayor: new year? don't think that has a serious impact
Sokol: hadn't intended to implement until Feb or Mar anyway
realize as I wrote it not clear, $62K is salary AND benefits and
both for Inspector too
Mayor: all of Ccl will wonder if not on contract, not on
books
ME: the fees are counterproductive as I see it, got to ensure ppl
to register
sure it wd be nice for full cost recovery
may collect from 600 or 1000 stes, wch we don't get at all
steep curve, more than nothing at all
got to take this on a steadier basis than jumping in at the deep
end
assume all rented at $1500, a lot far less, as little or as low
$400 or $500, and if you burden those ppl with that sort of cost,
going to make it difficult
{anyone charging that low rental is by choice doing a
favour...... doesn't mean the rest of us have to}
Mayor: refer to staff; will come back first of new year
CARRIES
DEFERRED
RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first, second, and third
time.
{...see comments in last issue, WVM26. Read memo/report.
}
MS: as a point of order shd not be dealing with this after 10pm
after six hours and in my case nine and a half
RL: as long as adopted by Dec 31
DEFERMENT PASSED
RECOMMENDED: ... as attached to the report dated
Nov 23 from the Mgr of Legislative Services be approved.
PASSED
18. Appointment of Acting Mayors for 2009/2010 (File:
0120-01)
RECOMMENDED: THAT Acting Mayors for 2009/2010 be
appointed as follows:
December/January: Councillor Soprovich
/ February/March: Councillor Evison
April/May: Councillor Walker /
June/July: Councillor Lewis
August/September: Councillor Smith
/ October/November: Councillor Panz
PASSED
19. Metro Vancouver Board and Committee Appointments
(File: 0185-01) WITHDRAWN
20. Appointment of Ccl Representatives to
Boards/Committees (File: 0115-01)
WITHDRAWN
CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS
21. Consent Agenda Items - Reports and
Correspondence
Item 22 - Support for the UBCM Grant:
Healthy Food and Beverage Sales, Phase 4
Item 23 - Development Variance Permit
Application No. 09-003 (6165 Gleneagles Drive)
Item 24 - Development Variance Permit
Application No. 09-038 (1313 Fulton Avenue)
Item
25 - Correspondence List.
SSch: item 24 has been withdrawn
REPORTS FOR CONSENT AGENDA
RECOMMENDED: THAT West Vancouver District Council
support the WV Community Center applying to the Union of BC
Municipalities (UBCM) for a Healthy Food and Beverage grant in the
amount of $7,500 and to provide overall grant and financial
management for same.
RECOMMENDED: to allow an existing dwelling
with a third storey and a covered deck to be retained, will be
considered on Monday, January 11, 2010.
{does that mean they were built without a
permit???}
RECOMMENDED: to allow an existing dwelling
with an addition to the main floor and basement, will be considered on
Monday, January 11, 2010.
{again, 'existing' so built without a permit??? but
withdrawn?}
CORRESPONDENCE LIST FOR CONSENT AGENDA
MS: I'd like to discuss Item 1
25. Correspondence List
(File: 0120 24)
Referred to
Director of Parks and Community Services for consideration and
response.
MS: quote: xxx
none less hospitable in the Salish Sea
pointing out no facilities for transient boaters to tie up and
spend money in our M
hope staff will consider casual moorage or at 14th so attract
visitors
Mayor: not sure of best way to follow up
CAO: Cclr Smith brought this to our attention and future devt of
Amb we'll take this into consideration
Sop: b/c one person writes in, we have just experienced one of
the most unique things
ferry fits this cmnty
adjustments as we go; will not support boaters {something
about polluting Amb beach}
we spent years purchasing [waterfront; don't want putting] oil
into our swimming area
out HBay .. won't have a working marina out there
there are places for boat moorage but that won't be one of
them
-------------
Guess no surprise no comment on this
one........
Referred to Mayor and
Council for consideration and response.
{Adherence: This is wrt notification and openness of
mtgs -- an issue touted but subject to abuse/overuse of
closure.}
26. REPORTS FROM MAYOR/CCLRS
Mayor:
next week?
27. PUBLIC QUESTIONS/COMMENTS
> Ralph Beltz (sp?): 4405 MDr; sent a letter, got the
acknowledgement back a couple of days later
Oct 30th and got a thing Nov 3rd, how cd that happen so
quick
SSch: ack cards are sent out when corresp received Friday; sent
out
Mayor: then Mr Beltz's letter on agenda
SSch: not on regular
RB: received for info -- how cd they do that; agenda for next
mtg, so week or two
SSch: my recolln went to Nov 2nd closed mtg of Ccl
RB: but on your website, says agenda comes out Thurs
making up on a Wed; on Friday how cd it be included on a mtg
Mon?
presumably three or four days to consider; how that got
short-circuited?
Mayor: don't think it did; goes on
RB: [did?]
Mayor: perhaps cd follow up later
SSch: my recolln that was an on table
RB: can I ask another question? who wd hv told Clerk to put on
closed mtg
Mayor: usually public, some closed
RB: mine is a trivial matter
Clerk doesn't know me; none of the cclrs know me
Mayor: don't know the details but happy to talk about after the
mtg
> Richard Lambert: re oil tanks -- commend pro-active
campaign
inundated; main reason, even though angry residents; think you've
done a fabulous job
....directed other Ms to follow your course of action
keep looking at it; pro-active stance cleaning up the envmt
have seen substantial habitat fish loss b/c of
contamination
congratulations; good job at spearheading in that direction
Mayor: thank you. The Fire Chief and I write a letter of
apology for a heavy-handed approach but in right direction think we
have created a space so ppl can take their time to do the right thing
and work in collaboration with the Fire Dept. We're still
receiving a lot of calls but think the letter will help.
MS: shd make a quick differentiation between the not-in-service
tanks and the tanks still in service, as long as ppl still have tanks
and they're using the tanks, and they're enjoying the benefits of
safe, comfortable, warm oil heating.
{LAUGHTER from those who know Cclr Smith owns an Esso/oil
distribution company.}
Mayor: thank you very much; the heritage of WV
No one else want to speak? then Cclr Smith, motion to
adjourn
28. ADJOURNMENT
===== CCL AGENDA Dec
14th =====
1. Approval of December 14, 2009 Regular Council Meeting
Agenda
2. ADOPTION OF MINUTES -- No
items.
DELEGATIONS
REPORTS
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Proposals to undertake housing pilot projects
at 2614 Ottawa Avenue and 6801 Hycroft Road be selected as
"pilot projects" for 2010; and
2. Staff proceed to advance the Housing Pilot
Program including working with proponents of the two selected pilot
projects to initiate required development applications.
RECOMMENDED: be introduced and read a first, second and third
time.
RECOMMENDED: be read a first, second, and third
time.
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Solid Waste utility fees be
increased for 2010 to the amounts set out in Schedule A as
attached to the report dated Nov 5 from the Manager, Engineering
Services;
2. ...Amendment Bylaw be introduced
and read a first, second, and third time.
{Wait till you read the above report!
"...solid waste user fees for sgl-fam homes will rise
to 53% to $211.80 (net of discount), while multi-fam homes will
experience a 119% increase to $61.43 per unit (net of
discount)."....
Staff recommend a rate revenue increase of 63% be approved
for 2010...
[my abbreviations; look at rate increases for water and
sewer in next two agenda items]}
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Water Utility fees be increased for
2010 to the amounts set out in Schedule A as attached to the report
dated Nov 23 from the Manager, Engineering
Services;
2. ... Amendment Bylaw be introduced and
read a first, second and third time.
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Sewer Utility fees be increased
for 2010 to the amounts set out in Schedule A as attached to the
report dated Nov 23 from the Manager, Engineering
Services;
2. ...Amendment Bylaw be
introduced and read a first, second, and third
time.
RECOMMENDED: THAT
1. Road ... Dedication Bylaw be read
a first, second, and third time in short form;
2. Council authorize staff to
issue statutory notices of Road Closure and Removal of Highway
Dedication Bylaw 4626, 2009 setting February 1, 2010 as the deadline
for written and oral submissions.
11. Appointment of Ccl
Representatives to Metro Vancouver Board/Cmtes for 2010
(File: 0185-01)
Information to be provided.
12. Appointment of Council Representatives to
Boards/Committees for 2010 (File: 0115-01)
Information to be provided.
13. Appointments of Citizens to Boards and Committees for
2010 (File: 0115-01)
Information to be provided.
14. Change to Council Meeting Schedule
(File: 0120-01)
RECOMMENDED: THAT a Special Ccl Mtg be scheduled for Friday,
Dec 18, at 8:30am ...
BYLAWS for ADOPTION
This bylaw was the subject of a Public Hearing
held on October 5, 2009 and reconvened and closed on November 2,
2009. Council is not permitted to receive any further
submissions on this bylaw until after the bylaw is
adopted.
This bylaw was the subject of a Public Hearing
held and closed on November 16, 2009. Council is not
permitted to receive any further submissions on this bylaw until after
the bylaw is adopted.
CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS
17. Consent Agenda Items - Reports and
Correspondence
RECOMMENDED: THAT the Consent Agenda items 18 to 24 be
approved
REPORTS FOR CONSENT AGENDA
RECOMMENDED:
THAT the M Clk give notice that proposed DVP for 1313 Fulton
Avenue, to allow an existing dwelling with an addition to the main
floor and basement, will be considered on Monday, January 11th,
2010.
RECOMMENDED:
THAT the M Clk give notice that proposed DVP for 4726
Woodvalley Place, to allow construction of an addition to an existing
dwelling and to retain a non-complying shed, will be considered on
Monday, January 25th, 2010.
RECOMMENDED: be received for information.
RECOMMENDED: be received for information.
RECOMMENDED: be received for information.
RECOMMENDED: be received for
information.
CORRESPONDENCE LIST FOR CONSENT AGENDA
24. Correspondence List
(File: 0120 24)
Requests for Delegation -- No items
presented.
Action Required
Referred to Director of Engineering and
Transportation for consideration and response.
No Action Required
Previously distributed due to timing of the
event.
Responses to Correspondence
-- No items.
Responses to Questions in Question Period
-- No items.
25. REPORTS from MAYOR/CCLRS 26. PUBLIC
QUESTIONS/COMMENTS 27. ADJOURNMENT
=== BEERWATCH ===
Space Beer: "The beer was made
with grains descended from barley that spent five months in the Zvezda
Service Module on the International Space Station. The very limited
results, just 250 precious six-packs, will be sold through a lottery for
10,000 yen ($110) each. But only people living in Japan are eligible.
Sigh." from
http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/12/barley-space-space-beer/
=== NEWSWATCH ===
First a bit of background info, some words by Tony Blair on site,
removal of pylon even though pylons along settler-only road. I'm
amazed still committed to peaceful resistance though so deliberately
deprived of electricity and water -- how cd we live without them or
such restrictions?
=== BOOKWATCH
=== love qtns and
words?
* GROTHE: Last issue I referred to Dr Mardy Grothe's
new book wch you can buy from Amazon or your local bookstore.
His website is www.drmardy.com and his books: "Ifferisms:
An Anthology of Aphorisms That Begin with the Word 'If'" (2009);
"I Never Metaphor I Didn't Like" (2008);
"Viva la Repartee" (2005); "Oxymoronica:
Paradoxical Wit & Wisdom" (2004); and "Never Let a
Fool Kiss You or a Kiss Fool You" (1999).
* GARG: See www.wordsmith.org and subscribe to A Word A Day.
Books: A Word A Day,
A Romp through Some of the Most Unusual and
Intriguing Words in English; Another Word A Day, An All-new
Romp through Some of the Most Unusual and Intriguing Words in
English; The Dord, the Diglot, and an Avocado or Two, The
Hidden Lives and Strange Origins of Common and Not-So-Common
Words.
=== MAIKU ===
2009 Dec 14
crisp chill in the
air / contrast turns thoughts to / the joy and warmth of
Christmas
=== QUOTATIONS/PUNS
===
Remember that not getting what you want is sometimes a wonderful
stroke of luck.
--
The Dalai Lama
Life is a foreign language; all men mispronounce it.
--
Christopher Morley, US journalist (1890 - 1957)
Afghanistan is where empires go to die.
ANONYMOUS (caller), Susan Swain (moderator), Washington
Journal (morning television call-in and interview program),
C-SPAN, 25 November 2009.
*** A PUNDERFUL
CHRISTMAS -- courtesy of Richard Lederer ***
1 = What do you call it when
your Christmas tree explodes?
2 = What's the difference
between a one-winged angel and a two-winged angel?
3 = What do you call a holy man
bereft of change?
4 =
and a quiet mediaeval armour-wearer?
5 = What does Santa Claus do
with his three gardens?
1) O
Tannenbomb
2) It's a matter
of a pinion
3) Saint
Nickleless
4) Silent
Knight
5) Hoe, hoe,
hoe
